Let’s open a can of worms…

With Universal Audio’s shift to native processing and somewhat decline in the marketplace in terms of market share, what are your thoughts on the future for UA?

My personal experience as a beginner was wonderful. They had an Apple-esque ecosystem of products that I loved as they were ‘the thing’ to have. But as I’ve developed, grown and moved away from UA I’ve certainly fallen out of love with it. I don’t see a scenario where I’d go back… It just felt like endless workflow compromises due to issues with hardware and software.

It just seems like they’re becoming increasingly irrelevant. Their plugins were actually mostly Brainworx et. al., there are much better alternatives for converters, and their hardware is extortionate in price and extremely limited in selection. And LUNA? Well… that’s not exactly a success.

That being said, I’d LOVE to see UA 500-series modules. Frankly I’m shocked this isn’t already in action with units like the Cranborne 500R8 really cementing that setup into the prosumer market. I’d also love to see a greater range of classic hardware reissued at sensible prices (bring back the LA3A!). I genuinely see this as one of the only avenues left for the company to continue to compete, so I’m excited to see what NAMM holds because it takes a lot to essentially kill off your biggest money maker.

What does everyone else thing? What would you like to see? What do you dislike? What issues have you faced?

Remember how Aristotle said people always get the rulers they deserve? They get the gear companies they deserve too.

UA is doing fine. Their shift to native plugins will increase their market share. People have asked for native UAD plugins for years..well, here they are. Smart move. They acquired Townsend Labs. Meaning more profit. Their lower-cost interfaces sell well.

Here's the thing. The future isn't in selling to old studio
boffins who already have spent their money on expensive stuff. It's in selling to young people on a budget, many of whom are just starting out producing music. UA doesn't care what you think..they aren't marketing to you anymore.

I've used UAD since version 1. Bought PCI cards and Apollo interfaces. Bought most of their plugins, most of which I use in every single project. Never had a "workflow issue". UA has made my music production life easier. I don't foresee needing much from them anymore, but I'm 70, not 25, and I've had my shot.

I don't think they're going out of business anytime soon, a reason to shift from hardware based to native is that chips have improved exponentially so native processing makes sense - aka the new computers are soo much better that for UA to make more hardware it will be really expensive and it may not be as capable as a native mac - so that's likely the reason for the shift. It should result in better plugins and maybe even cheaper since you don't have to buy hardware - it's easier for them to make just the plugins.

Damn that's a lotta plugins. And they help you fool those silly guitarists!

I bet you’re music is awesome. Don’t let age be a barrier

I also agree as a long time user that they’re doing fine and will continually surprise us product wise. It’s a great brand going through some growing/expansion pains but thanks to good support, which I’ve always had, I’m sure it’s only upwards for them.

I think they will do just fine, however I don't own any UA stuff except an old UAD-1 that has been sitting in my closet for years. I figured out pretty early on it was a workflow killer for me, so I ditched it. Wait, I guess I will have to rely on them for support now since I own two Townsend Spheres. Hope that goes well...

i think we can leave it up to the manufacturers to think about how they can make enough money to prosper and thrive...

if they are healthy enough, they might even continue to care about and to cater for the analog enthusiasts!

you mean the boffins?

call them any way you like...




p.s. there are also 'audio boffins' who don't give much about analog gear! ;-)

You are one of them? You are the one whose advice I want building a home studio, if you have any on smaller scale gear. I just wanna capture the instruments in the room with as much as transparency and fidelity as possible, no saturation, leave the color to me. I don't care if its analog, digital, or Daniken's alien tech, whatever works. The room is fantastic. Mostly solo performances, I need very few channels.

well yes - or else i wouldn't have mentioned it...

i'll happily share my thoughts but this is definitely the wrong place! maybe you wanna start a new thread and get advice from a variety of contributors?


___


back to topic: i'm a regular user of uad's realtime rack and it's not going anywhere anytime soon - i wish they'd continue support though (in terms of which i consider anyone performing less well than rme sub-standard)...

Someone recently said UA was the Apple of the audio industry in that they're make well designed products, that appeal to a lot of users, they're generally high quality, but also overpriced. That's about right.

I don't think UA is finished or anything. I think we're going to see new ARM-based Apollo DSP interfaces that will be able to run a decent amount of plugins on the DSP with very low latency (at least for tracking) with the option to switch to native processing on the same plugin instance. That will be big. They'll probably also charge too much, have dodgy Windows drivers, and nowhere near the driver performance and lifespan of RME interfaces.

They'll also continue their push into the guitar market. The Ox Box dropped in price, there's probably a smaller competing product coming out (Ox pedal maybe), and more UAFX amps, which are honestly really good for modeling, but still "not totally there" IMO. But we'll see a UAFX Plexi and UAFX 800 at some point.

Spark will bring in steady revenue, but I do think subscription burn-out is going to be a thing in this industry. Particularly if there's a recession. Like ok...Cable (or similar streaming service), Netflix, HBO, Paramount+, Peacock, Amazon Prime, Adobe, NY Times, Washington Post, Patreon content creators, and now audio plugins? There's going to be a backlash against "subscription everything", especially once money becomes tight. But UA seems like they've got a diverse enough business [classic hardware, interfaces, guitar products, and plugins] where that won't kill them either. The subs are probably just a bonus to the balance sheet and another way to monetize what they already were planning on doing.

The other thing I think is going to plague the audio industry is when the folks who picked up music again as a hobby during COVID go back to what they were doing before Covid and re-drop the hobby. I see that impacting the guitar/pedal market the most. Kids will still get into audio and keep the software side of things going, but I do think the companies making guitars are going to be in for a long rough patch starting at some point in the next few years. The good news is that used prices will come back to reality for folks who stick with the hobby.

But no...I wouldn't worry about the death of Universal Audio in the short to medium-term. I think they're diversified enough to keep being successful. My advice to UA would be: hire an RME-level driver developer for Windows interfaces and pay them whatever they want, cut waste elsewhere (which it sounds like they already did laying off 10 employees recently). If the interfaces had the driver support/performance to compete with RME, they'd build up the same kind of fanatical user base that RME has. I don't buy interfaces often, but when I do, I'm only buying RME because of how great they work and how long they're supported.

I agree with Dave, I think we can safely estimate that UA will be around for a long time. Whether they stay relevant to professionals is another matter (I think they still will, regardless), but they seem to be very good at making money and acquiring other companies. I'm not crazy about their business behavior in general, and I won't get into that here, plenty of other threads about that. But as a business I think they'll be in good shape for the foreseeable future.

As Focusrite demonstrated, the key to making REAL money in the music business is to market to hobbyists and "prosumers." UA has effectively been doing that for years, but on a slightly higher end, with their Apollo line being useful to both hobbyists and "on-the-go" professionals. (Taylor Swift's former music director, for example, is a friend of mine, and brings his Apollo on tour to produce tracks in hotel rooms.)

When it comes to American culture, one of my least favorite quotes of all time – and one that's sadly accurate – is attributed to Calvin Coolidge: "The business of America is business." That is to say, the act of selling itself becomes more important than the actual art, craft, or service being sold. I, personally, hate it. I think artistry, craftsmanship, etc, should be prioritized above all else in business. When quarterly profits become more important than quality and competence, everyone except the very few at the top suffers. We'll see how things go for various music-related developers and manufacturers as they grow, but I'm always saddened by bottom-line-driven acquisitions and mergers.

IMHO the timing of the layoff of David Bock, was probably a tactical error by UA. I think it would have been to their advantage to at least keep him for a (much) longer term.
Chris

UA is a good company and they make good products. The only flaw I see is that they seem to have an issue with the way some of their products interface with the internet. The Ox Box seems to have issues and now they have their UAFX pedals that seem to have similar issues.

They will have to figure this out and address it - I am guessing they are working on.

That said, I'd love to try the UAFX pedals but the fact that they require a download of an app to either a cell phone or computer pretty much rules them out for me. I do not want everything in the world tied to my cell phone or laptop. Now, if they'd make it so their pedals can be dialed in by the knobs and buttons on the pedals without requiring an app to do it, then they will get more of my business. If the app was more of a convenience than a requirement I'd be jumping on their UAFX pedals for sure. I doubt they will redesign them for people like me though as we are the exception consumers. Sigh...

I own an Apollo and many of their plugins and they all work wonderfully. I'm done buying plugins so what matters to me is their ability to support my Apollo down the road. I'm now retired and on a struct budget so if the Apollo goes, that may put an end to my studio as I doubt I'll want to spend the money on purchasing a new interface. I'll have to see where things are at if and when that occurs.

I've heard good things about Luna but so far have shied away from using it. I do not want to put myself in a position where I need to purchase all their virtual instrument plugins.

https://www.uaudio.com/press/release...nds-leadership

Universal Audio Expands Senior Leadership Team for Next Phase of Growth

USA - English
Universal Audio (UA) is a pioneer in audio and music production tools, with a rich 60-year history of craftsmanship and innovation. (PRNewsfoto/Universal Audio, Inc)
NEWS PROVIDED BY
Universal Audio, Inc
Dec 08, 2022, 09:00 ET

-- Tech Executives Gordon Mattingly (CFO) and John Bigay (CRO) Join Longtime Audio Industry Leader Entering New Markets --

https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/re.../what-is-saas/

What is an SaaS.

SaaS transforms software from a product that's purchased — a commodity that you buy once and download to your device — into a service that's rendered: a set of capabilities that you subscribe to.

I’m done with UAD.

Gordon Mattingly — Chief Financial Officer

As UA's new Chief Financial Officer, Mattingly brings 20 years of multinational finance leadership experience in the consumer electronics and SaaS industries. Most recently he served as CFO for Arlo Technologies Inc. where he managed worldwide financial operations and helped deliver a successful IPO and spin-off from parent company NETGEAR.

John Bigay — Chief Revenue Officer
As UA's new Chief Revenue Officer, John Bigay joins UA with 15 years of executive-level tech marketing expertise, most recently serving as Chief Marketing Officer at iZotope, where he built their SaaS business, fortified channel partnerships, and grew revenue operations through their acquisition. Prior to iZotope, John was instrumental in the growth of companies including Lavastorm Analytics and Backupify.

I don’t think they’re going anywhere anytime soon, but in my opinion they’re being massively beaten at everything they do.

Their plugins are problematic and arguably devalued (in terms of brand perception) by the move to Plugin Boutique. The Ox Box gets slayed by the Waza Tube Amp Expander, their pedals are a solution without a problem, the Apollos are problematic and outdated technically with plenty of superior alternatives on the market, and LUNA wasn’t even a blip on the radar…

I’ve heard whispers from inside the UA camp for a while now that make me think a lot more pessimistically about their prospects, that’s all. Seems like they’re clinging onto the guitar market for dear life at this point. But unfortunately it does seem like quite a militant stance is generally received in response by their users, so rational discussions never really get off the ground. I’m really fortunate in the access I’ve had to their entire range of products - but there’s genuinely nothing of theirs that I’d buy now that I don’t.

Looks like the future is with companies like RND, Arturia, Softube, Acustica and other companies that focus on innovation.

Love Danny Kaye, Love and Own The Court Jester. Hmm, might be time to watch t again. :-)

And the wonderful Glynis Johns, never looked lovelier.
I hope she makes it well past her 100th Birthday, coming up in October.
Chris

Well I said a few months ago the future will be cloud - people won't be burning a hole in their carbon credit allowance with 1Kw space heaters known as PCs in 20 years time - It'll be small light energy efficient devices at the consumer end with all the heavy lifting done in the cloud.

If I wanted to study ecosystems I woulda become a marine biologist.

Somethin fishy goin on here. Beat ya to it Chris.

I can fathom it!
Chris

The UA press release tells me where they are headed and I’m not that interested. They own three iconic circuits. You’d think that they would build on that considering how much interest there is in outboard and hardware these days.

I do hope they succeed and thrive. UAD has been so good for pro audio and music. As much as Neve, API, Studer, Lexicon, Trident, EMI etc.

If this is indeed their new focus, they probably need to REALLY focus on making their plugs unquestionably exceptional. Softube and Acustica are so good at this point as are freeware like Variety of Sound (and others) - it make it hard to justify $300-400 a year for someone like me with 30 of their plugs already. But then again, young people starting out might be satisfied with this option as they have been conditioned to rent rather than own. And will have access to the entire library. But then again, they may find that they use 5-10 plugs a lot and that might have cost them $500 for a perpetual with an occasional payment for updates.

Older plugs could find new value with new innovation like perhaps proper controllers or some sort of clever approach. That’s the nut of it — what are new and clever ways to use this tech. Subscriptions seem like a tell that the well of new ideas is running low. Unison is brilliant, for example. Very clever. Or perhaps something incredible like a UA style board for Luna. This is the way forward in my view. But I do understand the need for reliable revenue to keep the doors open.

- their time based FX (verbs etc) aren't native in the main, and if they become so any time soon, I'd be surprised!

- the "apollos are problematic"? I've never heard anything like this, and they're probably the most common interface I see! I don't see a better interface on the market for what they do...

why would you be surprised?

A few reasons.

- they still need a USP. There's not much point keeping the stuff that's already native via Plugin Alliance DSP only - there is a point when it comes to their bespoke stuff (the AKG spring, the chambers, the 480 etc).

- some of those plugins still have quite a healthy demand on processing.

- to maintain the benefits of tracking through the plugins/with them on low latency monitoring, you need them available as DSP. So whilst some will almost certainly be added to the native pack, I'd expect them to keep some DSP only.

It's a trade-off - I avoid using UAD channel processing in the main because I don't want to run out of power - both for my verbs, but also meaning I have to switch to something else - so I'd love it if some of their comps etc became native.

It's funny - some are moaning about SaaS, some want Native primarily, some are happy with DSP-only...you're never going to please everyone! at the end of the day, plugin companies need an income stream and selling every plugin at $50 for perpetual updates isn't going to happen for companies of any size (yes I know Valhalla plugs are around this and I'm grateful for that - but notice how the company is still essentially one man!).