Hello again,

I posted two mixes, one with side info and the other focused on center and am looking for feedback regarding the pros and cons of the soundstage.

https://audio.com/hadross/audio/t1281

https://audio.com/hadross/audio/t864

It’s a collection of 4 pairs, rainbow has all the widening character intact but with the Dancing I narrowed and suppressed all that to get a focused center.

Thanks

I am hoping that someone might give their opinion. I’m not sure if I want to have the stereo info or the more centered sound. Any opinion?

They both sound somewhat forward and dry to me - I’d scoop some of the low mids down around 200 to 400 hz to reveal some clarity.

As for width, they’re both useable, it’s a subjective decision, your choice - disclaimer: I’m listening on an I Pad Pro - I’m not getting a noticeable sense of space on either

One tip for more participation - when you’re asking for advice, be more clear and concise with your labeling - it’s “somewhere over the rainbow”, not rainbow, etc. It took me a couple of reads before I realized what you were looking for and what you were using for source material - the playing is nice.

I’m at a mixdown stage now and I’m hoping for opinions and thoughts just like yours, thank-you,
Chris

Very nice recordings!

For my personal taste, I far prefer the sound of the first link. It's more intimate and immediate, but still with plenty of space. If I were A-B-ing techniques to use in a studio session, for the vast majority of what I do, I'd pick A every time. They both sound really nice, though, and the Steinway B is an excellent choice for this kind of repertoire.

Progger, ‘A’ represents my instincts. ‘B’ is me trying to coax a focused center. It involved some image narrowing and attenuation on the closer AB pair, as well as some of the other elements. Thanks for your kind words.

That's very interesting, I hear "A" as much more focused for some reason. I'm also listening on (professional) headphones, for what it's worth, since I'm out on the road for gigs at the moment. Curious what the difference would be listening to my proper studio monitors.

‘A’ is Over the Rainbow, correct? For me it has 4 different sets of left/right info. I’m concerned if that is a problem or not. With Dancing I attenuated and narrowed elements.

One of the benefits of listening without knowing any of the individual factors involved in making a recording... is that I have no idea what the individual factors that went into the recording are. To me, "A" just sounds like a good piano on a good-sounding record. It's clear and clean but with depth and dimension, not too spread or dispersed. It just sounds like I prefer a recorded piano to sound. So whatever you did on that version, it's working for me. (And yes, that's "Over the Rainbow.")

Fantastic thanks!

Take my comments with a grain of salt, as I have limited experience. To me, on Somewhere Over the Rainbow the stereo image seems to move around a bit and seems a bit wide. It has a nice level of reverberation and depth while also providing focus. Dancing in the Dark seems more narrow, a bit too narrow, and dry. It has a clarity without seeming too close / focused.

Thanks for providing the samples. It would be helpful to me if you could provide more details on the setups and mixing.

I agree with you totally. If you look at the picture above, that stereo pair is at the bow, raised to the height of the lid full stick and tilted down parallel to the lid. There is another pair behind it 2 feet and higher following the line of the lid.
A third set in the piano, one at the treble pointing towards the hammers and one positioned over the middle of the bass strings pointing down. The last set is a ms pair under the piano.

I mixed ‘Rainbow’ by bringing the levels up to where I liked the engagement between the 4 pairs. It was exciting but it got tiring to listen to.

Thanks so much. Your confirmation is spot on. The pianist I’m working with likes everything equally

I did pull back 200-400 as Sharp11 mentioned and think I have the imaging under control. I’m going to post, if you don’t mind I’ll quote you when I do.

Thanks

Chris

When you’re juggling/balancing so many multiple mics pairs, it can be much like cooking with many spices and ingredients….the balance becomes a subtle blend of many flavours, and it’s easy to go overboard in one direction !

Where several mic pairs (particularly on piano) are all contributing at significant %, it’s easier to get multiple signal arrivals smeared across the time domain…and the resultant mix can sound seductively lush and smooth…not to mention the phase interactions (partial reinforcements and cancellations at various frequencies) !

However as you progressively subtract and substitute different pairs in different mix proportions, you’ll likely find the immediacy and percussive attacks factor returns, as you remove this multiple-arrivals influence. Less can therefore be more…depending on your desire for realism, lushness, immediacy etc. Always make ‘stripping back to basics, then rebuild’ your comparison strategy.

Making multiple mixes with varying combinations of the mic pairs is a very valuable exercise…it’s a bit like 5 cooks all cooking to the same basic recipe, with each exercising their own taste-based variations. Your job is to be the tasting panel on behalf of the piano-restaurant listening audience !

It’s lushness vs immediacy in the fight for realism. To appropriate your hypothetical, I appreciate ‘the tasting panel’ here offering their observations.
‘must get back to the kitchen now

Thanks!

Chris

Some have described 'Somewhere Over the Rainbow' as lush, and I don't disagree. But, to me the presentation / imaging is kind of confusing; maybe just too much going on from so many mic pairs.

Yes that’s my original, thanks for confirming. It’s so confusing to listen to

I tried to get a focused center while maintaining the soundstage. Im wondering if the sounds is too bright or dull or what criticism might be made.

thanks

Over the Rainbow

It was recorded on a Steinway B in the artist treated living room

Both are fine but the second version sounds more like jazz piano to me. If it was a more classical piano sound you were after, version one would be my pick.

BTW the M4a excerpts you posted wouldn't work in the GS player (at least in my Firefox browser) so I downloaded them and played in Foobar. Sure would be nice if GearSpace supported .flac files...

Yeah the files wont play in Chrome either.

Thanks could you suggest what is preferred please? , I thought the m4a was good

I'm in Safari and the files are playing fine for me!

In my environment file 01 sounds preferable overall. 02 gets a bit strident or "pingy," which might work in a combo/ensemble setting, but for solo piano – or even a trio, like Bill or Keith – the sound of 01 would be very appropriate. It's very balanced and pleasant, and lets the playing come through nicely. I'd say you did a good job, seems like an honest capture of that instrument in that room!

I worked on it a lot, it travels through various playback systems well. The second effort was from me second guessing the first.

march 11th

320kbs mp3