Originally Posted by mu.c ➡️

In all fairness, I have to share this.

I have a CW mixing project using about 58 plugins. On my MOTU 828preES, I have to set the host buffer size to the maximum 1024 samples to run this project in CW. Even at that, I have to push my CPU to run above 3.2 GHz with the CPU fan at max to get this project to play. It occasionally stutters, slows down and even stop with an audio dropout. I have had to freeze many tracks so it would play. I get hundreds of late buffers. Needles to say, it is very difficult to do any additional tracking with the effects running with that long host buffer. It has been a frustrating experience to be able to complete this project without freezing and unfreezing tracks, rendering other clips, etc. to squeeze more CPU power so it would run.

So, since everyone says that Reaper can outrun CW by a lot, I cranked up my evaluation copy of Reaper and loaded my CW project into it using a user plugin that does the conversion (look up AZslow). Not all plugins loaded (8 are missing) and not all tracks are playing correctly, but that is not the point. It's amazing just to be able to open the project in Reaper. But, the important thing is, I can play the project with about 50 active plugins with my CPU at a comfortable 2.18GHz, host buffer size reduced to 128 (!!!), and it plays without stutters and dropouts! Imagine that. It plays at about 2/3 of the CPU speed and one tenth the buffer size. 1024 down to 128, and I have not hit the saturation point. Next, I will try to add more plugins to see where it starts to falter.

I did notice that Reaper seems to have less headroom than CW. Tracks that are not hitting red on CW are past red in Reaper. However, if this thing can handle the plugin load the way this demonstrates, inasmuch as I love Cakewalk, I will have to secure a copy because it is between the $60 and upgrading to a more powerful PC, which makes it a no-brainer.

I will probably end up using a mix of both products, but out of necessity, the higher performance just makes Reaper a must-use tool. And, it does handle the dual monitors (the scaling not so much, but it is tolerable), and so it provides a much better workflow and UI than that PT everyone elevates. Hope this helps other Cakewalk users.

Originally Posted by psykostx ➡️

Sonar X3 Producer Edition was and still is the best DAW, subjectively. Those who disagree are simply biased. It's the only DAW programmed in WinAPI C++ and is the only DAW that has a workflow that can be fully customized and has comprehensive keystroke accessibility. The full version is a complete tool set for every aspect of production, from writing to tracking to mixing to mastering to post for video or other media publication. Complete meaning complete from multiple interface perspectives to processing, plugins and instruments. No feature is an afterthought, it has been and still is one of the best thought out and executed pieces of software ever written; and it's written in WinAPI C++ so it is adaptable and expandable for any hardware set and therefore 100% futureproof as long as windows exists on the WinAPI coding standard. Even if windows ceases to exist, it's structure is C++ so it can likely be ported by simply overriding Windows object naming. It conforms to every AES industry standard which no other DAW to date can boast, and that includes the industry standard OMF project file format (the *.wav of multitrack projects that somehow many major DAWs seem to only include as a high-priced add-on). On top of that, Sonar has always been a year or more ahead of every other DAW when it comes to implementing new driver and hardware features such as a 64-bit floating point environment, and the additions not only again conform to industry standards in audio but also computing and are fully featured as developed (for example, VST3 was implemented from the start with complex input and output structure allowing parallel processing and cross-input keying/triggering). There is only one feature of Sonar that needs updating and is a serious threat to its competitiveness, and that is the hardware insert feature forces the occupation of stereo inputs and outputs; even if only one mono input/output combination is used, the corresponding channel of that ASIO pair will be unavailable for use in a different insert or track input/output. FIX IT ALREADY!

Originally Posted by raweber ➡️

I've had this same experience. I now use Cakewalk to track, comp and edit, then export the audio to Reaper for mixing. I prefer Cakewalk, but for some complex mixes it just doesn't quite cut it power-wise. The comping system, however, has no comparison that I've been able to find anywhere!

Originally Posted by mtl777 ➡️

Is Sonar X3 Producer the version of Sonar that they used to create or port to Cakewalk by BandLab? Which version of Sonar was used to create or port to Cakewalk by BandLab?

Originally Posted by qblues ➡️

My understanding is that they used Sonar Platinum which was the latest version of Sonar.

I had some issues in the past with Sonar X3 (mostly audio dropouts) and I started looking for alternatives but always went back to Sonar. Then I decided to upgrade to Cakewalk by Bandlab, and I have not had any audio dropouts or issues besides the time when I switched from 48khz to 96khz. Initially, the performance bar was showing excessive CPU usage that lead to audio dropouts but after a few days the problem just disappeared. I don't know what fixed the issue but it could have been one of the Cakewalk updates. They seem to be on top of whatever people complain about and provide frequent updates to fix bugs.

I've been a Cakewalk/Sonar user since 2000 and I'm very happy with it.

Originally Posted by mtl777 ➡️

Thank you so much!

Glad to know there are still many people who use Cakewalk/Sonar!

I started with Cakewalk Pro Audio 9 back in the 90's then followed the upgrades but only up to Sonar Producer 8.5. So I still have old projects in Cakewalk PA9 and Sonar Producer 8.5. Can I easily port my projects to Cakewalk BandLab? Will there be a lot of changes that I have to make especially with my Cakewalk PA9 projects? And will the upgrade from Sonar Producer 8.5 to BandLab really be worth it? I often hesitate to upgrade if what I have is already working.

Originally Posted by ShadowsOfLife ➡️

Cakewalk By BandLab will open your old Sonar projects just as well as Sonar Platinum did, since they're basically the same thing. You shouldn't have to make any changes, assuming you still have the same plug-ins you had in those projects.

A cool feature of Cakewalk By BandLab is that it supports your older plug-ins if they were already installed on your system when you installed CBB. So if you still have Sonar Producer 8.5 installed, CBB will be able to use those instrument and effect plug-ins. You may have to point CBB to the old plug-ins folder, but after a VST scan, they all should show up (assuming they also work on your current version of Windows).

Steve

Originally Posted by qblues ➡️

Sonar is a great DAW and the current Cakewalk by Bandlab is an updated version of Sonar Platinum. I've been using Cakewalk since 2000 (Started with Cakewalk Pro 9, then Sonar 3, 4, 6 and X3) and I still use it as my main DAW today. Bandlab is in the process of developing a new Sonar DAW that they have not said much about but that will likely require to be purchased. I hope they don't go the subscription crap other DAWs do.

https://www.cakewalk.com/sonar

Originally Posted by jaxman12 ➡️

From your link:
We will continue providing community support and maintenance for Cakewalk by BandLab until both Cakewalk Next and Sonar become publicly available. At some point after the release of Next and Sonar, Cakewalk by BandLab will no longer be supported. Existing Cakewalk by BandLab users will be able to continue using the software after the release of Cakewalk Sonar. In the meantime, Cakewalk by BandLab continues to be available

Will Next and Sonar be free like Cakewalk by BandLab?
Next and Sonar will be offered at price points designed to meet the needs of different customers. More information will be provided as we approach the launch date for these new products.

I bought Cubase when Sonar was picked up by Bandlab. It doesn't make sense that a full blown DAW such as Sonar Platinum would be free. No company can exist with no income. I still use Sonar Platinum because
1) I already know how to use it
2) It is very stable
3) It has all of the features that I need

I don't view this as bad news, but good news.

Check out the recommended specs. For Windows, would be Windows 10 and an 8 Core processor! Not sure my PC will handle this. It is not an 8 core.

Originally Posted by qblues ➡️

I agree with you and would gladly buy the new Sonar but I wouldn't be too keen to stay with it if they make it a subscription based deal. Looking at the PC recommended specs for the new Sonar, I wouldn't be surprised if they are incorporating ATMOS to it.

Originally Posted by norfolk martin ➡️

I agree. I have been using Sonar to over 20 years, but, as a point of principle, I will not "rent" software.

Originally Posted by norfolk martin ➡️

I agree. I have been using Sonar to over 20 years, but, as a point of principle, I will not "rent" software.

Originally Posted by jaxman12 ➡️

Possibly Buy or Rent Options?

Originally Posted by theblue1 ➡️

Usually, with outfits like Adobe, it's all about getting their hand in your pocket and never letting go.

Originally Posted by norfolk martin ➡️

There was some discussion this on the Cakewalk Bandlab forum. The company kept it cards very close to its chest , refusing to explicitly state that they will not actively kill the existing free product, as opposed to simply "not supporting it."

We were also favored with the usual marketing-speak about "developing models that offer the maximum value to our customers," but refusing to rule out a subscription-only model.

When things got a bit heated, they closed the thread, and there has been zero discussion of this on the forum for months /

Originally Posted by Gordon ➡️

Is anyone using the paid version now? I haven't seen a "killer" feature to make me switch, did I miss anything?

Originally Posted by cramseur ➡️

I've been using Cakewalk since it was Twelvetones Cakewalk. Still use it now (Cakewalk by Bandlab). I just built a new computer and am faced with the decision to continue CbB, upgrade to the subscription Sonar, or jump ship.

I have a lot of songs and pieces done over the years on CW/Sonar and only Reaper reads those files directly. I tried Reaper a few years ago (when Gibson bought Sonar) but it was ...eh.

I am concerned about the lack of other users, and the spectre of CW/Sonar just disappearing.