I read on others forums the Alpha 80 and the Adam were less neutral acurate than HS8

The HS 8 is famous to be the most clinical speacker and the most accurate in the market at any price so why say in theses forum the Alpha 80 blow HS8 or the Adam blow the HS8 i think it's totaly wrong the HS8 stay the best always at any price.

I compared longtime on youtube at listening the HS8 vs LSR 308 and i found the LSR 308 less precise in bass too metalic not natural and harsher in high, the overall sound is "less open" than hs8 imo because blindage then I read the totaly opposite in review of the forumer homestudioguy who create an other ac****e on a other home studio hobbyst forum for write the same review i think this guy is sponsored by JBL because when i hear and imo i think have exelent ear (i can recognize guitar amp brand closing his eyes in a mix with nothing but just warmth and grain) The LSR 308 was not bad but more in consumer grade (no neutral EQ with boomy and metalic bass) than pro audio grade like the HS8.

I can't test in real life what the absolute best for mixing and listen music for price because i live in a small town and I did not want to go into a store or listening is amateur because the speakers are often in shelf so the listening conditions are not as good as in home studio or even in your living room.

i did a tremendous job for comparative research and I read on Profiler | Home a brief review of a forumer his treated room
IMO the alpha series is a huge disappointment in the world monitoring

From forumer EDM :
I hate closed sound so I eliminate the Alpha series from Focal immediately

from zigziglar

from zigziglar

So i think there is unjustified hype around Alpha 80 and Adam a7x while Yamaha remain above qualitatively not for nothing that the most rich studios buy them and use multi million $$ of room correction and accoustic. All these indices make me think that HS8 remain unbeatable in terms of quality audio reproduction even in the most expensive brands concurrent.

PS : i'm not a pro just a perfectionist guy who search since 2 year the absolute best bang for buck monitoring speacker for less than 1000 euros and there are too many gears to compare (oh sh*t it's a saturate market) and i have too little times (2 year i have lost in my life I would spend otherwise)

I hate compare gears it's a hell for perfectionists I assure you that is why we must find a winner once and for all !

http://imgur.com/YFecVM7 imo the HS8 win in neutrality

I don't think I've ever seen anyone saying the HS8 are the best studio monitor at any price range....

I've also not heard of any multi million $$ studios using HS8's. I think they are a good mid range (price wise) monitor and I like them ( I own a pair) but I've heard more expensive monitors which I prefer in the studio at my university for example, I just can't afford them in my home studio.

The NS10's are used in many studio because they are notoriously unforgiving ("if it sounds good on these it will sound good on anything") but yea not heard of HS8's being used in top end studios - would be interested to see otherwise though

Also, testing monitors over YouTube doesn't count as testing monitors because

a) the microphone used might be bad
b) the room might sound bad
c) the mic might be in the wrong place
d) YouTube compresses the hell out of audio

etc etc etc the list goes on. If you want to test monitors you have to do it in real life, and make a judgement call based on the listening environment not being ideal.

We all could have stopped reading right there.

However you dug yourself into an even deeper hole with:

So listening for monitoring details on a YouTube stream is, um, less amateur?
Good one.

No you didn't do a tremendous job, sorry.
You're relying way too much on what people say on the internet as opposed to trusting your own ears.


Ok, well, that's a result of your own time-management issues I suppose.

In due time you will learn that it really doesn't work that way.
I assure you there is no clear 'winner', you pick what works for you, in your studio, for your type of music, and more importantly, you learn the monitors you have over time.

Best of luck, really.

edit:

You want a winner for the smallish room producer? Here's one, the JBL LSR305.
I have a small/med room, and yeah, I too read a bunch of monitor reviews, and was a bit cynical at all the positive ones for the JBL LSR305.
I even snubbed at them at first thinking, seriously, a $300/pair set of monitors is reeling in this much hoo-ha?
I ended up with a pair and yes, in my treated room, they are everything people say they are and even more.
That said, they may sound mediocre in your room.

You can't be serious.......And you're saying the guy with the positive opinion on the 308 must be a JBL shill because he (more than likely) actually owns them/heard them in person and didn't rely on youtube videos to reach a conclusion on which studio monitor is more precise/neutral/natural? Wut?


LOL. I can't even......

What is this supposed to show? LOL.

OP trolling. Right?

This is crazy from the jump. HS8 is not even close to the most accurate monitor out there. Solid option in its price range, but not more than that.

And listening to monitor test on YouTube? Ha. Over hearing them in person for yourself? Double HA.

Good luck to the OP.

Sorry for the delay.



This kind of forum is not suitable for trolling I remind you that I am a passionate by music and audio gear i want create my home studio in future I do not have time or energy to troll

I'm just someone suspicious in nature about hype I want to be "redpilled" and not "bluepilled" about the reality.

He'll have to find the time to listen and look at a good music store in Paris because I see that there is no reliable way to compare by review and opinion on internet without being severely criticized by angry fanboys of their speackers model.

I I try to show the hypothesis that the Alpha 80, LSR308 and Adam a7x are "hifish" speacker comparate than HS8 many opinions on forums say they have bump on their spectrum after the factory.

I wonder if after a software/hardware calibration they could surpass the HS8 in terms of audio fidelity and neutrality.

This an advice i read on reddit mixer board : So sorry if I was able to shock with this thread but I like to expose my ideas and concerns freely and I'm not the hype around a product without compare and think for a lot of money is at stake during purchase 'professional speaker.

Sorry for my english.

Your english is fine, btw.

The concern we had was the overwhelming amount of info you think you had dug up in regards to something that is so subjective to begin with.
Sure, it's a discussion board and you are totally entitled to throw around some quotes form this or that place, and even more so your own opinions.
However, when it comes to monitors, all this stuff you read online, stuff you see and hear on YouTube, etc, at the end of the day mean absolutely nothing.

Everyone hears thing differently, makes different types of music, in different sounding rooms, with different instruments, etc, a set of A7X may sound great in your room but horrible in mine, with the music I choose to make.

Reviews are not a bad place to start and gather some initial opinions, but if you want to make music and start producing, then just go get some monitors.
Go hear them for yourself with some your favorite mixes from artists you love, not on friggin' YouTube or based on JoeBean123's opinion on some pro audio forum.

That's really what it comes down to.

Sure, I may not have ended up with my JBL 305s if it weren't for the overwhelming positive reviews about them, of course that would sway anyone's decision to at least try them.
I wanted the A7X but I went with my gut and ears on these, saved about $900 in the process and haven't looked back once.

Now I could go on about Yammies or Dynaudios or KRK or ADAMs or whatever speaker-du-jour is making the discussion rounds on the internet, but fack, what a wast of time, and just as you said, you claim to have 'wasted' 2 years of your life doing this dismal research, for what?

You get a computer, a DAW, an interface, some monitors, some acoustic treatment, and more importantly, get inspired and start producing.

That chart displays the type of potential speaker behavior/preferences. Where are your measurements to corroborate your claims about aforementioned speakers?

Have you mixed on any of them?

You claim you just watched some youtube videos, and read some comments on Reeddit. That's the proof? IMHO. That's not enough.

Lets agree that one of the most important aspects of a studio monitor are to enable the mix translate well to other listening environments.

The Yamaha monitors, to my ears, emulate a hi-fi sound, some what heightened in the mids and highs as well as the lows with scoops between the mids and the highs, and another scoop between the lows and the mids.

This way you hear the highs, the mids, and the lows but what you are hearing is not a true representation, but it sounds good and adapts well to the Fletcher Munsen curve for hearing, so that at low volumes you can hear audio reasonably well.

This is similar to many headphones, especially the in ear variety and hi-fi for the home, which accentuate the same lows, (possibly mids) and highs.

However I have never really liked the Yamaha sound, it just does not sound cohesive - real. The speakers never disappear, they leave an imprint on the sound that says - Hey - you are now listening to music on a stereo system (stereo was once the colloquial word for hi-fi, a while back). For most people this is an excellent sound, this is what they are familiar with, and similar to the sound that may be heard by most of those who playback their productions.

Nevertheless in more recent times, the speaker technologies have become more accurate that they do much more to "disappear", leaving you with much more of the audio and much less of the speaker.

If you are producing music for a future when the quality of audio systems will have improved significantly, due to advances from research and would like you audio to still stand up to scrutiny, and critical listening, I would not recommend any Yamaha monitors, the HSX, the HSXX or the MSP series. Speaker technology has definitely moved on from these benchmarks of yesteryears.

From what i have read and heard, the Yamaha HS7 are the closest thing on the market today to the original NS10. I own a pair of HS7 myself, and they are extremely flat, honest, and accurate. you can hear every little detail, and if there are any imerfections in your mix, they pretty much throw it in your face. This is a great quality in monitors, and in my experience, if it sounds good on these it'll sound good on pretty much anything. I personally think the HS8 has a little bit too much bottom end to be truly accurate, but im sure if you adjusted to their freq. response you can compensate for that. I personally do not like the Adam A7x, but there is something to be said for a high end pair of speakers with ribbon tweeters!

cheers!

This is a really great explanation of these speakers. I never thought of it like that, but this is exactly how they sound.

Btw saying that Alpha series sounds boxy is bull**** to me.
I had a chance to listen to 65's and i'm using LSR 308 everyday. Heard HS8 a while ago.
I'd say LSR 308 > Focal > HS8, but mind that's just to my ears. Focals were nicest to listen to but details were a little buried in there. Mixing on the LSR's however is much easier.
The Yammies sounded simply unpleasant and fatiguing to me.

I compared extensively several cheap speakers to the PSI Audio A17 worth £3k and the only one that came close was the Adam A7X. It sounded rather scooped in comparison but the clarity and detail was all there.
The Focals CMS 65 were the next ones down, maybe a bit more natural in the upper midrange but slightly less detailed IMO.
Make of that what you will.

You should just listen to the speakers you are considering and decide for yourself what to get- preferably in the room you will be working in. I checked out a bunch of options and landed with NS-10's paired with ADAM a77x. Any studio I go to for mixing has NS-10's, which all pretty much sound the same to me to a certain degree. I've heard all the new Yamaha stuff, sounds nothing like NS-10's. Definitely wouldn't say the new HS7's or HS8's are anything like NS-10s. I see one user has described them as such, and also describes his HS7's as having a flat response. I'll post a picture of the NS-10 freq response, which is FAR from flat, but you know this if you've heard NS-10's, or even better, A/B'd the pair.

You need to listen to speakers with nothing between you and them but air. A mic'ed set of speakers in a control room, then compressed to video, then uploaded to youtube, and you're making the comparison by doing this?? Dude... just go to guitar center or something and bring your ipod. Adam A77x ribbon tweeters have response up to around 50kHz... check out any youtube video of white/pink noise through a spectrum analyzer and see what you get.

Check out the MAD dip and peak between the 400Hz-1.5kHz range!!!

Yeah, but that's about price and availability.

Ironically was JUST having this convo with a friend. The NS10's are the ABSOLUTE UN-ARGUED studio standard. But there is a catch, they are not easy to come by a "natural" pair. Frequently, after paying a fortune, you are getting monitors with upgraded/modded parts and that's really a dilemma. Modded/tweeter replace NS10's are NOT NS10's.

So again, it comes down to price. For the money, the 7's and 8's are a fantastic value. No, they are not NS10's, but I've covered that

Years we did the pepsi challenge with monitors (back when it was hsm 80's???) and of what we heard those were good. I've heard the 7's/8's are a tad more accurate. Yeah, I think that they are easier to listen to (which doesn't mean your mixes will be perfect) but AGAIN...price point.

I don't know the focals. The Adams were impressive (not sure if they've changed anything since back then)

It's like buying a house. Get the largest/best home in the BEST neighborhood for the price. If price is an issue, then you'll have to settle one way or the other. If you can get NS10's, a good amp to power them and they are not ****ty/modded versions.....It's going to be the best option by far. There is a very specific reason they are so sought after, there is common ground. If you can mix with those, it'll likely be at least decent in cars/iphones/etc.

I've used ns10s quite a bit as well as many other monitors but for what's it's worth I am getting my best most balanced mixes ever using hs8's. I highly recommend this monitor. I find them to be pleasing to listen to as well as neutral enough to get it done. No hissing problem like the previous model and absolutely no fatigue. I could have put far more expensive monitors in my studio but I chose the hs8's for all of the reasons I just listed. By the way I feel that ns10s are highly overrated. I've never had the best of luck with them and always found myself switching to the dynaudio's at the studio I was working at, but I prefer the hs8's even to the dyn's.

I guess you want a job in mixing/recording studio?

Just a joke. I will give you one advice. Keep the music as a hobby. You will be more creative. You will make the music you like/want to listen. When you are in industry, even iff you make 5 albums, after that you are finish (most people are at least).

I don't know for mixing, but i will tell you what you need to do to be composer/producer.

To be creative and making a good music, you need at least 20 years of production (and there is no shortcut for that). You want to be commercial all the time? Yes, you can be some local star and have a "summer" single once a year (that is top of the cake for most).. They (and us) would be better off iff they would make music for hobby and not making commercial c*ap (like iff that matters).

The best would be that you forget mastering (there is no purpous for that, in that period at least) and especcialy EDM (too simple, too repetitive, too commercial, stupid melodies etc etc).

You have monitors for mastering and production. I dig for production.

Cheers.

I'm really LOL when people say that HS series ( HS7 in special ) are the next ns-10. They are totally opposite. HS are mostly neutral speaker with very low level of detail ( yes, flat but do not reveal as their competitors ) and have one of the WORST time domain accuracy in the monitor world; ns-10 are every possible thing but not neutral, they are revealing in detail and have the best time domain accuracy of all times ( there are probably a few ones with better one but are several times more expensive). I had HS80 about 8 years ago and are the only monitor I have been regretted buying.

I guess someone have a buddy in Yamaha... ;d

This must be the most idiotic comment about music making i ever read.

To be creative, you need ideas, and surely being a good producer is good to put up quality stuff out, but musical ideas come BEFORE all that crap!
20 years? Hell, tell that to The Beatles when they did their first record...

People often forget the most important thing is music: the song, the lyrics, the performance, the quality of the singer (hopefully even before freaking melodyne or autotune), the quality of the instruments, and the quality of the musicians playing those instruments, then the arragement, the instrumentation, and only then the recording, and only then the mixing, and the mastering. You see where and when the "producah" comes on this? Come on man...

Best songs ever come from a kid with a guitar or a keyboard, or an ukulele, and his voice, his heart, and his mind with a dream.

Folks have everything wrong in the last 10 years.

I wrote my way. You wrote Beatles way. Which is your way? There isn't one, isn't it? ;p

Whatever man...

I come to this conclusion because when i am composing, i use the most simple setup.
I mean, i can have a big computer, 3 monitor setups, the best daw, the most exquisite pre-amps, the most amazing mikes, and could the best broducer in the world, and yet, to get the most important part of a song, i'm using a piano patch and my voice. Thats it. I might aswell be in my living room with a digital piano, paper and pen. Or (if i played) a guitar, paper and pen.

But anyway, i'm from "that time" (and i like to think it wasn't long ago) where people separated the song development, from the recording, from the mixing, from the mastering, spending days in a studio to get what you do today in a couple of hours. And at that time, you could notice a good song from its melody and harmony. Today you're freaking lucky if a song has melody, and an harmonic progression with more than 2 chords.

Spot on. ^

Spot on again. ^^

Great post.

I'm reluctant to even justify the OP'er's "observations" with a comment but there are, maybe a couple of interesting things that come up later on.

This idea/notion/goal of a "flat" frequency response is an interesting one. What really got me going on this is the Sonarworks HP plug-in which is supposed to exactly "compensate" for the "rocky mountain range" original frequency response of a particular headphone making it "flat." But, what is really interesting to me is that "flat" on one set of headphones is completely different than on another set AND does not make an inferior set of phones any more usable as a mixing set of headphones. Sonarworks also makes the same plug-in for speakers so this can also be extrapolated to speakers as well. "Flat" doesn't necessarily make good.

Everything starts with what you are hearing in the room. The loudspeakers + the room = they are inseparable.

I am now seriously exploring hi-end headphones and so far am really loving this option....I'm taking the room out of the equation completely....if you've got an untreated room, lack proper bass traps, room is not symmetrical, or, a myriad of other acoustics related issues, your monitors will lie to you.

I am guessing You are using Apple? What will You do with bunch of pino and voice songs that are flooding the radio and television theese days? I hope You are not writing for kidergarden, as most of them.. To me the melody is also on the first place, but I can switch between electric and acoustic guitar in a moment and can hear the same melody from another angle.

Iff You are really talented, I support one instrument player/vocal with some vocals and violin players in the background, plus one more acoustic guitar for example. In other situations it is bad example. That's why I sad that the music is a hobby for most. Iff You are making bad example, You are not a pro.

I am not start making music untill i make at least 3-5 good melodies....

Cheers.

Wow, one of the most convoluted and down right incomprehensible posts I've ever read - regarding the true essence of why we make music.

You've transformed this into a pissing match of what being 'pro' is, or means.
How the way you approach making music is more valid than his or anyone else's, with your 3-5 good melodies?
Oh and the best bit, assuming he's using an Apple? wtf....lol.

What does that have to do with writing a good song?
What does a good song have to do with kindergarten, or whether it's just a guitar or piano, or fully produced, what? Tell us?
A good song is a good song, period.

I could attend a band-du-jour concert, and walk out feeling absolutely nothing.
I can then go to some little café, see one guy with one guitar sing his heart out and make me cry.

Why do we make music, why do YOU make music?

You're gone need a bigger shovel at the rate you're digging yourself into this narrow minded hole of yours.

Well and the most odd thing is that I haven't talked about Pro Vs Amateur thing... I only commented on side of music making.

I really don't give a shait to the Pro vs Amateur talk. I've been on both sides, i'm on the middle now. Is that what makes you a pro, that you get paid for what you do? Then sometimes, I'm a pro, other times, i'm not. But i always do music with all the love, and willl and put always the same strenght on it, whether i get paid, or not.

My idea about music is, and the reason that i do it is because i love it. I really have fun doing it. If i get paid in the end even better.