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Sharing my place
Old 15th September 2012
  #1
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Sharing my place

A friend of mine wants to bring his gear into my studio and use it.
He has a U87, Chandler pre, Neve 2channel pre, SSL G Comp, Lynx Halo and some other stuff.
This guy has good ears, has some alcohol problems, is self centered and - well, has some issues.
His judgemental state is all about his needs and sharing a place with him which is BTW my home as well could me some hazzle.
He stated because he has all the expensive gear he should get 80% of the income which I think is BS for the fact I´m providing the place he´s working in.
We have a long history and I care for this guy but sharing my place isn´t on the top of my to-do-list.

But for the curiosity I want your take on the 80% statement of his.
Is it justified?
Old 15th September 2012
  #2
Gear Nut
 
3 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
You're out driving. From the top of a hill you see a car crash at the bottom of that hill. Do you drive straight into it?
Old 15th September 2012 | Show parent
  #3
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomGuitarist ➡️
You're out driving. From the top of a hill you see a car crash at the bottom of that hill. Do you drive straight into it?
heh I know, it´s a no-brainer in a lots aways.
But I would like to work with him regardless if he joins me or not.

Any take on the 80% "rule" of his?
Old 15th September 2012
  #4
Gear Guru
 
Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
If you are going into a "partnership" arrangement I would think 50-50 is more normal. If you are providing the dwelling/studio and he is providing a bulk of the equipment it seems like you should be equally sharing the income.

A long time ago I went into partnership with a person and soon after we started working together he though because he was providing the content and I was providing "just the equipment" that he should get 80% of the income. The partnership did not last long and I think the same could be said for your potential partnership.

Partnerships that start off on rocky ground seldom, if ever, get better with age.

My 2 cents worth.
Old 15th September 2012
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Lute's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
No

Dunno what the money situation for you/him is like but a good test would be to lease a place for a few months and see how it goes.
Old 15th September 2012 | Show parent
  #6
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe ➡️
If you are going into a "partnership" arrangement I would think 50-50 is more normal. If you are providing the dwelling/studio and he is providing a bulk of the equipment it seems like you should be equally sharing the income.

A long time ago I went into partnership with a person and soon after we started working together he though because he was providing the content and I was providing "just the equipment" that he should get 80% of the income. The partnership did not last long and I think the same could be said for your potential partnership.

Partnerships that start off on rocky ground seldom, if ever, get better with age.

My 2 cents worth.


I totally agree. If you go to a studio you pay for engineer and THE STUDIO
So 50-50 is what I got.

Also, my gear isn´t excacly low end either.
SCA(N72,A12,C84) full rack, RME ADI-8, CS, KRK Expose8B, 2x vintage Gibsons, ´71 Super Reverb and so on.

He´s in more need than I´m so screw him heh
Old 15th September 2012
  #7
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
80% when you're providing the actual space + a fair amount of your own gear? That seems absolutely ridiculous
Old 15th September 2012
  #8
Gear Head
 
DBmixman's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Drinking problem: Red Flag!
80/20 split: Run for the hills, dont look back.
Old 15th September 2012
  #9
Lives for gear
 
jrhager84's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
50/50 or bust.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777
Old 15th September 2012
  #10
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
From what you've described so far, if I was in your situation I'd be inclined to drink cyanide before going into an arrangement with this person, regardless of being interested in working with him.
Old 15th September 2012
  #11
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I´m a fair person and if there would be some conflicts they wouldn´t be "started" by me.
But then again, maybe, because I would have to set the boundaries, my studio is also my home.
I would not be the person who´s taking. He even mentioned there would maybe be some conflicts
I told him then we have to show each other respect. Well, he then says because he has all the expensive gear he should get 80% of the income lol!
Talking about sleepwalking
Old 15th September 2012
  #12
Lives for gear
 
Empire Prod's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
i just want to throw out the fact that he does not have anywhere near enough gear or the right gear to draw gearhead clients so don't over-value his equipment. A U87, Chandler TG-2, AMS Pre, SSL Comp and an interface won't impress many clients. Many of my clients have much more impressive gear collections than that at home and the ones who don't probably have no clue what any of this stuff is. It's all about results and track record.
Old 15th September 2012
  #13
Gear Guru
 
Sqye's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
.

I'm counting 7 red flags in your OP.

And only 2 pros - his gear, and his good ears.

Hopefully, you can do way better than this, if you're serious about making music.

Don't be lazy. Do your own thing, and do it right.

Don't get mixed up in BS from the get go.

This guy sounds like trouble, and you wouldn't be posting here if you didn't think so.

Life is too short. Trust your instincts.

Just my advice.

I leant a drum kit to an alcoholic pothead friend and neighbor of mine, and now he won't give it back.
I can't believe it - he's actually stealing my drum kit.

Substance abusers will often screew you over. They can't help it, because they're not clear-minded.

I say, get yourself into a better situation. One with clarity, functionality and peace of mind.

My BEST partnerships - and I've had MANY - have ALWAYS been with non substance abusers.

AND ESPECIALLY, IN YOUR FREEKING HOME! Are you KIDDING ME?

It's a no-brainer.

Forget this joker's "business" proposal. Believe me, it won't even mean jack **** if he's all f*c7ed up, anyway.

Cheers and all the best!


.
Old 15th September 2012 | Show parent
  #14
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sqye ➡️
.

I'm counting 7 red flags in your OP.

And only 2 pros - his gear, and his good ears.

Hopefully, you can do way better than this, if you're serious about making music.

Don't be lazy. Do your own thing, and do it right.

Don't get mixed up in BS from the get go.

This guy sounds like trouble, and you wouldn't be posting here if you didn't think so.

Life is too short. Trust your instincts.

Just my advice.

I leant a drum kit to an alcoholic pothead friend and neighbor of mine, and now he won't give it back.
I can't believe it - he's actually stealing my drum kit.

Substance abusers will often screew you over. They can't help it, because they're not clear-minded.

I say, get yourself into a better situation. One with clarity, functionality and peace of mind.

My BEST partnerships - and I've had MANY - have ALWAYS been with non substance abusers.

AND ESPECIALLY, IN YOUR FREEKING HOME! Are you KIDDING ME?

It's a no-brainer.

Forget this joker's "business" proposal. Believe me, it won't even mean jack **** if he's all f*c7ed up, anyway.

Cheers and all the best!


.
I like yer mojo thanks
AND I´m amazed you´ve noticed I´m lazy WTF?

What do you mean by 7 read flags?
Old 16th September 2012
  #15
Gear Guru
 
Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
People who have an alcohol dependency can be very hard to work with. One minute they are on top of the world the next they want to break everything in site or they become severely depressed.

Concerning alcohol dependency. From the WWW "Long term alcohol abuse can lead to psychiatric disorders and can include major depression, dysthymia, mania, hypomania, panic disorder, phobias, generalized anxiety disorder, personality disorders, schizophrenia, suicide, neurologic deficits (e.g. impairments of working memory, emotions, executive functions, visuospatial abilities and gait and balance) and brain damage."

I would think seriously about this "partnership".
Old 16th September 2012
  #16
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Been there. Run to the hills.
Old 16th September 2012
  #17
Lives for gear
 
heyman's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
First off 80/20 is ridiculous. I would'nt even go 50/50 with a guy with a drinking problem.

Do not do it....!!!

Tell him that if he wants to use your studio it is on a per project basis and charge him an hourly and/or day rate..

Do not go into business with an Alcoholic.
Old 16th September 2012
  #18
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
If he can make you rich without driving you mad could be a good deal....
Old 16th September 2012
  #19
Gear Guru
 
joelpatterson's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Here's a mantra for anyone and everyone to chant a million times and truly absorb: THE PARTICULAR GEAR, NO MATTER HOW NAME BRAND, DOESN'T MATTER IN THE IPPSY OOPSY SLIGHTEST.
Old 16th September 2012 | Show parent
  #20
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson ➡️
Here's a mantra for anyone and everyone to chant a million times and truly absorb: THE PARTICULAR GEAR, NO MATTER HOW NAME BRAND, DOESN'T MATTER IN THE IPPSY OOPSY SLIGHTEST.
I agree.
I also think Sqye is right on the money - "I say, get yourself into a better situation. One with clarity, functionality and peace of mind"

Brilliant stuff!
Old 16th September 2012
  #21
Lives for gear
 
DaveE's Avatar
I'd say 50/50 is unacceptable since you're providing the real estate. Tell him he can pay your daily rate to freelance there when he needs to.
Old 17th September 2012 | Show parent
  #22
Moderator
 
psycho_monkey's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nspaas ➡️
Been there. Run to the hills.
This.

I wouldn't let someone I can't trust into my home at all. And you're suggesting you might go into business with them?

Well, you're not really taking it seriously are you...please?
Old 18th September 2012
  #23
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
So...what's the situation here? You have a studio, and he wants to use it and keep 80% of the money that he brings in? Who will be engineering? Who is bringing in the clients?

If he's the one who's charging and engineering, maybe you should charge him a flat hourly studio rate, and have him charge his clients whatever he sees fit. If he wants 80% then he just charges five times your studio rate.

Otherwise, I'd agree that 50/50 seems right...if anything it should be more in your favor. Anyone can buy gear, but you can't just go out and buy a room.

Having said all that...I'd agree that the situation in general is a bad one. The only one I'd probably even consider would be for you to charge your day rate, session by session, cash in advance. Even then, the fact that it's in your home and that he mentioned that there might be some "conflicts" (what exactly does that mean?) would make me think twice.
Old 18th September 2012
  #24
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Consider the thought of WHY this guy wants to use your place instead of just getting his own. Whats the benefits for you vs him? Use that to bargain your % but if it were me, i would flat out decline.

Sent from my SGH-T989
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #25
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duardo ➡️
So...what's the situation here? You have a studio, and he wants to use it and keep 80% of the money that he brings in? Who will be engineering? Who is bringing in the clients?

If he's the one who's charging and engineering, maybe you should charge him a flat hourly studio rate, and have him charge his clients whatever he sees fit. If he wants 80% then he just charges five times your studio rate.

Otherwise, I'd agree that 50/50 seems right...if anything it should be more in your favor. Anyone can buy gear, but you can't just go out and buy a room.

Having said all that...I'd agree that the situation in general is a bad one. The only one I'd probably even consider would be for you to charge your day rate, session by session, cash in advance. Even then, the fact that it's in your home and that he mentioned that there might be some "conflicts" (what exactly does that mean?) would make me think twice.
By conflict I mean f ex, he wants to stay longer "mixing", trying stuff out, maybe 2-4 beer involved, the time is 9 o´clock
in the evening but I want some rest and privacy, some peace.
Also, I´m workin ´till 4 o´clock and when home I want some time to stay easy, go online, just general chill.
I don´t want to feel like I´m in the way, let´s say if there is a session when I´m back from work. I need to ground myself.
Also, he also has this hidden agenda thing, coming to my place when he really wants to take it over, throw me out and get lost in the speakers.
That´s what he does but the difference I´m still there on the sofa thinking, what the hell are you doing?
It´s never - what can we do together. It´s always - why don´t you do this so I can do this.
And if I mention - hey you are crossing the line - then I´m the bad guy!
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #26
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
This.

I wouldn't let someone I can't trust into my home at all. And you're suggesting you might go into business with them?

Well, you're not really taking it seriously are you...please?
No I´m not taking it seriously, it´s more of a hobby
Old 19th September 2012 | Show parent
  #27
Moderator
 
psycho_monkey's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ljona ➡️
No I´m not taking it seriously, it´s more of a hobby
I mean...you're not seriously thinking of letting him anywhere near your house?

Please...don't. There's nothing in it for you. At least, not the way you've presented things.
Old 19th September 2012
  #28
Lives for gear
 
jrhager84's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I equate anything in music to what a girl in catholic school does:

If you have to ask if you can wear it, you probably can't.

<translation>

If you have to ask if it's a good idea, it probably isn't...

;-)

P.S. The analogy is a cutesy way of implanting it into your brain. Another awesome example: If you have trouble remembering names, associate the person you met with someone you already know with the same name, or a character that you already know. You'll never forget another name again. hahahaha
Old 19th September 2012 | Show parent
  #29
Gear Addict
 
ljona's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
I mean...you're not seriously thinking of letting him anywhere near your house?

Please...don't. There's nothing in it for you. At least, not the way you've presented things.
Well, he will at some point trop by - (he lives in another country right now).
He´s my friend although he doesn´t sometimes act like one.
I want to have him around when we can talk and work together (hopefylly)
but then again, I´m not saying he´s sharing my place.
I would like to work with him but I has to know it´s my place - my rules.

I´m a drummer and he´s the best bassist I´ve played with.
It´s an ongoing history since ´88
Old 19th September 2012
  #30
Lives for gear
 
Goliath|Audio's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
It's negotiation man. Start high and see where it goes. Counter offer. 40-60 to you since it is your place and only if he cleans up. Ultimately, the money doesn't matter, or shouldn't matter if this guy is a friend. He needs to get sober. If you have the facility to help him, spatially, physically, and professionally, do it. But, set the ground rules early on and let him know what the boundaries are.
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