Trying not to compress the crap out of an uneven bass player. Any suggestions for keepin a level bass line volume?

Ed

Well if its played uneven , thats the way it is , so the only way to fix it is compress and Limit .

Not the only way.

Before you start with the squashing take some time doing careful volume automation.

After that a little gentle compression will go a long way.

+1 for this. overcompressing a bass track on the way in can easily ruin your entire multi-track.

+2!

Thanks guys. What do you guys think of the Waves Bass Rider in this situation? Something I should look into?

I have used Vocal Rider in the big studio and I must admit that it gets close to real fader riding.

The thing is......by doing it manually you are putting the human element back in. I personally would rather be the one responsible for getting my tracks sounding as musical as possible...rather than some admittedly excellent software.

Makes sense. Lol.

Ed

Limit transients (fast attack and release) so they're super even then compress hard (slow attack/release) to level out the RMS and re-create some transients lost in step 1. Once you get a hang of it it works every time, and sounds great if you choose your tools wisely.

This is at mix stage obviously. I would not recommend doing it on the way in - too many variables

I tried out Waves Bass Rider on a mix...I love it You can always do your own automation, but it's cool to put on right from the get go and use Compression as an effect as bass rider, rides levels up and down. Turning it off and on was a difference of an alive breathing bass and one that sounds compressed and solid. It's really cool if you're recording yourself,jamming and just want to get to it. I say you should check it out. I could see myself using it a lot in the future.

Some may argue it's an easy fix, but hey I like it!

compress it hard, and/or peak limit to a certain extent. i think bass guitar takes to compression pretty well. any particular reason you're opposed to it?

automation on bass is really risky unless your room/speakers have very deep and even bass extension.

maybe Waves Bass Rider could be useful...never tried it.

if i was gonna do this, i would think i'd want to put the limiter first, no? grab the crazy stuff first, so the "normal" compressor don't overreact?

I was going to say something along the lines of yes comp/limit brings them into submission, but often at the loss of whatever attack, definition and dynamic that I might like to preserve about it.
But then this is interesting-
In other words to heck with 'preserving, whack it hard, and basically remake all new attack shapes.

Particularly where there are parts that drop below the norm levels the comps have to work harder (deeper) on everything else- A prime case for pre-inset gain rides.

Another case for example- Generally had stray unwanted peaks, and too much sustain (is that exactally the same as 'not enough usable attack? ) The slower comp first made those strays' worse.
There limiter first.

MV2 Compressor Plugin | Waves


if the above advice isnt working for ya ...this thing will give you impact with out sounding squishy

If it was me, I would ride the fader into the compression. If I look at the waveform while recording the ride, I can usually do it in one pass of the song. Usually less time than it takes to mess with a few plugins.

Excellent thanks for all the tips guys. I find if i compress too much it kinda sqaushes the tone a bit. Hate that. Lol
I was lookin at the waves bass rider but i feel like im cheating if i go there. Lol

Ed

I almost always compress the crap out of it with 1176 followed by Vintagewarmer, even though VW adds a bit more compression it brings back some natural feel/smoothens it out and makes the
compression artifacts a little less obvious. Guess this would work with any tapesat plugin, I just happen to prefer the VW for bass.

.

Here's a trick I've used a few times:

A lot of times, this problem is caused by a bass with less than great performance. Some basses have certain notes on certain strings that jump out as either too loud or too quiet.

Also, a lot of players new to the instrument tend to be inconsistent with their plucking/picking, depending on what's going on with their other hand on the fretboard.

This results in a bass track with certain notes that either jump out loud, or are too quiet; but the effect is often short-lived. ...So a compressor/limiter/EQ (or whatever) can often destroy the tone of the bass for the sake of only a few notes. (NOT good.)

...So what I'll do in a case like this is to create TWO tracks from the bass track, putting the "too loud" notes on one track, and the "too soft" notes on the other.

I'll treat each track separately, then mix them back together to create the track to use in the mix.

Although it IS time-consuming to do this, sometimes its just the ticket.

.

1176 0n bass while recording

.....all buttons.

I had a production session where the bassist's instrument was pretty well bad.
We were near a music store and this bassist had tiny hands and loved his instrument.
So, I got his permission to do a small mod that made the bass more defined.
I changed the bridge while the engineer tracked some guitar bits.
Yep, bought a heavy brass version of his rolled recycled tinpot junk for about $80.
Best thing that ever happened to him.
The same strings etc, bass sounded centred.
If we had extra cash I would have swapped out the tuners (however, I don't carry a spare reamer just in case!) but that can be a headache if you ain't got your workbench.

No amt of 1176 in the chain can fix a bucket of crap sound.
It will. however, present it on a platter for the whole world to hear.

Word.

i'd go even further- whack it hard, let it live without transient, and the drum transients should mask the lack of bass transients just fine. the lack of bass transients should free up a lot of headroom and make the eventual loud mastering a lot easier.

obv. if the bass needs to be percussive (like in an open, funky groove, with lots of bass notes in between drum hits) then this may not sound great. but for any kind of normal pop/rock/whatever, i'm not convinced that bass needs transient information. bass may sound "worse" in solo but i'd be shocked if you noticed the transient loss in the mix.

i hit the bass hard these days. sometimes with Purple MC77 hardware. sometimes with a cheapo DBX 163. sometimes with a CLA-76 or LA-3A plugin. and then sometimes with an L2 added for transient removal.

i use it in a limiter setting i believe the ratio was 8

Seems to me that a compressor would be better at handling runaway transients, whereas the rider would be better at keeping the bass at a single level. Agreement anyone?

Yes

and

no...

Do enlighten us, famousbass.

i don't hate recording with compression. it can sound quite good if you know what you're doing. Hitting a bass hard with compression on the way in however is an easy way to get stuck with an overly resonant bass sound that eats away at your entire mix and makes everything sound cloudy. It takes a very long time to actually recognize these things and i was still guilty of it many years into my production career until it was pointed out to me by a much more experienced (and successful) engineer. You'll have much better luck shaping the sound and transients by coaching the player, suggesting to play with pick or fingers, taking time with the recording and using editing or multiple takes and punches to get an even and consistent performance. You are talking about easily the single most important track in your multitrack so this is somewhere were spending alot of time and care makes alot of sense.

These tips seemed to work for me. More specifically waves rider plugins.. slow attack/release on compression.. and quick attack/release on the limiting. Thank you fellow citizens.