For $199 with free delivery (less than twice as much), you can get a Behringer ADA8000, which offers not 2 but 8 channels of DAC, and not unbalanced RCA but balanced XLR outputs. You can hear it compared to the $3000 Lynx Aurora 16 here:

Lynx Aurora 16 vs Behringer ADA8000

Oh and it also has 8 channels of ADC for the same price. And 8 preamps too! And you're actually hearing that test through those preamps!

Only problem with that is it doesn't help Mr. Williams, who wants you to buy something, let him convince you there's a problem with the "cheap op-amps and capacitors," and have you send him the unit to "upgrade" at greater cost. tutt

And yes I'm going to post in opposition every time he mentions that goddamn TI evaluation board without warning you how totally impractical it is for anyone to use, and the fact that it apparently isn't pleasant sounding anyway. It must've caught up to him if he's suddenly restarted trying these tactics.

I would't spend 50 bucks for that peice of crap ! A guy I know sent me a song he recorded with that ADA8000, and it was not clear at ALL. He used a good mic and pre also.... I heard the original tracks.... dull..... I have an Apogee AD16x and a mini dac and am looking for an upgrade for my mini dac......
I'm curious about these companies coming out with new cheap dacs.... like this one....or the Cambridge Dacmagic for 400 bucks... I'd love a mastering quality converter for less than 500 bucks !!!

Ya know...I usually like what peeder post (I especially appreciate his comments about plug-in & cards and using them correctly;his comparisons of the different products have saved me lots of "beta" money), but this little rant against Jim Williams, seems a little...well petty.

I got the PCm 4222evm and initially it was a challenge to set up, but once I found a good power supply for it, it is my go to A/D chain for single tracks like vocals or acoustic instruments and I have my choice of Lynx, and Apogee here (as well as some Motu, Behringer, and Emu). We even compared to a rented Prism back in Aug. and everyone chose it in blind test.

It has the most natural sounding conversion of any A/D I have ever used, it is what our main engineer calls "creamy"...we built a little housing unit for it, ran our inputs and outputs to the patchbay and closed the sucker up, so all we have to do is plug it in...if you're having issues with it, I will suggest you make sure the psu is clean and up to par, as far as housing it, mouser and digikey sell some very inexpensive R&D boxes...

I never expected Jim Williams to set it up for me, and frankly if you aren't somewhat familiar with DSP technology, it is probably best to leave items like this for the beta guys or just take your lumps with it.

I am currently testing some Wolfson D/A chips, I have an AKM eval board as well, and even a AD Sharc test device, and my experience with Jim's advice is that he knows his stuff about power issues, I don't always do what he does, but he's always been helpful.

And as far as the Behringer stuff...well I gotta agree with lukejs, we use ours as door stops, those guys have no concept about power isolation, and a lot of that stuff is reversed engineered from guys like M-Audio and Echo...

YMMV...

And as far as Jim Williams selling wares, I really don't catch that vibe from HIM, I know others have suggested his wares, but I haven't seen him pushing the mods for money on these kinds of threads, maybe I'm not paying attention, maybe I don't know the history, but frankly in todays economy I wouldn't hinder anyone from trying to make a buck...as long as it was honest.


By the way, I really used to like the A/B testing that guys did, I immediately picked out the Behringer from the minute the file started, they have a tendency to cloud the mids pretty bad as do Echo, M-Audio and a few others, but of late I've decided that everyone hears different things in different ways so, its best to find a product that you can use with personal confidence, THAT is more important than a host of other things we usually get distracted by.

Use what you like, but use it well.

FWIW I bought this on 10/25 and still got the discount just enter the code from the first post.

I guess some ppl cant stand the thought of a $150 converter sounding better than a high end unit. Here are some pics of my recently racked PCM4222EVM. For those interested the enclosure is from Par Metal.

those came out great heh

Yeah, I bought an ADA8000 to try out and that thing SUCKED. Maybe clocked to something else it is ok, but by itself, I wouldn't let my worst enemy use that thing. Well, maybe I'd let Peeder use it.

I've met Jim, and he's a cool guy and a straight shooter.

[QUOTE=boxymoron;3601636]I guess some ppl cant stand the thought of a $150 converter sounding better than a high end unit. Here are some pics of my recently racked PCM4222EVM. For those interested the enclosure is from Par Metal.


Hey.. those pictures came out great ! So let me get this straight....
You just buy a : transformer, powersupply, xlr connectors, PCM4222EVM and
an enclosure, and you've got a high end AD converter ? No WAY !! where do you get the pcm4222EVM ? I'm gonna go buy a new soldering iron !!!

Basically, yes. You can get it from texas instruments. In my evaluation it measured -120dB A-weighted and -114dB peak, unterminated.

Try 6K8 resistors from it's outputs to + rail. You will be surprised.

FWIW, I own one of these, in the Beresford TC-7510 mk6 form.

(BTW, some background: Stanley Beresford designed this DAC, and licensed the design to several OEM manufacturers. He has continually improved the design of this DAC since its inception, and it's now up to version mk6/4. He has kept his improvements available only to HIS productions of this DAC and has not released them to the OEM manufacturers. He even has gone so far as to marker out the IC identification on his chips. His DACs are available from his website at redirection page)

I purchased the mk6 about a year ago, and wanted to pit it against my Cambridge Audio 640C CD player. I wanted the versatility of a DAC, and a sonic improvement would've been gravy. For the first several hours of testing, I was concerned; it sounded unbalanced, grainy and harsh. After about 30+ hours of burn-in, I was elated to find that it handily bested my 640C, which was probably voted one of the top 5 hi-fi CD players under $700. I sold the 640C (losing several hundred dollars on the turnaround (Grrr!)), made about $25, and have better sound for my CD's and a DAC through which I do all of my monitoring (instead of the converters in my Mbox 2 Pro). It has a decent headphone section to boot.

These Beresford versions of the DAC are well worth the money. They will most likely beat the DAC in your low- or mid-level audio interfaces.

Of course, your ears may vary!

Hi Boxymoron i wnat to do thsi but im no electronics expert as far as the power supply is concerned, where can i get
1. the evm board
2. powersupply built
3. the rack case in the uk

im ok with soldering but im scared to even contemplate building the power supply i can understand why no one of you techies woudl build this to sell on ebay etc

Let me just say that the EVM is meant as an evaluation product only, as its name obviously implies. tutt You cannot resell it, even if you make modifications to it. With that said, I got one because I am interested in implementing my own decimation filters and the EVM provides an excellent platform for that.

ok got that but what about the other questions e.g case, power supply etc

bravo, jim.

google is your friend

Google?? righhhhhtttt so rather than you say oh i got the case from blah blah blah part number xxxx etc , power supply BUILT form blah blah blah part number xxxx converter board the same etc i have to google it get a million responses sift through the kak and then come back here to ask the very same question .........

ok i think i'll pass on this one thanks for your help (lack of) where is Jim when you need him... at least he mentions stuff. what is the point of a diy project if you dont explain in detail how you built you nice box of tricks and where you got the bits from sorry if i sound peeved but it seems a tad elitist no!!

Any Cheap and good DAC that accepts AES inputs???

Check out Farnell and look for a Power-One linear (not switching) supply that can do +/-15V and a third feed for 5V. Also, Condor linear supplies are cool. Farnell will also have cases/boxes and so do Maplins. You'll need either a rack case or two small ones, depending on how you want your result....then all you need is the evm board and you're away.......good luck. If you do a search here, Jim Williams actually recommends a supply in another thread about this AD.

DIY is an acronym. Do you know what it stands for?

hint: it's not "D.I.F.M."

Plus one. Give it a rest Peeder. If you ever make even one comment that remotely sounds like you have ever worked as a professional in the recording industry, or know what you are talking about from personal experience, I'll be impressed. Intelligence does not necessarily translate into talent. Must be frustrating for you huh?

People will only be furious with me for not warning them more vigorously.

What are you talking about?

Do you imagine that no one other than you is in a position decide whether they would like to buy something like an eval board or other semi-productized electronics? This is the geekslutz forum for crying out loud. Next you'll be telling people that they were forewarned that those pesky components would require assembly or even -- gasp -- soldering!

-synthoid

first impressions out of the box are really good. I hooked this to the optical out of my layla 24 (any reason i should use coax instead?) and am listening through good headphones (ath-m50) and I can hear a big improvement over listening through the headphone out of the layla24.

do I need to hook speakers up to this to burn it in or can I use just headphones? This is primarily for headphone monitoring. or can I just run audio through it with nothing hooked up to burn it in?

Should be no difference optical/coax, both are spdif.

Not sure I'm buying the "burn in" concept...opamps, resistors, and caps...?

Some one want to point to a white paper that supports this?

Not saying you shouldn't it just seems to be a tradition and I need data to prove its viable...call me a skeptic.

(I reserve the right to be wrong, and often am)

so if I understand, the stock unit doesn't need burn in since it doesn't have film caps?

Mr. Williams initially posted this to the main SMGSLT forum in an effort to attract business. That is the forum I initially replied to. The moderators moved it here because it is not a general interest thing.

I got the rack case from Par-Metal Products. The power supply is a standard +/- 15 volts plus a +5 volts output.

I didn't believe either, until my experience with the TC-7510. I can't explain it, but I swear I heard it.

Of course, it could just be that I was off on my hearing the first few times I listened to it, and coincidentally in a much better state of hearing after I did my 30+ hours of continual burn-in. I'm totally willing to concede that.

Either way, it sure doesn't take much to play some dynamic CD's on repeat for a day through a DAC before giving an in-depth evaluation of its sound.

Dude...you're embarassing yourself. Seriously.

I don't know Jim Williams nor have I sent gear to him for modification, but there are two things I know about Jim Williams:

1. He doesn't need to "attract business" - he has been around for decades and has lended his expertise to stars like Frank Zappa, Stevie Wonder, etc. His expertise in electronics - particularly audio gear - is unquestioned and his reputation speaks for itself.

2. He FREELY shares his electronics expertise with others who are modding their gear - including component upgrades. In fact, he replied to one of my posts & advised me and a couple of other dbx 163x owners on how to upgrade that box (components which needed swapped out/which resistors to snip out, etc). He NEVER insinuated to send the boxes to him - in fact, on other boards I've seen him respectfully turn away business because of his workload.

Bottom line: when Jim Williams posts, people listen. I suggest you do the same so you stop making yourself look like a jackass.

Respectfully submitted,

DY