Hey guys,

I have not produced any electronic music before, so I'm a total beginner. I like the idea of going the software route (DAW + midi controller) and have my eyes set on M-Audio Axiom Pro 61.

It's a lot harder to select a good DAW though, given I'm not sure what I'm looking for (besides the ease of use). If it helps, I have a Mac laptop, my budget is under 500, and my favorite bands are CutCopy, M83 and Crystal Castles.

Thanks so much,
I put my trust in you slutz
Taya.

This is my opinion:

Get Logic Pro, an Apogee Duet 2, and any cheap 61 key USB-MIDI controller.

In my opinion you don't need the Axiom Pro to make electronic music - it has semi-weighted keys which are awesome to record "real" music or piano improvisations or orchestral mockups or anything that requires high levels of expression, but for electronic music, it's actually an impediment - you need the opposite, a very light, very fast "plastic" keyboard action to program fast sequenced riffs, program drums, fast synth lines etc.

If you're on a Mac logic or even GarageBand would be easy to work with

take a look at soniccore xite-1
the best all-in-one daw software/dsp/soundcard.

take a look at Novation remote sl zero mk1 or mk2
automap is a joy with vst plugins.

old Yamaha cbx-k2 its old but the best small size midi (no usb) keyboard ive had.
or a decent old Yamaha synth has good keys.

Mackie c4 pro ...

low end...
take a look at propellerheads Reason 3/4/5/6
free rebirth 338 v2.01
ardour mixbuss harrison console
frutyloops
renoise

Muon 303 emulation.
t-racks 3
izotope ozone & stut ter
gforce
etc...

If you are serious, ease of use shouldnt really be a major concern...

I mean, how many musical instruments are easy to learn? Maybe the triangle?

Get Ableton and Komplete and take the time to really learn them...

Its only a grand, a good violin or saxophone costs what, 3-5 times that minimum?

I would start with good groove box.

Korg ESX1 or EMX1 are just $500 new. Plenty of electronic sounds and effects on board. Very easy to use.

When you'll be ready to track something down to your laptop, the GarageBand is waiting for you there already.
You gonna need a simple midi box to get sync out of laptop tho. So, get one. You'll get "dirty" with the real midi.

Once you've mastered this setup you'll be pretty much in good understanding what does it mean really (~Good DAW~).

I am loving ni maschine, its got sounds, great feel and versatility to sequence full songs. Then you can perform them and remix in real time.

It will double as a midi controller too. It will slave to logic, protools etc if you want but you almost dont need them. Wish I had started with maschine than a keyboard controller, pricey though if on a budget, can get one around 500 on sale.

Very easy to use, finger drumming is the sh!t!

Its all over youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdFlF...e_gdata_player

I use Cubase myself but Logic and Ableton are more popular. I would reccomend downloading the demo/light versions of these and playing around before you make a decision.

I also recommend getting an audio/midi interface at the same time. More important than buying an expensive controller. The interface will reduce latentcy, which is the delay that occurs between hitting a key and hearing the sound.

Guys - thanks for all your responses! Definitely lots of good info. I'm glad I came here to ask the questions.

Mr Varaldo - I think you make a great point about the weighed keys on the axiom. I will def have to pick a diff controller. The reason I liked it over the oxygen was because it had the pads. So I could control drums/sample placement better. Do you know a non-weighed controller with pads or should I just get oxygen 61 and a separate pad controller?

thronechild - ni maschine looks great, but I can't afford it if I get a decent DAW. I was hoping to get away with some pads on a midi controller or something like Akai MPD. Is there a huge difference between that and the maschine for a beginner?

DeathDub - Good idea. I'm gonna try to get trial versions of Cubase, Logic and Ableton and run through some demos to get an idea of what's it like. And the audio/midi interface you're talking about is the same thing as Apogee Duet that Mr Varaldo mentioned, right?

Taya.

Get yourself a copy of renoise and reaktor and you're set .

I say get a 61 key basic MIDI controller with a few assignable knobs and faders. Get a different controller later. I've had the axiom, and the mpk49. Both have pads, and those pads gather the most dust out of all the controller. You'll find that sequencing your drums in the box is not a difficult feat. When you want your workflow to increase, spend some more money at a later date.

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You can get away with pads on a controller, cheap controllers can have a less than desirable feel if your drumming for hours. If you go that route get logic, which comes with loads of instruments and effects. I have used cubase and logic and prefer logic by far.

Maschine will slave to garage band which you can track vocals or external instruments, but you can do entire tracks with in maschine and not feel like you need anything else. You can track vocals and guitars, place them in the song and go, but it is an extra step in maschine. That's where garage band comes in, which your already have. It works a little easier to sample or resample your self then slice and perform. everything can be done from the controller on maschine, you dont even need to look at the computer which makes it feel like an instrument. Its also super easy to do, you dont need to perform anything you can build your tracks one sound at a time.

If on a budget, I would do maschine and add logic later after getting used to tracking and mixing in garage band. logic, cubase and abelton all have a learning curve, maschine and garage band are pretty easy to start with. most of the videos show hip hop or dance music, I use it in a indie rock alternative type project. Very versatile.

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get yourself ableton live. great app

ableton would be a good choice


though in truth most DAWS will do what you want it just takes investment from you


but a majority of EDM producers use Ableton, even if its alongside another DAW, its a great tool and instrument

I use Pro Tools, but that's because I do my creating elsewhere. From everything I've read and people I've talked to, you can't go wrong with Logic, especially since you have a Mac.

As for controllers, as another poster said, get something basic. I've never heard one good thing about those pads. I've got the Axiom Pro 61, and I don't think i've ever touched those pads. Besides, that's a heavy duty controller (features wise) and would be over your head at this point. Over mine, too.heh

It looked pretty, so I bought it. it's good that you're doing research first.

go read up on some Logic reviews. I've never really heard anything bad about it.

if you get reason 6 you wont have to get another thing ever again. Eerything you could ever want is there and the only boundry is pretty much your own imagination and creativity.

well, it's hard to know if someone's serious at this stage of the game. Even so, I think ease of use is an EXCELLENT reason to buy something. it's all about getting your creation out of your head and onto "tape" no?

really, any DAW will work. people make hits on all of them, including FL Studio. So, whatever is easiest to use/learn will allow the user to make music that much more quickly. Hey, the OP could always get a NeKo and be done with it. LOL

that's a huge debate. but I've read some good things about it. the only drawback to it, that I can see, is that it doesn't have MIDI out. you can't control anything with it. if you ever wanted to get some hardware, you'd need to buy a sequencer. OTOH, it is a pretty complete product. you can even "master" with it. I have Reason 4 and it's really easy to use.

I think Logic is by far the best bang for the buck. The plug-ins and instruments all for $499.00. That's amazing.

All of the DAWs today are pretty incredible, but the value of Logic really put's it in front.

Taya, if you want to stick with M-Audio, they have a non-Pro version of the Axiom that has a somewhat lighter action (even though the latest ver.2 version of the Axiom has a heavier action than the ver.1) that has the pads. There are lots of other MIDI controllers on the market that have pads, including the M-Audio Axiom 61, Roland A-800 Pro, Akai MPK61, Novation 61SL Mk II. They all have different keyboard actions, so you might want to go to your local music store and see which you like better. If you don't need 61 keys, you can also consider the new Alesis QX49 (not the old Q49, the previous model had not-so-good keyboard action imho) - the QX49 is inexpensive and has a very good, light, synth-like action- or the new Novation Nocturn 49, or the new Novation Impulse series. Basically the best thing is to go actually play all the controllers at your local store and pick the one it "feels" the best to your fingers. Also note, that like the others have already said, you don't need the pads to program good drum lines... you can do it from the keys.

Yes, you do need a "proper" external audio card. You can get by at the beginning with the 1/8" minijack that comes with every computer, but there is a big difference in terms of audio quality and latency when you upgrade to a proper external audio interface.

And I have to agree with Jim... I've pretty much had them all... tried almost all DAWs... and I have to admit, it's very, very difficult to find a better value than Logic. Great sound out of the box, amazing synths / sampler built in, high-quality effects... it just sounds good.

Lily Allen's "The Fear" (a top hit song) was done entirely in Logic (it's one of the demo files) for example

Yea... right. You just open any DAW... Protools, Logic, Fruity Loops, Sonar ...
Just create some tracks with few clicks ... Then open a mixer, put some plugins in no particular order, push few faders with the mouse... then you send it to itunes, shot some video on the weekend with your friends... put it on youtube... and ... BAM! you've got a HIT!

It's just as easy ... people doing that all the time.

Hello...

Quote:
"I have not produced any electronic music before, so I'm a total beginner."

Ableton

Logic

Reason

Fruityloops

Why not go all the way.
Cubase and Reaktor.
That's what the big boys use in Psytrance, Progressive and Full On.

Hmmm... Everything EXCEPT for the hardware ie, microphone, channel strip and compressor!
Considering that major audio capture management choice made right there any DAW would do!
Because what's what people really hear in Pop? The voice.
Any DAW would do for electronic music is the truest comment so far.
Except maybe for PT which has limited MIDI capacity. MIDI is a big part of electronic music.
Why not try Reaper? It's free and not crap. I don't know any hit records made on it but the users seem to like it.
I prefer Cubase for my day-to-day.
Whatever you chose to use you'll get the results you seek.

It's true that you can make electronic music on almost any DAW (and even Pro Tools, with the later versions, has great MIDI capabilities). I am suggesting Logic because the OP has a Mac and limited experience with electronic music. I think the combo Mac laptop + Duet 2 + Logic would be hard to beat to start learning on, because I find Logic much user-friendly than - say - Ableton Live, Cubase or Pro Tools which have a steeper learning curve - and Apogee is market leader of proven quality in the field of audio interfaces, and interfaces perfectly with Logic.

Besides, for what I can tell, Logic is used by a large number of electronic artists, there is a reason for that.

Ha ha ha,
I've been using Cubase since 1990.
I found Logic to just try so hard to not be like Cubase it has it's own learning curve steepness.
Learning curves depend on the user. There's no standard way we learn and therefore no way to gauge who will learn what faster in DAW world.

Ableton Live. Done.

i'm sick

^^^ I agree. Live is probably the most fun to use. I have Logic but hardly ever use it and I use reason because that's what I started on so I can get ideas out fast, but as of right now I think Live is the most forward thinking of all DAW's. I have the Reaper demo too but I see no point in using it because I have the aforementioned DAW's. I've always wanted to try ProTools but given that they just released 10 and it doesn't really offer anything of interest to me I will hold off for now. Honestly I hope Apple gets their but in gear and starts going more in the direction that Live is going or something better. I do think Logic (once you get to grips with the basics) is very intuitive and easy to use though.

It really depends on your intention...

If you are thinking you want to stick with this, then I'd encourage you to go with a DAW platform that is more of an industry standard, or at least one that is based on the basic that will allow you to more easily go from one DAW to the other.

For those reasons, I'd suggest: Logic or Pro Tools (if purely electronic, I'd lean towards Logic). If you're already a musician and see yourself doing more than electronic and want to go into studios, etc, then Pro Tools.

If you want fast results and just good gratification, the Reason is good, along with good sound and sample packs... And if you'r really just looking for fun, then I'd go for Garage Band and some sample packs.

If you're leaning towards or come from the DJ world, I might suggest Albeton.

Some DAWs are more specialized than others, so for a first (again, depending on your intent), I'd go with something a bit broader based, Logic is a solid choice.

Try not to get wrapped up into people's personal DAW crusades, they all do the same thing really. Make music.


Hope that helps.

-andrews