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Not quite square, help with orientation
Old 12th November 2009
  #1
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Not quite square, help with orientation

Good afternoon,

I'm finally/almost at the point where I might be able to occupy a bedroom in my house for home recording purposes. I measured and sketched out (see below) the dimensions and key features of the room, which include:

(1) Square-ish - does 3" of imbalance help? Hope so! 12'5" by 12'8", 9 ft ceilings.
(2) Two windows on one wall, placed 12" from the corner/wall in one case, and 17" in the other case - which constrains what I can use for corner bass traps there to maybe only DIY superchunks with 1foot sides?
(3) Two doors, entry point and closet, placed in opposite corners basically.
(4) Though not shown, ideally would keep a single bed and electronic drumset in the room. Drums to be close to desk for, well, layering in drumming. 88 key keyboard would sit on smallish mixing desk.
(5) Can use closet eventually for vocals on ad-hoc basis.

I guess the first thing that I am struggling with is the best orientation for my mixing position within the room. Would it be best to place the desk such that I face the walls with the windows, or the reverse? Not sure how to figure that into the decisions. As well, the doors are placed such that symmetry within the room isn't going to be ideal.

As well, any tips for placing a bed would be great too. Maybe I could put some 703 under/beneath the bed where it meets a wall to get a floor/wall corner....

Anyway, maybe I'll stop here, hopefully get some advice at least on which way to face for starters, then work from there. Thanks for the help! - Michael
Attached Thumbnails
Not quite square, help with orientation-room.jpg  
Old 13th November 2009
  #2
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
(1) Square-ish - does 3" of imbalance help? Hope so! 12'5" by 12'8", 9 ft ceilings.
It really needs to have a 5% difference, so your room is squ.

The best layout I can tell would be to face the lower wall and start by sitting back 38% of the room length. The problem is the door will be in the way to put any kind of bass trapping. Because of this I would face the upper wall and put bass trap panels on stands for the corners. You may need to put the early reflection panel to the left (closet door).

For the bed I would put it behind the mix area. Putting bass trapping may help but you are much better off straddling upper corners like this.


Quote:
(2) Two windows on one wall, placed 12" from the corner/wall in one case, and 17" in the other case - which constrains what I can use for corner bass traps there to maybe only DIY superchunks with 1foot sides?
They really need to be 17" so use panels on stands for the corners. You can also move them to be used around a mike when recording. Now that I think about it you could build something like our screen panel which would be 2 17"x6' (3" thick) panels hinged together. When folded together you can place it in the corner for bass trapping and also use it as a VB when recording tracks.

GIK Acoustics: GIK Screen Panel
Old 13th November 2009 | Show parent
  #3
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Thanks so much for taking the time to reply. Yeah, certainly square then! Just have to work with what I have.

The doors are unfortunate, pretty much consuming two of the "easy to treat" corners (easier to get to than wall ceiling corners, that is). I'll check out your panels right now....Also, given that it is square, I can hop over to the nearby thread too and pick up some pointers from there.....

Two quick follow-up questions:

(1) Is there anything potentially useful or detrimental about the two windows in the room and/or choice of orientation? There is enough depth in the window area that I could put 4" of roughly 2' by 4' (even 5') 703 in there (certainly not a corner, though). Each window is 5'5" tall, 2'6" wide. Or, would that trapping be better off placed at some kind of corner?

(2) Are wall-ceiling corners any "better" to treat than floor-wall corners (floor is carpeted)? Floor/wall treatment could be/seem more portable, which I could then use to help treat a room downstairs with my grand piano if/when needed. That portability would be cool.

Actually, come to think of it, for any potential superchunks, i really could fit 1 X 1 X 17" along the sides of each window, floor to ceiling. When you said that they needed to be 17", maybe I was confusing. I have one foot of wall space, so the face of the superchunk could in fact be 17" in this room. Would that still work, or would panels on stands end up being better? "better", of course, is probably a cost/value tradeoff, but.....
Old 13th November 2009 | Show parent
  #4
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
(1) Is there anything potentially useful or detrimental about the two windows in the room and/or choice of orientation? There is enough depth in the window area that I could put 4" of roughly 2' by 4' (even 5') 703 in there (certainly not a corner, though). Each window is 5'5" tall, 2'6" wide. Or, would that trapping be better off placed at some kind of corner?
If in the front or back you should be fine. It could mess with a early reflection point if sitting to the right, but you could always put a panel on a stand in front of it and be fine. All and all not a big deal.

Quote:
(2) Are wall-ceiling corners any "better" to treat than floor-wall corners (floor is carpeted)? Floor/wall treatment could be/seem more portable, which I could then use to help treat a room downstairs with my grand piano if/when needed. That portability would be cool.
Bass builds up in all corners. I myself like floor/wall corner because of them being portable also. thumbsup I did my own studio that way a few years ago.

Quote:
Actually, come to think of it, for any potential superchunks, i really could fit 1 X 1 X 17" along the sides of each window, floor to ceiling. When you said that they needed to be 17", maybe I was confusing. I have one foot of wall space, so the face of the superchunk could in fact be 17" in this room. Would that still work, or would panels on stands end up being better? "better", of course, is probably a cost/value tradeoff, but...
Sorry I meant 17" on the sides touching the walls. That would make the front 2'. If you can make them portable (like our Tri Trap) that would work. You are only covering a bit of the window at that point.
Old 14th November 2009 | Show parent
  #5
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Most appreciated, thank you!

In terms of bass trapping in the vicinity of a bed, say I put a tritrap like device in the lower left corner, and then slide the bed towards the corner best I can. Or, similarly, also put a bass trap along a wall/floor junction, then push the bed towards it as far as works.
Will the bed "hurt" the functioning of the bass traps in those spots? Or, given that the bed doesn't really absorb what the bass trap is after, the bass trap will still receive and absorb what it intends to?

Thanks again! Trying out some sketches....
Old 14th November 2009 | Show parent
  #6
Gear Guru
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Another Difficult one

It is most often the case that construction is not possible. We then have to work around it. However I will give the extra push. Mr. H, are you really sure that you can't put up a false wall to get a better ratio? Even a semi-temporary structure with plywood and friction fit studs would help an awful lot. Such a wall with insulation behind would double function as a massive panel trap.
IMHO, but not strictly proven. Windows can work as bass traps. Thump one with your fist and you will hear what I mean. Carefully!
I would have them behind the speakers. A suggestion- you could build non triangular traps, covering the windows and filling those two front corners entirely. A square room needs the most aggressive treatment that you can muster. Lets not forget a cloud.
DD
Old 15th November 2009 | Show parent
  #7
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
I'll have to look at the false wall possibility. That will be a difficult spousal sell :-) If it covered at least the portion of the bottom wall adjacent to the entrance door, would that be sufficient? What counts as a "wall"? Would floor to ceiling thick 703 with burlap face count (and beat just typical corner, widespread placement)?

As an alternative, I scoped out other potential rooms in the house, seeing if there might be better starting point measurements that (with some spousal management!) could be made available. Less convenient, but if bass trapping needs drop by a significant amount, worth considering!

I sketched out two "Plan B" options below. Any of these vastly better as starting points? The third option actually shows where I am situated right now. Who knows, perhaps staying where I am is best (although there is no treatment because it is the master bedroom, might be a tough sell). Of course, I have 18' length and 9' height in that room.......
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Not quite square, help with orientation-planb-options.jpg  
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