External Hard Drive vs Cloud Storage

Shante 🎙️ · 3rd January 2018

Hello To All,

I'm new here and hope this is the proper place for this post...

Does anyone save a backup of their pro tools sessions in icloud vs using external drives to backup your sessions?

I'm debating getting another hard drive, or should I just buy more icloud storage.

Pros and cons please and thank you.

cavern · 3rd January 2018

Right now, I can't think of any pros because it hasn't been up long enough yet.

Cons:
I don't like to store anything where it can be exploited, stolen, or in-accessible because of a DDoS attack so I'm going to wait and see.

I have 3 hard drive backups. If one fails, I buy another one. I always have 3. One stored at a different location.

Shante 🎙️ · 3rd January 2018

Thank you so much for responding! To my knowledge, I don't think you can steal things off the cloud (unless you know something I don't)...but I do feel you on the attack thing. You just never know.

I think I'm going to wait too and just buy another drive.

Cheers

Arthur Stone · 3rd January 2018

Hi Shante! Welcome to Gearslutz

I keep my working project material/files locally on an external drive, and I keep a back up locally (2nd computer). For finished work and masters I keep that on the cloud so that if both PC's go down I can access my finished work at least.
If I was working professionally (or on a professional project) I would keep 2 or 3 local back-ups for safety but not on the cloud.
One issue with the cloud is who owns the material once it's uploaded.

cavern · 3rd January 2018

@ Shante re: "I don't think you can steal things off the Cloud"

One could certainly steal information. Passwords, first and last name. People store more than just music on there.
Its just a server that can be hacked and in fact was in 2014.

Remember ICloud?
Hack leaks hundreds of nude celebrity photos - The Verge

**psycho_monkey** · 3rd January 2018

With Australian internet, there’s really no question.....

Shante 🎙️ · 4th January 2018

Thank you all for responding! You've been very helpful!! very valid points about internet hacking, so I think I'm going to just buy a couple of externals. At least I know I'll always have access to them.

@ Shante _Official

Nick Stedman · 8th January 2018

I was doing both for awhile but just using the external HD now. the 1 TB rugged Lacie has been perfect no complaints.

I need another one & Its been a couple years since i've last bought one. Theres a 3TB USB 3.0 external HD for $9 on eBay.. is that normal? It's just a generic brand so probably not super reliable? I just need it as a second maybe third backup. Should I pass on it?

**psycho_monkey** · 8th January 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Stedman ➡️

I was doing both for awhile but just using the external HD now. the 1 TB rugged Lacie has been perfect no complaints.

I need another one & Its been a couple years since i've last bought one. Theres a 3TB USB 3.0 external HD for $9 on eBay.. is that normal? It's just a generic brand so probably not super reliable? I just need it as a second maybe third backup. Should I pass on it?

That looks like it’s just the box. It says it supports up to 3TB; you’d just need to find your own drive to put in it.

I bought a couple of 3.5” chassis that you can swap the drives out of - great for reloading the old internal drives of my Mac Pro without needing a caddy for each one.

rezoneight · 2nd April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthur Stone ➡️

Hi Shante! Welcome to Gearslutz

I keep my working project material/files locally on an external drive, and I keep a back up locally (2nd computer). For finished work and masters I keep that on the cloud so that if both PC's go down I can access my finished work at least.
If I was working professionally (or on a professional project) I would keep 2 or 3 local back-ups for safety but not on the cloud.
One issue with the cloud is who owns the material once it's uploaded.

Just wandered into this area of GS so realize I'm responding to an old post...

What service are you using for cloud storage where there is ever a question of who owns the material? None of the services you'd pay for (iCloud, Dropbox, Google Drive, etc) would have that as an issue. Even for the free tiers of those services there is no claim to ownership by the company providing the service. For instance the Dropbox terms of service make it pretty clear:

"Your Stuff is yours. These Terms don't give us any rights to Your Stuff except for the limited rights that enable us to offer the Services."

rezoneight · 2nd April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by cavern ➡️

Right now, I can't think of any pros because it hasn't been up long enough yet.

Cons:
I don't like to store anything where it can be exploited, stolen, or in-accessible because of a DDoS attack so I'm going to wait and see.

I have 3 hard drive backups. If one fails, I buy another one. I always have 3. One stored at a different location.

Stolen would be pretty tough since any data they'd get would be encrypted and not useable.

rezoneight · 2nd April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by cavern ➡️

@ Shante re: "I don't think you can steal things off the Cloud"

One could certainly steal information. Passwords, first and last name. People store more than just music on there.
Its just a server that can be hacked and in fact was in 2014.

Remember ICloud?
Hack leaks hundreds of nude celebrity photos - The Verge

Yeah remember that one? The one where there was no breach and nobody had any idea how long the group had been collecting images? Yeah turns out the people who had their images stolen used stupid passwords and security questions. iCloud (nor any of the other major storage providers) store passwords so they're not there to be stolen.

Arthur Stone · 2nd April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

Just wandered into this area of GS so realize I'm responding to an old post...

What service are you using for cloud storage where there is ever a question of who owns the material? None of the services you'd pay for (iCloud, Dropbox, Google Drive, etc) would have that as an issue. Even for the free tiers of those services there is no claim to ownership by the company providing the service. For instance the Dropbox terms of service make it pretty clear:

"Your Stuff is yours. These Terms don't give us any rights to Your Stuff except for the limited rights that enable us to offer the Services."

You've misquoted the Dropbox terms of service; this is what it actually says:

Quote:

When you use our Services, you provide us with things like your files, content, messages, contacts and so on ("Your Stuff"). Your Stuff is yours. These Terms don't give us any rights to Your Stuff except for the limited rights that enable us to offer the Services.

We need your permission to do things like hosting Your Stuff, backing it up and sharing it when you ask us to. Our Services also provide you with features like photo thumbnails, document previews, commenting, easy sorting, editing, sharing and searching. These and other features may require our systems to access, store and scan Your Stuff. You give us permission to do those things, and this permission extends to our affiliates and trusted third parties we work with.

Source: Dropbox - Terms

rezoneight · 3rd April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthur Stone ➡️

You've misquoted the Dropbox terms of service; this is what it actually says: Source: Dropbox - Terms

I did not misquote the ToS. I quoted the relevant part. Every service like Dropbox has to have that second part. Thats the "limited" rights they refer to in the first part "to offer the services". They have to have that to operate the service. The first part is the important part: your stuff is yours. They say it in plain English, not legalese.

Arthur Stone · 3rd April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

I did not misquote the ToS. I quoted the relevant part. Every service like Dropbox has to have that second part. Thats the "limited" rights they refer to in the first part "to offer the services". They have to have that to operate the service. The first part is the important part: your stuff is yours. They say it in plain English, not legalese.

You've never studied linguistics? Or law? [EDIT:] The full text changes the context of the partial quotation.

rezoneight · 4th April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthur Stone ➡️

You've never studied linguistics? Or law? [EDIT:] The full text changes the context of the partial quotation.

No but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

I've read enough ToS documents for these services, and they're all the same. And the explanation is always the same. Your stuff is yours. I'm trying to think of the last time there was a huge grab by Dropbox, Box, Google, Microsoft, or Apple (or any of the dozens of other smaller cloud storage companies) in the news of people's stuff where they stole the rights. Oh wait, there hasn't been one. So sick of this type of nonsense.

Deleted User · 4th April 2018

Tried PT Cloud Storage and by far prefer using my own drive.

Arthur Stone · 4th April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

No but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

If you've never studied the necessary law and linguistics then why are you giving legal advice on the internet?

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

I've read enough ToS documents for these services, and they're all the same. And the explanation is always the same. Your stuff is yours.

You obviously didn't read the Dropbox TOS!

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

...I'm trying to think of the last time there was a huge grab by Dropbox, Box, Google, Microsoft, or Apple (or any of the dozens of other smaller cloud storage companies) in the news of people's stuff where they stole the rights. Oh wait, there hasn't been one.

Well they don't need to grab anything if you've already given it to them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

...So sick of this type of nonsense.

#MeToo

Deleted User · 9th April 2018

People talk about 'the cloud' like it's literally something up in space.

Saving to 'the cloud' (whatever brand of cloud storage you use) is just using the internet to save to a remote hard drive. So either way the information needs to be written to an external drive to be backed up. The difference is that it could be a hard drive on your desk, or it could be in a warehouse in North Carolina.

My opinion: the internet is for sharing, not for storage. And now that hard drives are so cheap there's not much of an excuse. But do what you will

rezoneight · 10th April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthur Stone ➡️

If you've never studied the necessary law and linguistics then why are you giving legal advice on the internet?

Are you a lawyer?

Arthur Stone · 10th April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

Are you a lawyer?

No (through choice) - but I've studied law and linguistics enough to be certain that partially-quoted contracts are not substitiutes for the full text. The fact is that data security is not guaranteed in the Cloud.

My initial comment in this thread is partly-based on discussions about 'cloud security' by working professionals who say that the 'terms of service' conflict with their legal responsibilities to their clients...

...but, of course, you're "so sick of this type of nonsense."

rezoneight · 12th April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthur Stone ➡️

No

I thought so. Good day sir.

Arthur Stone · 12th April 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by rezoneight ➡️

I thought so. Good day sir.

The fact stands that you misquoted the Dropbox terms of service; the text you omitted changes the context of the terms of service.

ccg · 12th April 2018

Use both! Modern day redundancy.

vsthalion · 6th May 2018

I use 2 externals plus cloud service (backblaze) it’s unlimited and the price is the cheapest I’ve found and the service works really well. I’ve never had a problem. I’m really a chicken when it comes to loosing data so I prefer having both options.

EMMST · 16th May 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by cavern ➡️

Right now, I can't think of any pros because it hasn't been up long enough yet.

Cons:
I don't like to store anything where it can be exploited, stolen, or in-accessible because of a DDoS attack so I'm going to wait and see.

I have 3 hard drive backups. If one fails, I buy another one. I always have 3. One stored at a different location.

How do you update the off-site one?

cavern · 16th May 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by EMMST ➡️

How do you update the off-site one?

Laptop. I update that one every new "important" update. Its not far away.
In some unlikely chance that both hard drives at my house would default together as in a fire or the like, I would only be missing the last few non critical files.

Girts · 5th October 2018

Time after time I save a copy of my actual project on the external harddisk.

Plus, I do Full + Incremental archives on digital tape, using rather obsolete Hewlett-Packard external DAT72 drive, connected via USB. It is not the fastest way to do, but the tape archives still count as the safest ones. On the other side, DAT72 cassettes got very pricey right now - I was really surprised... like ten times more as I paid few years ago.

I also considered NAS or cloud service, but have not carried out that idea so far.

Currawong · 9th October 2018

I use multiple external drives plus Backblaze. The latter obviously requires initially leaving your computer internet connected for a long time for the initial backup after which it can back up on the fly or on a schedule. For the security conscious, it can be backed up with an encrypted key that is unrecoverable if lost. They have a 30 day trial -- usually long enough for most people to back up everything, and professionals maybe sufficient recent projects.

Something useful they provide is hard drive reliability statistics. Since they go through a huge number of drives, regularly upgrading models, they have a large amount of useful data on what drives are reliable.

forestcreature · 12th October 2018

NAS: 1) for RAID redundancy, 2) the disks are spinning so it'll tell you of impending failures/you can schedule regular tests that don't impact your workflow, 3) if your place is menaced you can grab the NAS and run (Californian members?), 4) under your control

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