I'm aiming to get an SDC for miking snare (over or under) and possibly hi-hat. They'd be secondary mics so I'd like to spend the least possible. With SDCs I find that it's harder to find truly bad microphones, even though I have had one such example with 12 Gauge microphones (they're laughably bad, haha, just about worth their novelty factor; still, I can find some uses for them too). I was looking at the T-Bones, a pair of the second-cheapest comes in at €100; Behringer C2s are within the same price range. They should be able to handle the SPL, but I'm not too sure.

Why an SDC?

Start with an SM-57 on snare.... what don't you like about it that you want to use some other microphone? (I can think of a lot of reasons you MIGHT not like the SM-57 but it's a fair baseline for comparison).

On high-hat... why aren't you getting enough high-hat in the overheads and what does moving the overheads do for you? (The answer might be that you're doing PA and not recording and need the highest possible GBF... but it might just be that your overheads aren't set up right or aren't very good).

I could tell you that some models of the Behringer ECM-8000 have a good bit of headroom and are hard to overload (although some others have an output transformer and do not have so much headroom and you never know until you look inside). But you might hate the ECM-8000 because the pattern is so wide and you'll have a lot of tom leakage in your snare mike. But then again you might love that.
--scott

SM57s (or any similar microphones: I've had great results with a cheap Behringer dynamic, and my drummer favours the Beta 57, older version) are very good for the meat of the snare, and they work both over and under the snare, but sometimes I find myself wanting a more open-sounding snare with less of that mid honk that an SM57 gives. A condenser under the snare does work very well, or one over it together with the SM57. Hi-hats, I never mic them, but sometimes they ask me to, and if I do have an extra channel I'll do so, why not.

The ECM8000 is a measurement microphone (no problem with that, its relatively flat frequency pickup can come in handy) but it's only rated at 120dBSPL IIRC. That's not gonna cut it anywhere near a drum, maybe just as a dickmic (if you find a use for it; I tried using one once and it does help with getting some attack on the kick and a more open snare, but it's far from essential).

Pure value for money for an ultra versatile SDC - the Lewitt LCT 140 is hard to beat. Switches for HPF, 12dB pad and (KM84-like) bump.

Okay, so you don't have a leakage issue with the SM-57, you just want more top end and less of that 3kc presence peak. You'd probably like an SM-81 but I bet you'd also like an N/D 468 which will be reasonably priced and still have that top end detail.

The AT2020 is very hard to overload and it's not spitty at high levels, but it's bulky and might be a pain for drum miking. Hmm... how about Rode M5? Not as good a pattern but harder to hit with a stick and the leakage is no worse than the SM-57. More presence boost than you might like but less than an SM-57.

The data sheet numbers on the ECM-8000 are not really relevant because there are at least three completely different microphones that have been sold as the ECM-8000. One of them is very, very hard to overload. One of them is pretty easy to overload. They all have the same data sheet which seems to contain random numbers not relevant to any of the three mikes. They aren't great mikes but if you need something to add a little sparkle, the right one might be worth trying.
--scott

Heil Sound PR22 - much airier sound without sounding thin or scratchy - prefer it on guitar cabs too.

The AT Pro37 is an old standby that can (allegedly) handle 141 dB SPL.

The Se Electronics SE7 has a 20-db pad (and a low-cut filter).

The Crown CM 700 (long discontinued inexpensive SDC, if you can find one) can handle relatively high spl, has a low-cut, and a mild (2.5 dB) presence peak, and sounds like a combo of a 57 and an SDC all on it's own. I think it was Crown's attempt at an all-rounder like a 57, for stage and studio, but in SDC form.

The Neat Worker Bee (and newer Worker Bee II) is a Medium-Diaphragm (3/4") Condenser, quiet, crisp, clear, basically ruler flat from subsonic to supersonic (seriously, you will probably want to high-pass sub rumbling at some point in the process), and can allegedly handle 145 dB. I love this mic and bought five to have around for basically anything - toms, acoustic instruments, OH, whatever. The first version was kind of ugly but had character, the new version is kind of blah-looking, but for around $99 I don't know why these aren't super popular. (Check out the tapeop review.)

Many of the cheapies can handle 130-140db so the potential problem of overload is more at the micpre end.

If your micpre doesn't have a pad you may need an external one.

A hard hit snare can put a pretty loud signal into your micpre even with a dynamic mic and most SDC's (small diaphragm condensers) have about 15db more output than an SM57.

The Behringer C2 has a 10db pad on it and supposedly can handle 140db max. Might or might not be the sound you are after but it should be able to handle the level if you manage things properly.

With an in line pad to protect the micpre from overload I have had a few cheap SDC's work ok on snare. On bottom snare I can even get away without a pad if not totally slamming it.

Haven't used the Worker Bee but it might be a good option on the cheap, it is a bit higher output so even more reason for needing a pad with this one.

What is your micpre?

For small diaphragm condensers maybe try something from Lewitt or 3U Audio.

If you want something that is a different flavor then the SM57 for snare, I'd try to track down an old Sennheiser MD504. It actually sounds really great on snare.

I currently have an SM Pro 8-channel preamp (the "fancy" one, not the basic one). It's nothing special but it gets the job done. It has pads on every channel so it's not a problem. My modus operandi anyway is to place the microphone where it should be, check levels, engage the pad on the microphone first and only then the one on the preamp, if needed. I try to minimise the use of pads anyway (for example, when recording guitars, instead of cranking the volume, unless I really need to work the power tubes, I prefer to lower the master volume until I have workable levels on my preamp).

The Worker Bee looks pretty neat! Pity that it doesn't seem to be readily available in Europe, but it really looks like the perfect choice (inexpensive, handles high SPL, also medium diaphragm so it's slightly more directional than a small diaphragm without being too big, flat response). I've seen some on eBay though.

Have you taken a look at the Lewitt LCT140 that Scragend suggested?

Only a 115 euros at Thomann and it has lots of useful features including switching from the usual boosted high end that most of these budget small diaphragm mics tend to have (but can often be a bit too bright on many sources) to a very flat response.

I haven't used one but if I was looking at that price range and lived in Europe (these are a bit more expensive in the U.S.) I would be checking it out.

If you want to reduce the input volume/level into pre etc. why not trying an SM57 with transformer removed? https://www.mylespaul.com/threads/sm...ootout.356480/ or even try a $10 knock off already without the transformer: Pyle PDMIC78. tc

Doubtful this one is transformerless as it's output claims to be about the same as the actual Shure SM57.

Actually 2db higher output than a stock SM57 according to specs.

https://www.amazon.com/Professional-...pe=all_reviews

I haven't opened one up yet... but most people say it is similar to a tranny less SM57 (otherwise it would be more expensive) All the tech reviews I read say the Pyle has no tranny "The lesser weight is due to no transformer in the Pyle, and therefor lower price." etc. tc...

Yes, but why are you recommending a dynamic mic when I specifically asking for an SDC or MDC? I know that you can use a dynamic in many situations instead of a condenser, so if I wanted to (and I often do want to) I'd do so.

An SM57 modded by removing it's transformer is flatter and clearer sounding than a standard 57. It is still capable of high SPL and and has an even lower output so it doesn't overload the input of the micpreamp even when close up on a very loud snare drum.

It's still a dynamic capsule so it won't be as snappy sounding as a condenser mic but it is a little bit more in that direction compared to a standard unmodded 57.

If you want the quickness of a condenser I don't know that a transformerless 57 will quite do it for you.

I'd say stay with your idea of using a condenser mic if you want a substantial difference in sound and put it on the snare bottom where is going to make much more of a difference than on snare top... and as an extra bonus it's safe from being hit there.

Yes, a transformerless SM57 is quite flatter and could get closer to SM7 territory. In fact, it can work wonders in the kick drum, on bass amplifiers, etc. and also on snare if you want a flatter (but still "warm" and controlled) sound. I have often used 57s on snare bottom too and they work well, especially with hard hitting drums. But it does still lack the treble extension and transient response of a condenser due to simple physics (a dynamic capsule has too much mass, simply put). If you want to capture the brightness of the snares or just more of the "tick" of the stick on the drum and the higher overtones you're not going to get them as easily.

Came here to say AT, Pro37 is one but others as well.

12 Gauge makes mics for this, they're neat and they are cheap.
EDIT: you don't like these?? I don't often hear that.

Worker Bee should be on everybody's radar for utility use IMO.

Not sure the specific SPL rating we're looking for, but the Rode NT5 used to be asked about a lot for OH and utility use, but for some reason it's not a highly spoken about go-to snare mic. It's on my list for snare after hearing the Dave Otero snare mic shootout (he used an NT6 but it's the same capsule and circuit AFAIK).

Dynamics that are condenser-y have been mentioned, for that I say the EV N/D mics are worth a throw. Well made, not expensive used, and some go to 22k.

I have two omni reds, the black stereo one, the high-SPL omni and the blue cardioid. I tried the blue cardioid as snare bottom and the high-SPL omni as a heart mic. The omni was decent (still, I'm not sure I find heart mics all that useful, it was an experiment), the snare bottom was terrible.

Line Audio CM4 (or if you find a used CM3).

They’re small, flat and are just excellently priced.

I already have two, I use them as overheads. Great microphones. Their lack of a pad and quoted 135dB max SPL @ 0.5% THD make me pause in using them as close mics.

Sweet. Then do try them. Especially if you have pad on your preamp.

The thing is, a pad on the preamp won't prevent the mic from overloading.

Yes, but if the mike overloads... you put it back and try another mike. Don't be afraid to try things!
--scott

Maybe try one of them on shell next time?

Mic'ing the shell can be a very cool way to mic a snare and get the full sound of the drum.

Lots of options in placement but generally the mic is further from the hihat which is almost always a good thing and if you point the mic a bit downwards toward the shell you can get the rear of a cardioid pattern mic lined up well with the hihat for maximum rejection.

The most negative thing I find about mic'ing the shell is that some people will actually question what you are doing so putting a top mic in the standard position to distract them is a good idea whether you actually record that top mic or not.

If you have the mics, the stands, and the tracks having too many drum mic options is a good thing and you can make use of them or not later on when you (or somebody else) do the mixing.

Wow, well... they're not everyone's taste. My favorite snare setup is a Tama SLP 5x14" 20ply with a 57 and a Blue 12 side by side. 57 is great for capturing the meat and the potatoes, the 12G gets the ring really well - Kludge Germanium preamp driven a little too hard gets the "PAAAANG".

Old thread but the first version of the LCT 140 is awesome, it takes 143 dB of SPL which is crazy! I'm using two of them on snare (top & bottom) and it's the only condenser I've tried on really loud snares that won't crap out or forces you to use a pad, it sounds very clear even when the drummer is hitting super hard, too bad Lewitt replaced the 140 with the "air" version, it doesn't look nearly as good (no illuminated indicators) & it won't handle crazy high SPL levels like the original.

And I’m respond to the old thread too! I use the 12 gauge black 212 stereo mic as an overhead on drums all the time and love it. Mostly live sound use but I record most of the things for which I do sound and I’m very happy with the results.

I think the 12 gauge are pretty similar to the naint mics and other mics that are using the small capsules.

As for snare, I have never been happy with a close miked snare on its own, I rely on the overheads for that air and crack in the snare, and the close mic just fills in the initial hit and some body. For that close mic I really like the audix i5. I’m doing a lot of acoustic based music in different styles, so I’m not usually going for a thunderous type drum sound. If doing that, I might be relying on the close mic more and then maybe I’m having similar considerations.

Anyway, it’s great that there are so many choices.

The 3U Audio SDCs are really good. The Warbler 127 is almost indistinguishable from one of the better vintage KM84s I’ve shot it out with. If you don’t want the transformer coloration, go with the CM100. Like all 3U, they’re huge bang for the buck. I use pairs of both on guitar, piano, drums (including on snare, taped to a Senn 441) all the time.