My Adam P-22A's are really cool and I have pulled some pretty good mixes on them but I am really starting to think they are too big for my tiny weeny mix room.. I'm looking at getting some new nearfields to replace them. Not after techtonic shifting bass response or bat hearing highs...

I'm after something in the vain of NS-10's "if it sounds good on these it will sound great on anything all the meat is in the mids" kind of vibe..

not interested in specs.. just want very radio mix freindly nearfields..

thanks!

just saw an ad from yamaha, they are release something looks similar to NS10, they said it's a alternative choice or something that replace NS10

Yamaha has a new range of white cone nearfiled things.. which is strange because I thought the reason for discontinuing the NS10s was the availabilty/cost of the white stuff on the woofers.

you mean these: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HS80M/reviews/

yeah.. umm.. looks like marketing hype to me. I'd rather go with something that is trusted in the industry. Yamaha is trading on the NS-10's appearance in this case, not their sound.

but thanks for the suggestion...

awhile back, people were saying the tannoy reveals were it, but that talk has all dried up it seems.

Kinda like how 5 years ago, everybody, magazines, and their grandma said the Event 20/20's and Mackie HR824's were the shit, and now everybody is saying they're shit. Makes you wonder if guys working at GC spread this kind of stuff.

Remo,

that's exactly what I was looking for a long time. It seems hard to find.
I gave up to find one speaker I ended up with a combination of three:

1. new B&W 705 (they sound nice, maybe to nice, but nearly flat above 80 Hz and it's fun working on 'em)
2. NS-10M (bought them again; used to hate them but then found out what they where good for: to know what's left on the radio in the kitchen; and for € 300 a pair I just couldn't walk by)
3. Fostex PM-2 (they're like Big Hifi Speakers and are showing what's going on below 80 Hz - even though my room is too small for such frequencies to develop)

I found out to dislike most of the active speakers. I don't know why. I guess either the built-in amps are cheap or the designers can't stand the opportunity to manipulate the sound electronically. And that's what surely didn't happen with the old NS-10.

Auratones

Peep this http://www.moultonlabs.com/articles/94startover2.htm

last I heard, the ns10's are what replaced the auratones... also heard they aren't so pertinent these days. anybody care to clarify?

all I know from first hand experience is the entire A&R department for Sony Australia each have a set of NS-10's for evaluating demos. I found that very interestng. My Adam's are great, but in all honesty they are huge for my room, more mid fields IMO..

still not many NS-10 replacement suggestions.... auratones are good but I would not mix on them alone..

Were'nt NS-10s used to represent the "average" home listening set-up? ie: average bookshelf speakers. If you're looking to monitor on a system that translates to your average home system, I might suggest setting up a 5.1 (and use 2.1 of it) in addition to mixing on full range monitors.

Most consumers are using tiny satellites with a sub these days. Same if they have speakers hooked up to their computers. The age of bookshelf speakers in the living room has past.

I'm really targeting radio friendly mixes... so I don't really think I need a 2.1 or 5.1 setup. Just want whatever NS-10's offer in something I can buy today.. probably passive I'm thinking... any model suggestions?

I'm willing to part with my pair of NS10s if anyone is interested send me a PM

The new Yammys sound NOTHING like the NS10s. The new designs are ported, not sealed, powered not passive, on and on. I listened to these guys and was really disappointed. The sound absolutely *horrible* imho. Nothing like NS10s. Not even similar. Nothing remotely like the NS10s.

Yes they have "white" woofers, but they are cheap polypropylene (plastic) woofers and not the doped paper like the NS10s.

Like I said, they are NOTHING like the NS10s. It is 100% marketing hype.

these boxes..?





yeah it's true, every label & a&r dept you walked into in the 90's had NS10's, prolly why everyone used them so much cos they knew the same speakers would be auditioning the material in companies

You've got it backwards;

Studios were using them beginning in the early 80's
Record labels caught on well afterwards, and merely copied the trend


p.s.

Does your mother know you visit Rotten.com? tutt

heh

I've heard a couple people say the original Alesis M1 is close to an NS10M, I've never heard them, so I can't confirm this.

I think NS-10s had two things going for them. First of all, they suck. But they suck in a very useful way. To make things sound good on NS 10s, you really have to work. They aren't going to help. And when things sound good on them, it tends to translate very well.

Second, they achieved critical mass as studio standards. Anywhere you go, you find whatever the studio has, plus NS-10s. So there is a constant point of reference. Before NS10s, it was the truly awful JBL 4311. I don't see anything right now that has that kind of universal acceptance.

wharfedale diamonds are supposed to have that honky midrange, I havent tried them but I'm seriously thinking about it.


the funny thing about ns10's and auratones is they were designed to be crappy home stereo speakers, so buy some crappy home stereo speakers.

I see auratones going for $400 on ebay and it they are literally a shitty little radio shack style paper woofer in a box.

NS-10's on ebay would be the closest. Seriously.

As far as how they became so popular, here's one perspective:

Bob Clearmountain mixed these albums in quick succession...

Rolling Stones Miss You ('78)
Rolling Stones Tattoo You ('81)
Roxy Music Avalon ('82)
Bryan Adams Cuts Like A Knife ('83)
David Bowie Let's Dance ('83)
Huey Lewis + the News Sports ('83)
Bruce Springsteen Born In the USA ('84)
Bryan Adams Reckless ('84)
Simple Minds Once Upon a Time ('85)
The Pretenders Get Close ('86)
INXS Kick ('87)
Bryan Adams Into the Fire ('87)

Somewhere around Born In the USA + the Summer of Bob (where rock radio was playing five or more BC mixes back to back) the engineering community was heard en-mass to say:


What the F*#K is this guy doin' we ain't?


One of the more obvious answers was he was using consumer grade (WTF!?!!) bookshelf (huh?) speakers made by Yamaha called NS-10s


Across the globe engineers were heard running to their home stereo stores.


Of course, Bob's brilliant + that's WTF he's really doin'.

And obviously Yamaha was never heard objecting either.

But I've got a pair + love them. I spend much of my day on them + my mixes do translate amazingly well to many different systems when they sound good on the NS-10s.

Hey Charles,

You forgot about Chic Le Freak.

That's what helped him get the Rolling Stones gig.

They wanted that sound on their record(remember it was the late 70's and Disco and orgies at Studio 54 was king).

Mick J was always there(as well as every superstar who loved drugs and group sex).

Also left out of your list was Hall and Oates another group which sold millions of records.

NS-10's were designed to be "most like what the average speakers in average home or car listening situations would sound like" ... maybe even by accident.

By the end of the 1970's what most people had hooked up to their home stereos were 2-way speaker cabinets. Sony. JBL. Sears. Radioshack. Pioneer. Advent. Bookshelf speakers. A certain kind of hump at 125hz-1k ... punchy

The NS-10 was the average of the average of the average. One step up from the "radio / AM car speaker " sound of Horrortones. One big step up, actually, that really was a cross-section of what most people were listening to music on.

You knew if the bass kicked on NS-10s, they would kick in apartments, in living rooms, in car stereos, everywhere.

Before the advent of iPods, people listened to cassette tapes in their car. Imagine that! I know it sounds antiquated now, but it's true. Cassette tapes. A tape deck in the dash of the car, or underneath. Some sort of god-awful 6 x 9 speakers in the back window, or in the front car-door panels. Pretty weird, eh?

Today's replacement for the NS-10 would probably be some sort of self-powered computer speaker, which would proably be best represented by the smaller Mackie 624's or the smaller Genlecs. Most people listen to music on computer speakers or through their iPod. Car stereos are anyone's guess, no standard except sub-woofering everything to hell. If the trunk-lid rattles off, the bass is just right.

I would guess the Events are also close. Any small (6") 2-way, self-powered speaker will be representative of what is happening today.

How do you listen to music?
How does your wife/girlfriend/boyfriend listen to music?
How do your friends listen to music?
How do your kids/nephew/niece listen to music?

Not what they are listening to, but how.

What is the average way that Joe and Jane Average listen to music?
iPod? Computer Speakers? Stereo TV? 5.1 ?


Basically, any speaker that duplicates Mp3 butchering is the speaker to have : )
If it sounds good Mp3'd, then it will probably sound good THX'd.

I see some Auratones that went for around $150 on eBay. They work alright for me.

They were not designed for this.

Again Yamaha had been giving away the NS10's speakers for free to the major studios as a promotional front for years before anyone new anything about them.

They were trying to make inroads into the studio market.

The fact that Bob C made them popular(because he mentioned it as an aside in Mixmag article) is an accident.

I have a pair of little M-Audio monitors that kinda approximate bookshelf speakers. The model is SP-something....I forget. I keep meaning to compare them to a set of NS-10's. I wonder if anyone else is using them.

I think we are in agreement, but just don't know it yet : )

yes, you are correct.... as reference monitors, which should act as reference for "what people are listening to at home" .... ie: average application. To reflect the common denominator. Sound reasonable on the widest range of average consumer speakers.

I did a survey of studios, back in 1985, and again in 1995. Based on the studio indexes in MIX magazine and telephone interviews with engineers and studio owners. Those indexes listed all studios for a particular region, and all the major equipment: Console, Playback, etc.

My published surveys revealed that most studios were using:

Urei built-in large monitor systems / JBL built-in systems - tied for most common
(yes, there were many, many other systems out there at the time, these were the ones most often listed. Often there were other custom-built speaker systems).

JBL 4311b as the most common "3-way" room speaker used for reference.
That was really surprising. About 75% of the studios in 1985 were using those.

Yamaha NS-10's were the most common near-field reference speaker.
I think it was well over 85% of all studios were mixing on these.

From a brief telephone survey with engineers, they said they were using the NS-10s because mixes that sounded good on those transferred the best to the highest number of other systems. You were well in the ballpark.



Producers and engineers still tracked with the large, built-in systems, but mixed almost exclusively on the NS-10s with some checking on the JBL 4311's.

How about these;

http://www.dacs-audio.com/Distributi...ramid_main.htm


?

Bob C. now likes to mix on some Apple Powered Speakers. See his website. Everybody go try to buy some right now! I want the pair i have to go up in value.

Great post fug!


It's really about how the listeners are playing back the files.

As another example, It seems like a good idea to convert all our mixes to mp3 and play them on computer speakers (with a sub) just to know how they will be heard on the other end.

He uses them as a reference(i have 2 pairs).

He still mixes on NS10's.

The majority of most mixers still mix on them.

And to answer the original question the answer is no.

For a while i was touting the Sequerra Met 7.7 Mk. V Monitor Loudspeaker as a replacement.

http://www.sequerra.com/electronics/data/met7.html

They have the pronounced midrange and a smoother tweeter.

But they still are no NS10's.

so essentially there is not ONE "go-to" monitor the industry has accepted as the new NS-10?

I know in the past few years the amount of studio monitors on the market has exploded but certainly people must have found a viable replacement by now??