has anyone used the Akai Professional MIDI MIX DAW Mixer Controller, it is really cheap, seems like very good value for what it is, could be very useful indeed, same thing with the Akai Professional MPD218 USB Midi Pad Controller anyone here used one in cubase 13? on a mac? let me know!

Well, circling back to the original post of this thread and using that (the topic) as a reference I think it is a very poor deal.

No motorized faders.
Not touch-sensitive.
No displays of parameter values or track names.

Those are three strikes in my book regardless of price. In other words close to useless.

That midimix has only pots and non-motorized faders, to me that make it absolutely, completely, undoubtedly, 100% useless for mixing.

The mpd has encoders, so I guess you can use it, but it also has 16 pads taking up most of the space, so If you need 8 encoders I think you can find something better suited for that only.

I think it's a case of horses for courses.

I agree if you are doing serious studio mixing you'd want something with fine control like:

https://www.softube.com/products/console-1-fader-mk-iii

Or, more upscale and expensive models.

I have a midimix and what it's good for is "jamming" a rough arrangement performance mix in Ableton (live or studio).

Having captured that sketch you can then dive into Ableton's arrangement mode and fine-tune all the envelopes in a detailed way.

The midimix is pretty narrowly tailored towards Ableton and a specific workflow. Super cheap. Bit of a pain trying to make it work in other programs.

I agree, but I was thinking of using it more to control things like synths and plug ins within cubase, quick controls, or I could assign it to boring things such as panning or fx sends, it could be useful for helping me to do more automation faster on top of a much better main controller such as an SSL or similar.

Even so, without proper sync between the controller's state and the parameter value, it ill probably hinder more than help.
You'll be writing automation with short-throw faders, probably limited to 127 values.

for these kinds of things I find that a good tablet running TouchOSC is unbeatable in the current market.

This makes little sense as touch is not knobs, latches and faders. Replace fingers on track pad with fingers on screen? Gimme a break!

Fair enough, to each their own. But as I said, I find that for controlling things like pan, quick controls, etc. I'd rather have a well mapped, TouchOSC surface always in sync with the parameters, than a midi controller without feedback, with pots and short-throw midi faders.

For fader automation I also dislike touch screens, but then it is a motorized fader or nothing for me.
Mind you that I work almost exclusively in 5.1, so a single pan encoder does very little to me.
(But even when I worked in stereo only, it always made me mad how none of these controllers have an easy way to control stereo double panning. It is always mono, stereo balance, or the left side of a stereo combined panner.

Whatever happened to the fairlight legacy?

Eucon was made by Euphonix. Now owned by Avid.

EUCON is a proprietary control protocol developed by Euphonix (now Avid). Whereas MCU and HUI are MIDI-base, EUCON operates at high-speed over an Ethernet connection. This gives a higher bandwidth, allowing EUCON to support finer fader resolution, high-resolution metering, EQ and pan display, and richer controller data. EUCON allows control of all DAW and plug-in functions, and synchronizes (autobanking; see below) with the DAW. Compared to MCU/HUI, the EUCON protocol provides a much deeper integration with the DAW, but currently there are fewer controllers available that make use of the EUCON protocol. The AVID S1 controller is based on this EUCON protocol.

https://skippystudio.nl/2023/03/the-...aw-controller/

This is because avid will only license EUCon for hosts not controllers so they have a monopoly on hardware and the profit from it.

For DAWs that does not have EUCON natively, there needs to be a conversion to what is supported. That functionality probably does away with a lot of the advantages and likely is no reason to get a EUCON controller like the S1, but it's a nice touch if you got it for a DAW with support, but would prefer to also use with some DAW without it.

Sorry to butt in but could you use a cheap third-party product that has push buttons? Like that Mini Behringer or one of those cheap Chinese jobs that I can't remember the name of.. I'm asking because I am trying to figure out if an MPmidi is a good idea for me and my setup.. their return policy is not exactly consumer-friendly so you better make sure you really want it before you buy.

As far as I know there is no "translation" software or driver that makes a Eucon device work with a non-Eucon DAW.

That's not really entirely true. Avid has instructions on how to make Eucon control surfaces emulate Mackie control surfaces... at least on Mac.

You have to go into System Settings > EUCON and then add the DAW you wish to use Mackie emulation with to the list.

Then when you set up the control surface in the DAW you have to set up a Mackie control surface and when you choose the port, you choose the ports that show up in AMS as: "Euphonix Port 1," etc.

I have an Avid S3... and in AMS there's an MIDI Device called Euphonix MIDI that has four ports.

I actually did this with Studio One 7. I had to set this up as Mackie Expanders with "Euphonix Port 1" as the first expander (Faders 1-8 on my S3) and "Euphonix Port 2" as my second expander (Faders 9-16 on my S3).

I will say though that currently, at least with Studio One, it does not work very well. You do have control over faders, mutes, solo, pan... basic stuff but banking doesn't work so that's a deal breaker if you have more tracks than faders on your control surface (which I'm sure most of us normally do). Also, meters can behave strangely.

I did mention this on the Avid DUC forum and did get a response from someone at Avid that they have plans to improve this in the future. It behooves them to do so as they can sell more S1s etc. if the Mackie emulation works better.

That's news to me. I stand corrected.

Thanks!

No worries. TBH, it's really not all that robust and I'd characterize it, at least in Studio One, as not usable. Haven't tried it in other apps. Avid rep has said they're going to do more work to improve it.

managed to get a presonus faderport v2 for cubase 13, it works with version 13 and 14 on a mac, I got a script for it but want to customise it as it's not quite as good as it should be, just needs tweeking, it's good to have a fader again for vocal rides.

As far as I know only the newest Mac operating system (Sonoma and Sequoia) have a Midi 2.0 support. But reading the manual of Logic 11.1 there isn't really any change for controllers......

No mention of automatic handshakes.

In the remote controllers manual. No mention of midi 2.0.
In the application manual:

Enhanced MIDI 2.0 support: Choose whether to display MIDI data in the List Editor and other editors using higher-resolution MIDI 2.0 percentages or decimal numbers, or using standard MIDI 1.0 values. See General View settings.

So hardly anything. Just enhanced resolution.

Any suggestions on a go to DAW controller for end of 2024? I'm weighing up SSL UF8, Softube Fader Mark III, and Icon P1-M.

Avid s1 and/or Dock, with tablet.

It totally depends on which DAW you want to use it with. The two major coms protocols out there are Mackie Control and Eucon.

The best Mackie Control support is in Logic Pro as some of the developers who developed the protocol back in the day also worked for eMagic at the same time. Logic also has as I understand it the best Eucon support outside of Pro tools.

The SSL universe is all Mackie Control with some proprietary add ons as is the Icon stuff. I'm a long time Logic user who has had multiple Mackie Control hardwares over the years currently with a SSL Nucleus and Mackie ControlC4 Pro.

YMMV with other DAW's in relation to the quality of their support but those 2 protocols are as I understand it the only 2 baked in and supported by the DAW. Other protocols like Softube and Nektar for example are developed by the external hardware developer. I'm not sure if this is good or bad but worth noting.

Thanks @ mattiasnyc . I decided on a 2nd hand Avid S1. The Eucon software really sold it for me.

Real shame about Icon's PM-1 as it looks great and the size is perfect for me. But ultimately doesn't work properly. I hope things move on and the industry embraces a new software protocol for controlling Daws.

the avid S1 does look excellent, I might get one because they aren't too expensive, I also have a spare ethernet port on my mac pro 6,1, I like the idea of finer control, quite enjoying my presonus faderport v2, it's really good for the money, it works very well in both cubase and logic, the only thing I don't like about it and miss from my frontier alphatrack is the pan knob is set way too fine, it's not good enough to be a useable performance with automation, and a few of the buttons don't work as they should without going in and modifying the script in cubase.

I still do not think an Control24 or the C24 is beaten as a remote controller/mixing console.

Large manufacturers are seemingly unable to bring a mixer like this.

If Presonus were to make a 24-channel version of their Faderport 16, that would be tempting ... but until that happens, I'll keep working on my Control 24 as long as I can keep it functioning.

What OSes and DAWs do the Control24 and the C24 work with?

None of them, or nearly all of them. Allow me to explain:

When Digidesign/Avid were in the control surface game in the 2000's, they offered huge modular systems (D-Command) and smaller project studio versions (Control 24 & C24). ALL were ProTools-only interfaces.

Recently, the latest updates to PT rendered all of these units unsupported boat anchors. Officially, they don't run on anything.

Then along came software engineer Paul Neyrinck, who wrote a utility that resurrects these unsupported boards via MIDI and the old Mackie protocol. That utility isn't cheap (around $229-299 for a perpetual license), but it not only breathes new life into these old Digi/Avid control surfaces, but makes them work with nearly ALL popular DAWs, including PT itself. I run mine using Logic Pro and it works great.

Keeping a twenty-year-old piece of hardware working is a part-time hobby in and of itself, but there isn't another way to have 24 motorized faders, basic tracking controls, a transport section with jog wheel, and a meter bridge for less money out-of-pocket than with an old Control 24 running V-Control (Neyrinck's utility).

Here is an OS and DAW compatibility list:
https://neyrinck.com/vcpro-compatibility/

Just bought my second control24. Since my first one developed issues. Hopefully the new purchase works and I will be able to repair my first control24

For my little home PT setup, I'm really happy with my two Avid Artist Mix'es, still supported w/the latest Eucon, giving me 16 faders (I guess it could be expanded to 24), and an SSL UC1 for plugin control.

For anyone on PT on a modest budget, I can really recommend these controllers; the Artist Mix can be gotten really cheap (like $400 or less), and the UC1 is just fantastic. And running the Eucon protocol is so perfect w/PT.

The combination of a DAW controller and a plugin controller is the clue, I think. Lets me mix without staring at the screen so much. Helps me focus on what I'm hearing.