interesting point.... even for other things iam choosing now...
in fact when logic 6 came up i decided to be software only so i could get full total recall... and now i decided to buy some hardware again recently because i think there is a difference finally even if both are good and can give good result...
Then now iam in my new house and making my room i have now some hardware again... VIRUS TI, MOOG LITTLE PHATTY, Korg Kaos pad 3... probably a DSI Tetra soon or prophet 8 and then i saw that used fs1r... at same time as the komplete bundle for the same price..
Maybe its right i now have some hardware i should maybe restrain myself a little and see how it go,,, its not sure i will love to recall performance and patch on many hardware synth... lol so it may be good to get some soft to complete my setup...
i will have to decide today lol

thanks that was a good point !

Yeah FM synths aside, it's good to get a compliment of software if you have a lot of hardware. You'll probably feel happy you did. I love the FS1R for the sound it produces, it's one of the most alive sounding FM synths I've heard. I do like hardware, but like great software too. The FS1R is unique in my eyes. But unique is not always the best way. At this point you might want to be practical. Sounds like you have quite a few ideas for synths to get, so it would be good to choose the one that makes the most sense to what fits your music and what you would enjoy the most.

Let me also throw into the ring that the great programmibility of the FM8 isn't of much use when the basic sound sucks. The only FM plugin that sounds as good as a hardware synth is the freeware VOPM - which unfortunately is very limited on the feature side.

Whenever you can get rack mounted hardware that sounds so good, you have to buy it.
The FS1R is one of those instruments.
Studio Electronics, etc.
They compliment my DSP synths perfectly. I have to have a 3 Oscillator Analog, and I use Adern's Flexor III & Scope Modular for my FM stuff, which is mostly FM Pianos, but everytime I see an FS1R on ebay they go for 500-600 USD and disappear quickly.
It isn't a crucial peice of gear for me, but I have tried for 2 years to grab one, and I think next time I will pay what they ask for.
I heard the FM7 and there's no way I could use such a shrill thin instrument. FM8 did sound better last time I heard it, but having owned a TX816/QX-1 rig it is difficult to buy software as a replacement when it sounds like that. I will try the VOPM but I am not very happy with any Native VSTi's, and it probably has that " computer " sound too.
Sometimes these instruments sound fine in a mix with other instruments being used, but as soon as a real peice of hardware enters the mix it becomes apparent what's missing.
Also, I am a live performer and the idea of waiting for a preset to load is reminiscient of the old 3.5 FDD days and EMU racked samplers.
That Dog Won't Hunt............

Comparing the FS1r to the Komplete bundle is really apples to oranges.

As a very comprehensive suite of softsynths, you're certainly going to get far more bang for you buck with Komplete. It's basically got everything you'd want synth/sampler wise.

On the other hand, if you just want an FM synth, I can't fathom anything better than the FS1r. I guess the FM8 has a freely assignable modulation matrix for its operators, but I'd be hard pressed to conceive of an operator modulation scheme that isn't covered by the FS1r's 88 algorithms. Unlike the FM8 the FS1r also has a very comprehensive, if not complex and confusing, formant engine which greatly expands its potential. For what it's worth the FS1r also comes with over 1,000 dx patches in memory, and a strong effects engine to boot. Unless you've just got to have the lower fidelity conversion of the DX era synths, the FS1r is the is the only fm synth you really need.

Well,I just don't get it!
People, I guess ,these days will sacrifice quality for convenience at a flick of a sec.

Nuff said!

Why?

Hi,

Just a side note, can the fs1r do AFM similar to the TG/SY-77 or SY-99? I'm not thinking of the sampled waveform FM of the 99. Does it surpass these capabilities?

the fs1r is yamahas most advanced "fm ONLY" machine.
the sy-99 is probably their most advanced fm synth followed by the fs-1r and then probably the sy/tg-77 and then the dx-200.

for the money it's a really impressive sounding beast and a headache to program. if you like challenging sound programming then the fs1r is for you. the tg-77 is cheaper however has a wide variety of waveforms to use for even richer sound experimentation and has resonant filters on top of it.

my advice is get the tg-77 first as it's a lot easier to get around on and program. if you want more fm depth later then sell it and get an fs1r.

fm-8 is a nice fm synth too and is fairly easy to get around inside the guts of fm and do it quickly. it has dual resonant filters and multiple waveforms (not the complex pcm samples in the tg-77/sy-99/77 but still more than sine only) and a mod matrix and can do morphing between patches.

hardware wise i think, depending on what you already have or not, maybe a tg-77 is a better choice before the fs1r. if you already have a good pcm sample based digital synth with good filters go for the fs1r if not the tg-77 is like 2 synths in one.

Hi, thanks for the great reply.

I hadn't really thought about the TG for PCM use. I was just thinking about FM. It's a good consideration, though.

I don't complex patching, although I do already have my hands pretty full already in that regard. I'll keep an eye out for an fs1r and a TG. The TG seems to pretty much be dirt cheap, which is great.

I had a listen to FM8 demo material online. I thought it was nice, and seemed not really typical of what I had come to expect of FM tones. I'm probably used to FM without filters, though.

Cheers

Actually, FS1R is FM and Formant Syntheses.

The FS1R has a wide variety of waveforms and resonant filters as well. Same filters as AN1X.

Probably FS1R . Vsts are toys...

I think what he's saying is that TG-77 has sampled waveforms as well. As I recall it is both sample playback and FM. A fine machine I'm sure and if you want to spend less then get it. FS1r will probably beat it overall though.

FM8 is actually a pretty good piece of software. The thing is though that FS1r has soul. And in my opinion nothing NI makes (and most other software makers make) has soul. As the years go on, a handful of synths here and there come into their own as being beautiful pieces that inspire, and in my view FS1r is one of them. VSTis don't seem to reach that status because by the time those few that are absolutely must-haves are discovered, they are probably discontinued and can no longer be purchased. It's a different distribution model entirely. The only software that *I* feel has soul is the Korg Legacy stuff. There is some magic in those things.

Got'cha

So true. Microwave XT as well.

Because there's tons of software that does stuff hardware won't do - simply because it's not a "safe enough" choice to sell in large numbers.

Some Reaktor ensembles, when put in hardware, wouldn't find 5 people that'd pay the money for it. Instead, it's freely downloadable if you've bought the program, and cost far less in development time because the tools are much more accessible than designing circuits yourself or programming embedded operating systems from scratch.

Good enough answer?

I suppose for some, but as far as I'm concerned, if Yamaha FS1R, E-MU e4xt with RFX32, Novation Supernova II, Prophet '08 PE, Moog LP II, MPC2500 with JJOS, MPC2000XL, Eventide H8000FW, Kurzweil KSP8, Electrix Filter and Warp Factory won't do it I don't need it....Though I would like to get a Microwave XT, DSI Tetra and Some Moogerfoogers too. heh

hear hear! haha

Paraphrased from VintageSynth: The TG/SY77 has wave ROMs onboard (AWM) which can be mixed with the sound of the FM engine, and then passed through the envelope/filter. The SY99 has ROM (AWM2) and sampling.

I guess the fs1r filter would be a better model, coming from the more recent AN series. I suppose the FM engine may be a little better implemented? I've enjoyed formant fun before too. It's pretty cool.

actually the onboard pcm samples can be used in the fm engine too. that's why the sy-99 is better than an fs1r, you can sample the fm output of your 6 operator patch and use it as the starting point for the next 6 operator patch...

leading to 12 18 24 etc... operator patches.

and you can mix the fm with awm etc...

the fs1r has the formant filters but the waveforms are what you find in fm-8 saw ramp square sine cosine etc... single cycle simple waveforms.

the sy-99 can go places the fs1r cannot. to be fair with the formant filters the fs1r can do some things the sy cannot also.

however in order of capabilities the fs1r is the most advanced fm only synth yamaha made the sy-99 however is the most advanced fm synth they made period, the user sample area and use of any sample fed into the fm engine and the use of filters after means it's a monster.

the tg-77 is behind the fs1r because it lacks the sample option and you are then left with only awm wave sets onboard which means a 6 operator synth with advanced wave use but the fs1r's formant filter plus 8 op fm engine makes it the more advanced fm synth.

This is not the same thing as true 12 18 24 etc... operator FM, but interesting and unique none the less.

Thanks for the clarification, folks!

I've listed a like new Yamaha FS1R in the classified section:

https://gearspace.com/board/gearslut...w-manuals.html

lol.

i've listed FM8 (for cheap!)

i got NI komplete so can sell the individual license to FM8 that i owned previous to getting komplete.

Ah nice. This made me glad I checked this thread, I've got one or two windows ones (like FreeFS) & Yahamah's old one for the macOS9 but having one with CoreMIDI support is great.

Does anyone know if there is/was an OS X compatible alternative to FSeqEdit? I see that the above editor links to FSeqEdit under the windows version so I'm not sure how likely it is that an OS X alternative exists. I do have a windows pc I run that on and the workflow is fine since it's a standalone utility, but it would still be neat to have.

If you fancy 1 of 9 brand new ones check this

Yamaha FS1R FM Synth Module Brand New in Box on eBay (end time 14-Sep-09 16:32:11 BST)

Seems legit

That is too cool for someone in Europe.

I got mine on ebay new in box about two years ago with a North American power supply.

I'm crossing my fingers for a Microwave XT NIB to pop up on there one day.

I don't know of one. I've got an XP notebook just for running FSeqEdit and ZoeOS.

Id go for it but ive promised myself that i have to get ten more releases before im allowed to buy more gear haha

Do it! You won't find another NIB or that price. I paid $850. Worth every penny.