Quote:
Originally Posted by
gear_up
β‘οΈ
Use forum search or Google search for site:gearspace.com
We've discussed this topic plenty enough on this forum
I did do a Google search then typed in "gearspace" in the end, which I actually always do for SRX questions, and nothing came up somehow for me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Grasspikemusic
β‘οΈ
The SRX cards have mixed content of 32k samples which were lifted from the older SR-JV80 cards made for the JV and JD lines and newer samples at 44.1khz made for the newer SRX models
Some of the cards are all brand new sample content while others are all older sample content
There is a lot of conflicting information about the sample rate outputs of the various XV models. IMHO it's a waste of time and effort to worry about any of it
I used to have all of the XV series rack mount synths in a rack at the same time and can tell you from first hand experience that if i was playing a preset from the XV3080 off an SRX Card it sounded exactly the same as if it was played on my XV5080
At the end of the day you are not buying an XV series synth for hyper realism, the samples are small and even at higher bit rates are still compressed with Roland's companding scheme. If you want hyper realism buy Kontact and some higher end sample libraries for it
All of the end of the day, every XV models has different features than the others with things like Polyphony, effects, screen size, number of SRX/SR-JV80 cards, and number of analog and digital outputs
If you can swing it I would get a 5080 as that will give you the best of everything, including 128 voices of Polyphony
In reality however in 2023/2024 if you really want a Roland Rackmount Rompler and are planning on buying SRX cards, I would most certainly not do it. I would get a Roland Integra 7 which comes with all the SRX content and a whole lot more, and will cost less in the end
Thanks, but I do not like the Integra 7, it sounds amazingly clear, but due to a lack of the saturation and EQ that the DAC on the older hardware gave it, it sounds soul-less to me. Same with the SRX VST. I've A/B'd comparisoned a nonstop, and the SRX cards coming from older hardware, just sound better, and mix ready. Uncompressed and unsaturated isn't always better, it's just a different flavor for a different musical need. For example, uncompressed and perfectly sterile audio like the SRX cards on the Integra 7, let's say SRX 06 orchestral strings, if you're scoring a movie amd you need to make a orchestra seem like its really playing in front of people, it is PERFECT for that. Clear, unsaturated, not mix ready, just in your face an unprocessed instrument like you would find in real life. Add some reverb to fit the room in the movie for realism, and you're done. Now, throw that into a mix? and you're doing some heavy editing to make it sound mix ready. On the other hand, if you toss an SRX 06 card coming from old hardware in to a song, well.. that's.. pretty much almost mix ready at that point, if not fully. The effects of the hardware, the EQ, the compression, the hardware processing in general, the saturation the DACs of the older hardware give to the sound, it all creates a final product that is mix ready. Same thing with a Fantom vs a Fantom 0, the Fantom 0 to me? Sounds better, and is one of the veryyy few keyboards today that just.. sounds almost perfectly mix ready for a song. Regardless of it's price, and regardless that it's not "the top of the line model", I know what I hear, and have lesrned to listen to my ears and not price or what's considered, modern and new, because rarely today does new and modern equal better. It just equals newer and more expensive... and the companies know most people lack this knowledge and hearing, so they keep making things that sound worse than things made 20 years ago, because people keep buying it. Like look at the Yamaha MODx8+, or the Montage 8, both sound like hilarious toys to me that have samples that sound like they belong in kids toys to me.. I remember seeing people ogling them in stores and online, and thinking to myself, "These people are tone deaf.. I can't believe the standards are this low today.." , then I would go back and listen to a Motif XS on youtube, and it's like, "Oh.. this.. this 20 something year old hardware and samples sound better than what's available today.. that's concerning." That's how I feel anyways. I'm sure everyone who spent thousands on the soul-less clean and pristine (yet amazing sounding) Integra, will feel bitter about what I said, but it's the cold truth. I definitely think the Integra has a place.. but only for movie scoring, and for masochists who love to EQ and edit nonstop for days to get an orchestral sound to sit good in their song mix. God bless those people with that kind of passion to mix for seemingly endless days because they bought a rompler that didn't have mix ready sounds due it having perfectly clean and sterile (yet amazing sounding) sounds that stand out on a mix like a sore thumb.. but I'm a song writer, and like to just get things done while sounding as great and mix ready as possible from the start, with the least amount of editing needed after, then call it done, and move onto the next song or score, and get my bills paid. Don't get me wrong, there ARE keybaords today that sound amazing and WAY better than anything from before. Look at the Korg Nautilus for example.. beautiful grand piano sounds that sound mix ready, and leagues better than anything from 20 years ago. But my point is, is that THOSE kind of mix ready keyboards and samples, are far too few today. I can count them on my hand.. and in world filled with endless companies making keyboards, that's a problem. I totally see why some people stick to sample plugin software. Unfortunately, that's just not for me, as plugins slow down my creative work flow, and did for years. With hardware romplers, I spin a wheel, and record, and done, and move onto the next aample instrument. No looking thru 500 plugins to find a violin sample, then waiting for it to load (or immediately crash) then chose a preset, then record. I mean this with no ego, but I'm autistic and mind works really fast creatively, and time and time again, I've found myself losing my next 3 ideas because I took 5 - 7 minutes looking for a saxophone plugin, or 3 - 5 minutes to find a synth plugin. Every second counts to me, and hardware rack romplers are just.. right there.. and sound amazing and I always have a pdf patch list if I need help finding a sound. Yea I will still use plugins, but after the main sounds are done being recorded if I feel I need something different or more hi fidelty.
Which brings me back to this post. All I really want to know is, do the SRX cards that have 44.1Khz samples in them, truly play at 44.1Khz when in a Roland XV 5080? If so, that's the one I'll chose. I wish I knew for a fact that the 5080 100% does play back 44.1 kHz samples in general.. then the choice would be easy. Same with sampling from a CD, I would love to know if when sampling from a CD on the 5080, does it play back sample cd that are in 44.1Khz in 44.1 kHz? or would it keep it locked in 32Khz?
I know you're going to say, "well I can't tell a difference between SRX cards between the 3080 and 5080 so it doesn't matter" but I can almost always tell when a sample is lower or higher quality when A/Bing. So considering I want a old rompler to use with SRX cards, I'm being as picky as possible, to attempt to squeeze out the highest possible version of the SRX cards on hardware. I will already have a Fantom X6 playing 4 of them, I will have 2 left, and yea I could get the Fantom XR,l with holds 6, but have you heard about how the screen fails, and the resistors (or something like that) inside that control the DAC have been failing lately in them that require welding? I don't want to have to start welding.. I want to make music. So I'm wearing of the hassle. So now, my seemingly only two options, are the 5050 and the 5080.
Wish someone could comment for sure on the DAC output quality of both, as that would help clear things up for once. I heard about the output quality of the 5080 being a mystery, which seems.. wierd that someone hasn't tested it officially after all these years to settle the matter for once. So, here's to hoping someone here does.
I really appreciate your help and advice btw! Sorry for the long rant on modern bs vintage SRX card hardware, but it needed to be said, because I've been researching SRX cards online for the past 5 years, have read endless articles and forums comments, and no one has said this. So there it is, my archived opinion, to piss people off for generations to come. Haha Even though its the hard truth. Hey, hopefully something better comes out in the future with SRX cards.. Have you heard the version of SRX cards that are in th Fantom series, but the better more mix ready sounding samples being on the Fantom 0, called EXZ? They are basically remade samples of old SRX cards, some ruined by sounding unnecessarily synthy, but some made to sound absolutely glorous and like a dream come true. Luckily, I will have a Fantom 08, and old romplers with SRX cards, together, having two different flavors of amazing sounding SRX cards, is invaluable. EXZ is how the SRX cards SHOULD hve sounded in an Integra 7. Modern, hi fidelity, remastered, yet saturated and full of life personality and soul. Hope there's more to come like that in the future with SRX. I am glad they exist how they do though in the Integra 7, because like I said, for clean film scoring? Invaluable. So they atleast serve a purpose being that sterile in the i7. Perhaps one day I'll buy an i7 for that purpose alone.. tempting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TomΓ‘s Mulcahy
β‘οΈ
There's a fundamental difference between what the DAC runs at and what the samples were recorded at. Don't forget it is a sampler, so it is effectively converting the sample rate of the source waves to come out at the right pitch for the DAC, with the goal of messing up the sound too much. You can get content up to 20kHz by transposing a 32kHz sample upwards.
There are many factors to consider in the Rolands besides the DAC. Different models have different reconstruction filters and they even changed what compression schemes (none to a lot) are used to store the waves, from the JD-800 onwards. The onboard synth processes are different on each machine even though to the user the parameters seem very similar. Mainly this is with the filters and the effects engine.
Apart from the
Integra 7 which is the ultimate as @
Grasspikemusic
already pointed out, 5080 and 5050 are pretty much as good as it gets for Roland ROMpler. But the way it sits in the mix compared to a JD-990 or JV-1080 or WHY will depend on all of the other factors, and is entirely subjective. There is no "better" because the presets are programmed on each machine by people with very good ears and musical ability, who can work around and with the **subtle** differences.
But if you want, our own @
Don Solaris
has already gone down that rabbit hole for you. There are even some audio examples so you can hear for yourself.
https://www.donsolaris.com/?tag=xv5080
Oh yea I definitely know all of this already, thanks for your help! Thanks for the link too, because after roughly browsing thru that very long article of specs looking for the number 5080, I noticed Don Solaris said in it, "There were some rumors on various forums that XV-5080 is 32kHz (thus being able to play only up to 16kHz). This however is simply not true. We will now take a look at a waveform spectra of a White Noise sample as played from JD-990 and XV-5080. What we can clearly see is that not only they are identical but they both go all the way up to 22kHz, which clearly indicates 44.1k playback." and "I should just state that the 44.1k referenced samples points to models XV-5080 and XV-5050. I can not guarantee that model 3080 contains 44.1k playback engine at all, neither the samples in that format β it has been reported the machine is 32k. I can however guarantee than in 5080/5050 waveforms from the JD-800 are in original 44.1k format."
So now, my question is, if the XV5080 DAC can output 44.1Khz, and it has some samples that are also in 44.1Khz, that should mean, that it 100% IS playing those 44.1 kHz samples/patches in 44.1 kHz and not just 32Khz, right? It may seem silly to ask that, but.. if apparently for YEARS people thought that the 5080 was only outputting audio in 32Khz and not 44.1Khz, then.. their must have been something going on, right? or was it like this mass dissonance where the 5080 somehow sounded like 32Khz to everyone for years for some reason? I find it so strange, that a confusion like that even existed to begin with. It feels like some weird bizzare conspiracy, rather than just a simple confusion.. Haha
Also, I looked on his site for those audio samples you mentioned, and didn't find anything.. could you link me to them?
Thanks again so much!