Behringer MS-101 Analogue Synthesizer - Page 103

Bad Machinery · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonoTron ➡️

Thanks and well done everybody. The static sounds seem to be hard to recognize. The arp sound with filter movement is very easy to recognize the real deal.

I think from the beginning, this has been a lot of people's point: same oscillators, different filter and envelopes. Hence the above quote.

Somebodyperson · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonoTron ➡️

Thanks and well done everybody. The static sounds seem to be hard to recognize. The arp sound with filter movement is very easy to recognize the real deal.

Stereo test
Correct answer:
1: L = SH101, R = MS101
2: L = MS101, R = SH101
3: L = MS101, R = SH101
4: L = MS101, R = MS101

@Monomer
i'd say Left is OG

@Somebodyperson
1 and 3 are the Roland
2 and 4 are the Behringer

[I @ astrogat0r [/I]
Sound 1 - SH101 on the right
Sound 2 - SH101 on the left
Sound 3 - SH101 on the right
Sound 4 - SH101 on the left

@tteich
sound1: SH101=right
sound2: SH101=right
sound3: SH101=left
sound4: SH101=left

Sequential test
Correct answer:
1: A = SH101, B = MS101
2: A = MS101, B = SH101
3: A = MS101, B = SH101
4: A = MS101, B = MS101

sorry had to add a trick question

@Moonwhistle
the noisy one is the real SH

@Klankdroid
1) ms-101 / sh-101
2) sh-101 / ms-101
3) ms-101 / sh-101
4) ms-101 / sh-101

@janvdb
1) MS-101 / SH-101
2) MS-101 / SH-101
3) MS-101 / SH-101
4) MS-101 / SH-101

@decoder303
1. sequence SH second
2. sequence SH first
3. sequence SH first
4. sequence SH second (harder to tell since one has way more resonance turned in)

@Jesus Christ
They sound so similar that I couldn't care less which is which

Arpeggiator test:
Correct answer:
part 1 = MS101 / part 2 = SH-101
Yippie Kayee everyody was right

@Somebodyperson
I like the sound of the second better, so I am betting that it is the original...

@Bad Machinery
it's pretty clear that the Behringer is the first synth

@ astrogat0r
The second synth is the SH101

@soundxplorer
2:00 - 2:03 has that raspy quality that I associated with the 101's filter when the resonance is turned up and you start to lower the cutoff

@Atticus Plink
I’ll guess the SH is the second synth. In this instance I much prefer the first one though.

Sorry that I gave a cheeky answer for the first one.

Deleted b472e31 · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moonwhistle ➡️

That's just not true and I doubt the MS-101 has digital envelopes.

speculative, but for example the neutron has analogue envelopes, which is officially confirmed.

In any case, we are waiting for a comparison with the bee, so in 2 3 years .. if the synth does not remain vaporware.

original is the envelope without custom ic, so why not recreate ..

MonoTron · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebodyperson ➡️

Sorry that I gave a cheeky answer for the first one.

lol, well actually you were the only one who was right on all 4

Although not 'completeley' right

MonoTron · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bad Machinery ➡️

I think from the beginning, this has been a lot of people's point: same oscillators, different filter and envelopes. Hence the above quote.

Yep although i don't really mind about that, having the original for those sounds.
Still, it also shows that most sounds can be reproduced. As long as you don't have a very high resonance (>8) and close the cutoff.

The biggest difference is the noise. It is way to loud on the MS101 and it doesn't really filter that nice as on the SH.

fattyparts · 15th May 2019

For me the most substantial difference is the glide functionality, it’s a major part of the SH101 sound and sadly that part has not been cloned!

DavyP · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonoTron ➡️

Yep although i don't really mind about that, having the original for those sounds.
Still, it also shows that most sounds can be reproduced. As long as you don't have a very high resonance (>8) and close the cutoff.

The biggest difference is the noise. It is way to loud on the MS101 and it doesn't really filter that nice as on the SH.

Thanks for the time you've put into the comparisons, been really interesting to read

MonoTron · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by fattyparts ➡️

For me the most substantial difference is the glide functionality, it’s a major part of the SH101 sound and sadly that part has not been cloned!

You're totally right, i forgot about that. I don't use full noise that often so that doesn't really matter to me, but the glide function is almost ridiculous. It's just a lot less usable without the auto function and even now I don't put the glide further than 15-25%

MonoTron · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavyP ➡️

Thanks for the time you've put into the comparisons, been really interesting to read

You're welcome, and thank you for stickin to making non-oldskool 101 sounds and videos

tteich · 15th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonoTron ➡️

You're totally right, i forgot about that. I don't use full noise that often so that doesn't really matter to me, but the glide function is almost ridiculous. It's just a lot less usable without the auto function and even now I don't put the glide further than 15-25%

I sent this feedback to Behringer. Let's hope they find a way to implement it. Can you confirm: what's missing is the way Portamento="ON" was implemented on the SH101 (between all notes), and in conjunction with the sequencer (switch the portamento mode interactively while the sequence is playing)? If I had to decide I would add it on the MS e.g. by holding the "Shift" button while switching Glide to "On" (a bit cumbersome, but should be doable with the current 2 mode switch).

kvfive · 16th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uli Behringer ➡️

We are confident to be posting another firmware update within the next few days.

Thanks for all the valuable feedback.

Uli

Any update on this post Uli B ?

mat1 · 16th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by tteich ➡️

I sent this feedback to Behringer. Let's hope they find a way to implement it. Can you confirm: what's missing is the way Portamento="ON" was implemented on the SH101 (between all notes), and in conjunction with the sequencer (switch the portamento mode interactively while the sequence is playing)? If I had to decide I would add it on the MS e.g. by holding the "Shift" button while switching Glide to "On" (a bit cumbersome, but should be doable with the current 2 mode switch).

I'm enjoying my MS-101 but every time I play on it I find myself needing that mode and having to change my parts.

I was hoping to avoid buying the original but if they can't find a way to add this I'll have to.

tteich · 16th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by mat1 ➡️

I'm enjoying my MS-101 but every time I play on it I find myself needing that mode and having to change my parts.

I was hoping to avoid buying the original but if they can't find a way to add this I'll have to.

You can still play notes in "portamento fashion" (press next note while holding the current note), but Portamento "always ON" is of course more comfortable.

A question to you @ mat1 and the other SH101 experts who requested/need this feature:

There are two sides of the coin.

1) portamento "always ON" while playing live. Is it sufficient to have it as a permanent setting in a session if there is a way to change the portamento mode (from auto to always-on), or do you need to switch between the 2 modes (AUTO<->ON) interactively?

2) when the ARP/Sequence plays, the SH101 had only two modes (Portamento off and on). The "Auto" setting has no effect. Glide=on should enable portamento between all notes of an ARP or sequence I suppose.

Which of these (1 or 2) do you find more important?

mat1 · 16th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by tteich ➡️

You can still play notes in "portamento fashion" (press next note while holding the current note), but Portamento "always ON" is of course more comfortable.

A question to you @ mat1 and the other SH101 experts who requested/need this feature:

There are two sides of the coin.

1) portamento "always ON" while playing live. Is it sufficient to have it as a permanent setting in a session if there is a way to change the portamento mode (from auto to always-on), or do you need to switch between the 2 modes (AUTO<->ON) interactively?

2) when the ARP/Sequence plays, the SH101 had only two modes (Portamento off and on). The "Auto" setting has no effect. Glide=on should enable portamento between all notes of an ARP or sequence I suppose.

Which of these (1 or 2) do you find more important?

I'm no expert but I can see why you would want to switch between interactively. I'll take what I can get though at this point.

2 is what I'm missing the most and how I would instinctively want to use it. Full On mode is essential for Arps

VennD68 · 16th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by tteich ➡️

You can still play notes in "portamento fashion" (press next note while holding the current note), but Portamento "always ON" is of course more comfortable.

That is playing legato and technically not the same thing.
Legato is essential when tying notes of indirect pitch with a slide only.
You may have sequence with both legato and regular notes played for accented slides for example (who using external trigger input) or want to have an arp playing with portamento and have realtime control over portamento time or be able to switch between the three modes for variation with no portamento, portamento and legato.
On the SH-01A it also has a secondary purpose.
When in poly on the SH-01A mode you can set portamento to zero, turn it on and any chords sequenced will play in mono to lowest note priority order so you can flip a poly sequence to a mono one and back again.
Also turning the sequencer on and off and being able to do runs with portamento readily available for arps at the flip of a switch is super handy too.

VennD68 · 16th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by mat1 ➡️

I'm no expert but I can see why you would want to switch between interactively. I'll take what I can get though at this point.

2 is what I'm missing the most and how I would instinctively want to use it. Full On mode is essential for Arps

If you can find an SH-01A cheap you could always CV/GATE sequence the MS-101 from it and get the functionality of the OG Sequencer as well as the features set of the one in the MS-101 when needed.

tteich · 16th May 2019

@ VennD68 and @ mat1

thanks for confirming and for the explanation. I guess I need to refresh my base knowledge on legato and portamento

Option 2) is what I would want to use definitely, especially as the glide switch and knob for the timing is there and you kind of expect this feature. I find it very useful on the sh101 even though I'm not so much the live performer and use the 101 mostly for sequenced bass tracks.

Update: as described here https://www.failedmuso.com/blog/behr...1-full-review/ the AUTO-setting on the SH101 creates a portamento only if notes are played in legato style.

DavyP · 17th May 2019

Used the 101 in this video to do a nice sounding ARP

Deleted 153c85c · 17th May 2019

A quick update.

A new firmware is now on-line, downloadable from our website.

Uli

MonoTron · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uli Behringer ➡️

A quick update.

A new firmware is now on-line, downloadable from our website.

Uli

Thanks @ Uli Behringer and @ Eden.Chen for the new firmware!

I've got 2 questions:
1. When will you finish/repair the tie function in the sequencer? It wasn't addressed in the 1.08 firmware and it's not listed in the 1.1.2 release notes. Setting gate length to 8 does maximise the gate for that step but does not tie to the nexht note
2. Will the updater overwrite or delete our saved sequences? If so, How can we export our saved sequences before updating firmware?

Eden.Chen · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonoTron ➡️

Thanks @ Uli Behringer and @ Eden.Chen for the new firmware!

I've got 2 questions:
1. When will you finish/repair the tie function in the sequencer? It wasn't addressed in the 1.08 firmware and it's not listed in the 1.1.2 release notes. Setting gate length to 8 does maximise the gate for that step but does not tie to the nexht note
2. Will the updater overwrite or delete our saved sequences? If so, How can we export our saved sequences before updating firmware?

Hi @ MonoTron ,
1, Please try the new version firmware. It should be solved.
2, The saved sequences pattern won't be overwritten by the updater. Please don't worry about that.
3, We are planing to offer another app to control ms101 including the sequencer editor.
Thank you and have a nice weekend.

fiddlestickz · 17th May 2019

Still not available in Australia, have other countries seen stock or is it only the US and Europe..?

RetroFunk · 17th May 2019

how's that for direct information from the main people! Can't get any better than that.

fiddly: currently 1 open box at gear4music (UK)

DavyP · 17th May 2019

Since it's Eurovision weekend I always like to do a bit of Cheese

So this years effort is MS-101 Thinks it's Sexy!!

monomer · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by tteich ➡️

Y
1) portamento "always ON" while playing live. Is it sufficient to have it as a permanent setting in a session if there is a way to change the portamento mode (from auto to always-on), or do you need to switch between the 2 modes (AUTO<->ON) interactively?

It's nice to be able to switch on the fly but imo not super important.

Quote:

2) when the ARP/Sequence plays, the SH101 had only two modes (Portamento off and on). The "Auto" setting has no effect.

This is not the case.
Auto mode has an effect on sequences. When you program in legato notes portamento is activated only for those notes.

VennD68 · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiddlestickz ➡️

Still not available in Australia, have other countries seen stock or is it only the US and Europe..?

Don't know of anyone in Canada with on as yet either.

tteich · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by monomer ➡️

It's nice to be able to switch on the fly but imo not super important.

This is not the case.
Auto mode has an effect on sequences. When you program in legato notes portamento is activated only for those notes.

Good point. But I tried and can't seem to get it working (on my SH101) as you described.

a) When playing an ARP (up, down or up&down makes no difference):
AUTO behaves like Portamento=OFF

b) When I record a sequence, 4 notes, first 2=legato:
OFF - no portamento
ON - portamento between all notes, incl. between 4th and 1st of next loop
AUTO - portamento between all notes (1->2->3->4) but not between 4th and 1st of next loop

...but only when I set the ENV mode switch to "LFO". In Gate+Trig or Gate then it doesn't record the legato play and Portamento=AUTO behaves like P.=OFF.

Perhaps I have an early firmware and Roland fixed it in a later batch

Anyway, this is what I call "side effects" (developer language) -> a few buttons overloaded with too many options.

monomer · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by tteich ➡️

Good point. But I tried and can't seem to get it working (on my SH101) as you described.

a) When playing an ARP (up, down or up&down makes no difference):
AUTO behaves like Portamento=OFF

Yup!

Quote:

b) When I record a sequence, 4 notes, first 2=legato:
OFF - no portamento
ON - portamento between all notes, incl. between 4th and 1st of next loop
AUTO - portamento between all notes (1->2->3->4) but not between 4th and 1st of next loop

Yeah, that's not right. It should have portamentoed between note 1 and 2. Using Legato on the first note won't do anything.

Quote:

...but only when I set the ENV mode switch to "LFO". In Gate+Trig or Gate then it doesn't record the legato play and Portamento=AUTO behaves like P.=OFF.

I think when you set Env to LFO it will record all notes with Portamento. At least, that is what happens with mine.
If you want to program in legato notes you should switch to one of the other modes.

Edit: (wait, you aren't expecting to PLAY in the legato, are you? You need to use the Hold/Legato button and you need to press it while you play the note. Then the previous note will be tied to the one you just played.)

Quote:

Anyway, this is what I call "side effects" (developer language) -> a few buttons overloaded with too many options.

Oh come on, it's not THAT difficult.

Normally you just use the Hold/Legato button (you do know you need to hold it while playing the note, right?) and there will be legato.
Besides, the buttons secondary function (that is only active while programming) is clearly indicated. And it's just the two buttons.

tteich · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by monomer ➡️

<snip>
Edit: (wait, you aren't expecting to PLAY in the legato, are you? You need to use the Hold/Legato button and you need to press it while you play the note. Then the previous note will be tied to the one you just played.)

ok, this does the trick. I played in legato and overlooked the "Hold" button.

monomer · 17th May 2019

Quote:

Originally Posted by tteich ➡️

ok, this does the trick. I played in legato and overlooked the "Hold" button.

Haha.,,. Classic.,
Well, at least now you know how to use the best feature of the sequencer!!..

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