I run a recording studio and also play in a couple of bands who use my studio. I’ve essentially offered to be the “label” and front the costs of the studio (as the investor) but in exchange for “points” or publishing splits. Has anyone ever done this type of agreement/arrangement before? I realize that it’s most likely a worse deal for myself (rather than just getting paid up front) but this is the kind of situation where I’d like to be helpful and make it mutually beneficial - and if anything ever DID happen with one of the songs it could be a good thing.

Basically they get free recording up front - but I’d like to own some publishing/rights to royalties. I realize this will be very little unless something big happens. Only a couple of the songs do I already have songwriting credits on (most I don’t). Also, how would this be handled when you have a song with 4 songwriters already? Is there any kind of template or worksheet that is standard for filling all of this out?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Especially dumbing it down as much as possible. Thanks!

This is an interesting topic I've been getting into the last years...

In my situation I am currently looking to "decouple" my situation of being both producer and also offering a fully fledged recording studio with the goal of getting points AND being able to charge the artists for the studio time to cover my running costs.

So far, I've only been given percentages with collecting societies (GEMA/Suisa/Ascap) for songs where I got involved with the writing. But I feel that for my work as a producer I need to start getting points for what I bring to the table. Of course this doesn't apply to all gigs, especially when everyone knows what they're playing and I just record / mix and make it sound good. But there are many sessions where I also tell musicians what to play, play instruments myself, work on getting sounds, add production elements or even rewrite complete songs.

It would be interesting to see how other studio owners operate their business. At least on my part I can say that I have no interest of starting a label, already swamped with work as is running a one man show here.

nobody gets points anymore as far as I know, that's for god level producers like quincy jones or brian eno, you could negotiate it but don't expect to have the next thriller album, is it even worth having 1% of a tiny royalty income? It will only work if you have produced a huge amount of commercially successful albums. anyway, you might find the musicians union website useful, there are quite a few free contract templates e.t.c, takes some digging but there are some good documents on there..

Points are not publishing.

Points are royalties on the recording copyright itself - the master. Record label pays for recordings, takes bulk of payment from record, pays artist a royalty once they've recouped their advance.

It's from this chunk of money the producer gets points. It's standard for anyone producing a record for a label to get 1.5% of this money - certainly not just super-producers. I have it on anything I've done for a major; sure, most of it makes nothing but I make a good chunk per quarter from one record. It's kinda pointless to do with independent artists though, but get it in writing because if someone gets a major unexpected hit you'll be due a payday.

I have a couple of acts I develop who I charge less and keep 20% of their master. I believe in them and they work hard to justify my investment; might never pay off but it's something I want to do.

Publishing is different. Publishing is the song itself. If I have 20% of the publishing of a song, then I get 20% of the royalties (depending on if I'm published or not), whoever performs it, records it, whatever.

In this case - it's the latter. You get to register a chunk of the song as "yours" even if you didn't write it, in lieu of a fee. It's not unheard of; it is unlikely to generate any cash, but it's also easy to do because it's all handled via collection agencies. I have chunks of a bunch of different released songs (in my case I have written on them all, but it doesn't really matter; the process is the same), and you just get your quarterly payment (or not).

So - I think your advice is confused here. It's fine to do, and easy to do, but the one thing we agree on is it's not going to generate any money unless there's a big hit!

thanks for posting!
would this be something you have set in a production contract signed before the act get's into the studio, or is it so common knowledge (in the US I assume) so that this would not even be discussed?

Depends.

Independent acts - I'd discuss it first. Impress that you're not going to be chasing them up for the occasional $5, it's more about being able to claim if something goes huge.

Major label stuff - it'll be assumed. If you're hired for a production, it'll be in your production agreement. If you're producing on spec, and hoping they'll use your production (and thus pay you), it'll be part of the fee discussed.

That's worldwide, not US-centric.

Really just depends who your clients are.

But again - production agreements are nothing to do with publishing, although the producer might also be a writer. Sometimes producers write a song with an artist, and then someone else does the final production...the producer still gets the publishing, they might not get a production fee.

Years ago I worked with a guy who had taken a punt on working on some awful country record for no money up front.

That record sold a million. He got a nice house in Malibu.

Roll the dice!

Maybe you'd look at keeping Mechanical Rights or similar?

IMHO, trading a one time fee for some sort of permanent ownership is usually a bad deal, for the bands in this case. If it were me, I'd at least put a limit on the payout or have scaling terms for media that ends up having a long term lifespan.

It can happen!


The thing (as I say) about mechanicals is there's no real way of auditing or enforcing it without a proper contract that costs $$$s.

If (for example) you have a piece of paper that says you get 20% of whatever the band gets if they make money..if they manage to fluke a sync for $10k, you might see $2k. If they sign a major label deal, you might get the same cut from their advance.

OR they might stiff you, and it'll probably cost you more than you stand to earn in legal fees, making it not worth it.

However - if you have a chunk of the publishing as well, it's registered with the collection agencies. No-one can dispute it (well, not without massive legal expense on THEIR part), the label has nothing to do with it, the band's publisher doesn't need to do anything...it's all in hand thanks to collection agencies.