Behringer also plans on remaking the SH-5, so I'm curious to know what the oscillators sound like on the SH-5 (or System 100) compared to the Pro-One and SH-101, which are Curtis CEM 3340s.

Pretty much ALL of Roland's filters have already been "cloned", so for now I will just have the run the Behringer Pro-1 through the SH-5 Eurorack equivalent filter. I know it won't sound exactly the same as a real SH-5, but it's the closest thing.

Are there any major differences in terms of the way the oscillators sound? If there are, do you think you can post some audio examples? It could just be the saw and square without the filter (three notes per octave over 6 octaves) - should be pretty simple.

Also, thanks to this guy for the SH-5 and Pro-One reviews. I would have never heard of the SH-5 without him:

https://greatsynthesizers.com/en/rev...well-equipped.

bump

The Pro one and Sh-5 are very different synths. The Pro One is definitely better for bass (most of the time) because of the 24db/octave filter. It also has 2 full ADSRs compared to the 5's ADSR and AR (which are not as fast as the Pro One's envelopes). Also the ability to mix in the triangle wave on the Pro One helps for bass.

The 5 has a Ring Mod and Bandpass filter (non modulatable) which the Pro One doesn't have. The bandpass filter on the 5 does have a sound but you have to manually move it while playing which can get annoying fast. If you leave it set on one frequency it gets annoying so many times you need to be moving it or have it set to off. The main filter on the SH-5 was kind of thin sounding and if you are expecting SEM type sounds or MS-20 sounds you will be disappointed. It does have it's own thing going on and sounds good if you process it with effects or amps etc.. The ringmod on the SH-5 is quite good and can take an external audio source so you can use the synth as a big effects pedal if you care to. I liked running guitar through it.

If the SH-5 had a better LFO-1, better sounding filter, CV over bandpass filter, and faster envelopes it would be one of my favorite synths but these were all annoying for me. If you have the space and funds to own lots of monosynths it's a nice one to have but if you are trying to keep it to 3-4 monosynths there are better choices in my opinion.

So how are the oscillators compared to the Pro-1's? I'm feeding the Behringer Pro-1 into the SH-5 (Eurorack clone) filter, so obviously the oscillators are different.

The oscillators are pretty standard on the SH-5 I remember the squares being particularly nice but the PWM implementation wasn't as good as on the Pro One. SH-5's Oscillator 2's PWM can only be modulated by ADSR and Manual where on the Pro One you have much better options with the modulation section.

In general oscillators don't have too much of an impact on a synths sound if they have the same waveforms. There are slight differences between discreet and IC oscillators and differences between VCO's and DCO's but in general if you look on an oscilloscope and see a Saw it's a Saw. Triangle is going to sound like a triangle etc. If you run a Minimoog Saw through a Pro One's external in it's going to sound like a Pro One. If you run a Pro One Saw through a Minimoog's external in it's going to sound like a Minimoog.

Emulating the overall character of a vintage synth is never easy because the filter is also impacted by the quality of the mixer and VCA and the speed of the envelopes.

I think the SH-5 also has a 24dB/o filter..

You are right the SH-5 is 24db/oct as well but I still found for bass it wasn't as good as the Pro One. Maybe it's the diodes or something but I struggled to get your typical punchy bass from it. Could also be the envelopes.

I had an SH-5 for a few years a decade ago, and it’s a great bass machine. Everything about is glorious, the oscillators are juicy delicious, envelopes are not snappy, the BPF is the best ever and hard to quit, the multimode filter is classic 70s Roland, it’s overall extremely musical.
Good luck, Bohringer.

Yeah, envelopes are important.
Also, maybe the pro1 (at least in my memory) sounds a bit harsher (kinof like some distortion pre-filter?). Anyway, this maybe gives a little more bite to the oscillators which can be good for bass. I don't remember it doing soft/round bass very well but being good for 'stabby' basses with complex harmonics.

Both the Pro-1 and Model D suffer from this pre-filter gain excess (and not in a musical but rather harsh way). I believe Behringer uses a different summing with opamps instead of passive mixing stages. This why I often tell people not to trust the Behringer clones when judging the sound of a vintage unit. There are differences and sometimes they're critical.

I have a system100 and a Pro1.

oscillator tone on the system100 is superior. precise and smooth sounding.

Pro1 has more raw grunt, not as classy sounding. This probably has more to do with the signal chain components than the oscillator circuits themselves. but whatever, the system100 oscillator tone is AAA++

Interesting. I usually use my Moog Source for rounder bass and Pro-1 for more aggressive crossmod sync basses but never really thought as to why. This is my first time hearing of this pre-filter distortion. I don't usually run my oscillators at full level in the mixer so I guess it's possible I wasn't noticing this because of that?

I mean, i'm only guessing from memory. But the pro1 seemed to have an aggressive, fizzy sound to it that i associate with distortion. And you can filter it out so it seems to happen before the filter.
Anyway, if you have both you could compare the raw tone of the oscillators.

even with oscillators down in the mixer?

Good idea but these kind of synth comparisons are largely uninteresting to me and I don't think the majority of music listeners can tell the difference between a saw from Synth A or Synth B. Hardware, software, whatever. Most people can't tell or don't care.

The Pro-1 is good and versatile for the price and musically useful so it's not very important to me if there is a bit of pre-filter distortion I guess. I might still look into this though.

No, obviously with the levels halfway up you’re hitting the filter clean but in the case of the Model D you’re losing half of the mojo that way.

When I realized System 100 is one of the best sounding mono synths, I had already sold my 101. Too bad, but Cloud one is close enough for me.

It sounds somewhat like EMS. Very different from any chip based mono that I know.

I'm glad I'm not the only one noticing that

Well, if that distortion gives you a particular sound then IMO that's worth knowing.

Probably only those to access to both would only bother. The rest just assumes the B clone behaves the same as the original which is wrong. This notion is also fueled by comparison videos from well known channels, which tend to narrow the sound to overlapping ranges in both machines. In practice you do notice very obviously when you play them.

Try it between 50 and 100% and you'd find sweet spoot.

OG also have noticeable overdrive above 70%. So Bro-1 is copying this behavior.

In the case of the Model D there no way around it: once you start to drive the filter just a bit it sounds like crap.

I don't know I don't have Boog - have Pro 3. But I've played like 2-3 Boogs and they all have sweet spot and even on max they were nicer than drive on Sub 37 or Pro 3. May be your Boog has problems?

You guys seen the Alex Ball Roland System 100 video? That's really my dream synth...the fatness! the horrible fatness. Sounds revoltingly good

It’s great.

I had a mint complete one for a while but moved it on because I was too worried about it being damaged. Literally having to yell at people to stay away from it.

The SH-2\09 synths have the same massive sound just nowhere near the flexibility.

Someone posted a sample of a SH-101 Eurorack clone filter that sounded even better/more accurate than the MS-101.

https://gearspace.com/board/attachme...ths-sh-101.mp3


Thanks. Good to know.

Nah I serviced 3 of them (bad calibration from factory) and they all behave like that. As I said, it's down to the way Behringer does the summing. You may like it, no problem with that, but it can't be said that it sounds or behaves like a Minimoog.

I suppose I'll mention my System100 drum library again then, available on wave alchemy

https://www.wavealchemy.co.uk/product/sys-100-drums/


also my system 100 demo here, which I'm sure 99% of GS users have already heard.

There is no thing "sounds and behaves like Minimoog" even among Minimoogs. Urs Heckmann said a lot about it right after Diva got released.