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Neumann KH310 or Focal Twin??
Old 1st March 2014
  #1
Gear Nut
 
jemu999's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Neumann KH310 or Focal Twin??

Anybody hear both by chance?

Im able to get a real good price on the Neumann 310s, basically $500 more than Focal twins. (..which is about $500 more than my budget, but I can just make it happen!)

I have a very large control room, 25 x 22, and thus am looking for speakers in the 3k, that of course are flat, but also have power. I was thinking about the PSI audio, but I just don't think the A17 are big enough for my room, and the a21 are out budget range.

Any thoughts>>>>??


Your opinions would be very welcome!
Thanks
Old 2nd March 2014
  #2
Gear Nut
 
jemu999's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
anybody...?
Old 2nd March 2014
  #3
Lives for gear
 
MIKEHARRIS's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
What kind of music you do? How loud you like to monitor ?
Old 2nd March 2014 | Show parent
  #4
Gear Nut
 
jemu999's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEHARRIS ➡️
What kind of music you do? How loud you like to monitor ?
Hi Mike,

These speakers will mainly be used for rock and pop. I don't necessarily mix loud, however, there are times I like to increase the volume and "feel" the music. My main monitors now are a pair of ns10s and Mackie HR824s. The Mackies will be replaced, and the new monitors need to have at least the power of the Mackies. (The room is large enough that the mackies start to break up at high volumes)

thnx
Old 2nd March 2014
  #5
Gear Guru
 
NathanEldred's Avatar
 
7 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
They both go loud enough to cause hearing damage. The previous model of K+H (now Neumann) 0300 would not go loud enough for some people's tastes mainly with how the limiter kicked in early especially on bass heavier material. The 0310s are improved in this regard in bass extension and headroom. Even in a room that large, you are still only going to be 5 to 8 feet from the speakers, meaning they will be the same distance apart to make an equilateral triangle. That's pretty close for anything much over 95db for any long period of time, which they both handle fine.
Old 2nd March 2014
  #6
Lives for gear
 
MIKEHARRIS's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Rock + Loud = Focal Twin.
Leaves you a upgrade path with SoloSub should you need more Loud
Old 2nd March 2014
  #7
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I haven't heard the focals. I have used the kh310 and they made it very easy and enjoyable to mix in my crappy sounding control room. Plenty of happy kh310 users on here if you do a search.
Old 3rd March 2014
  #8
ECM
Gear Addict
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Not even in the same league, 310 blow them away in terms of accuracyaccross the spectrum and a proper true amount of low end deepness. (Which the twins cannot keep with especially below 42Hz)
Old 4th March 2014
  #9
Gear Nut
 
jemu999's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Hey thanks everyone for the input. Very helpful indeed.

So.... I ordered the KH310's today! Even better, a friend has agreed to bring his Focal Twins for a proper shootout. Looking forward to hearing them both....
Old 4th March 2014
  #10
Gear Nut
 
jemu999's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Hey thanks everyone for the input. Very helpful indeed.

So.... I ordered the KH310's today! Even better, a friend has agreed to bring his Focal Twins for a proper shootout. Looking forward to hearing them both....
Old 9th April 2014
  #11
Here for the gear
 
hollaback06's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Hi Jemu999,
Im also interested in the focal twin as well as the neumann kh 310. how did the neumanns compare to the twins that your friend brought over?

Thx
Old 9th April 2014
  #12
Lives for gear
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 5 years
The 310's cost $800 more than the Twins. I heard both and you can obtain a great mix on both monitors. Though the Twins don't need a sub to get good mixes, you could add the Focal CMS sub for playback and have a better setup in my opinion.
Old 9th April 2014
  #13
Here for the gear
 
hollaback06's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Thanks Jason. Did u hear any differences btwn twins and 310s in regards to depth (being able to place sounds front to back) as well as tightness in lowend, midrange clarity etc.

I dont really need a loud low end. For me the more accurate, distinct and clearer the sound is the better it is for me.

Thx for any and all info ...
Old 9th April 2014
  #14
Lives for gear
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 5 years
All monitors have their own character and part of it comes down to personal preference. 310's has a little better depth compared to the Twins which I own. However with the mids, I prefer the Twins which have a little more forward sound. It helps to hear the mix in that busy area where vocals, guitars, and keyboards are.
Old 10th April 2014
  #15
Here for the gear
 
hollaback06's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Thx Jason! I found a place near me that has Neumann 310, Focal Twins and CMS65s. So I can compare the speakers I'm interested in purchasing opposed with the speaker I already own (cms 65). Will let you know what I hear.

Also, I'm really interested to hear more from ECM who posted on this thread earlier and said that the Twins are not even in the same league as the Neumann 310. That's the first time I've heard someone say that. Most everyone I've spoken to have said they are comparable, just different depending on your taste / room. Interested to hear addition info if anyone else agrees with that ...
Old 10th April 2014 | Show parent
  #16
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rhizomeman's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason rocks ➡️
All monitors have their own character and part of it comes down to personal preference.
This ^

Happy Focal Twins owner here. I also use the KH120s, which are excellent. I'm sure the KH bigger brother will be good too. It's not about "better" but about how you react to the sound and what you like in a monitor.
Old 11th April 2014
  #17
Here for the gear
 
hollaback06's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Thanks rhizomeman
Old 5th September 2014
  #18
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
I have just finished my hunt for new speakers. Here's the tale:

I own a little project studio and used a pair of ADAM A7 and a Sub8 for the last six years.
Material ranges from Singer/Songwriter to Classical, Rock, Symphonic Metal, ProgMetal.
Converters were first a few MBoxes (Mini, Pro) then a 003 and now an Omni and HDN.

The room is treated and together with iK's ARC2 I get +/-2dB and 0.3sec to 70Hz, 1sec below.

The A7s are pretty good, but their separation and depth is kinda lacking. I just can't hit it with the reverb. So I was looking for an upgrade.

A first quick trip to JustMusic in Munich, Germany, yielded a comparision between A7x, KH120, S1x+Sub10.
Each speaker in this lineup is a step up.
The A7x are a lot better than my old A7. More clarity, bass, stereo image, better cohesion. My quick advise to anyone still using the original A7: dump them and get the 'X'. It's like the jump from PT10 to 11

The KH120 are even better and have a beautiful stereo image and linearity. They may even work without a Sub, which the ADAMs don't.

S1X are outstanding but severely lack bass. Good for speech. Together with a Sub10 they were a first safe harbor.
But the price point was pretty heavy by now as well. And then it was a 2.1 system, so we moved into their "pro" listening room to check out a few single boxes.
The Neumann KH310, Focal 6 Be Twin were standing around from a previous session, so I had a quick listen. Closing time was approaching.

The first ones up were the Focal. What a difference!
Wide stereo panorama, super separation, nice tone. First impression was "creamy". Different league from the stuff in the other room!

Then came the KH310. Also top image, depth, clarity. First impression was 'real life'. Awesome stuff!
But the store was closing and three and a half grand are better not spent in a few minutes. So we scheduled a listening session a few days later.


Armed with a few 24bit/96k files from HDTracks and Linn, and a session of mine, and a few spoken word samples, I returned.

A new contender this time was ADAM's S3X-V. And the KH310 and Focal Twins from last time.
All tracks were imported into their HDX demo system (converter was an Omni) and compared via latched solo.

Songs played include Beethoven's 5th from SFS, Dvorak's 9th from Ivan Fisher/Budapest Festival, Bob Marley's "No Woman, No Cry", Opeth's new (and outstanding!) "Eternal Rain will come", "Part IIc" from Keith Jarret's Köln Concert, "The End" from Hans Zimmer's "Dark Knight Rises" and "Giorgio by Moroder" from Daft Punk.

What a joy!

All three systems are superb and offer outstanding performances.

The ADAM's were of course closest to what I am used to from my (now lowly) A7s.
Very detailed highs, forward mids, a little bass shy. Stereo image is top notch, the scene is spread nicely far and wide, localization is easy, the way the rooms are detailed is great. My A7s on steroids...

The Focal Twins unfortunately lost out pretty fast for me. The stereo image is wider than with the other two, localization is great, but they (to my ears) sound rather raspy in the high mids and highs. At least compared with the other two speakers in this lineup.
Their linearity is better than with the ADAMs, but especially on the classical pieces they produced quite a few "arghs" and raised hairs on the brass and oboe parts of Beethoven's 5th. The final nail was Moroder speaking in the intro to Daft Punk's "Giorgio by Moroder". Very colored.

Neumann KH310 won this shootout for me. Very detailed, airy but not harsh, broad soundstage, easy localization, great depth. Moroder sounds just like a human, Beethoven is almost within reach and all other titles sound just like they were played on a stage in front of you. No colorization, great linearity.

A final test was a spoken track from Herbert Grönemeyer's "Das Boot". From all the contenders, the Neumanns just sound like he's right beside you talking. True to life. The other two color quite a bit, the Focal more than the ADAMs.

And a spoken track from my wife (as a surprise pre-christmas present a few years ago she read and recorded Jostein Gaarder's "Christmas Mystery" and sent me one chapter every day, since I was away on business until christmas) sealed the deal. She was right there!
Without any coloration, distortion or anything else. Just there in our study reading to me. Amazing speakers!

After that I opened up the Session of mine and it was just so easy to iron out what had bothered me all the time. Instant EQ and done. No fuzzing around, they just told me what to do...

So to finally cut to the chase:

Thanks for reading all this, I hope I can be a little help to some in the same boat, looking for a few opinions on potential new speakers.

The Focals were great on the rock stuff but sub par on the classical. Their stereo image is super wide, rooms are easy to tell.

The ADAM S3X-V are very precise with forward highs and mids. A little bass shy. Like a pair of AKG's K712.

The Neumann KH310 are just true to life. Nothing added or subtracted. Great stereo field, top localization. They are kinda like my Beyer DT880 pro with better resolution.

And I have to say a huge "thank you!" to the fellas at the Munich JustMusic store. I've spent almost five hours in their demo room with a HDX and awesome speakers to play around with, had a coffee on the house and a lot of great chats. YOU ROCK DUDES! (alright, and 'RAP' )

hth.

Last edited by banthafood; 5th September 2014 at 02:06 AM.. Reason: one ) added ;)
Old 5th September 2014
  #19
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
If i have to choose between those two, i'll go down with Neumann. Unless if you want to save some more, i'll recommend SM9 or Barefoot Mm27. And yes I have used both.
Old 28th September 2014
  #20
Here for the gear
 
hollaback06's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Been looking at monitors for past 7 months.

I just compared the Focal Twinns versus the Neumann Kh 310. After hearing them in a realtime shootout, I'm going with the 310s. I thought it handled low end better. Has better separation of instruments. More open sounding, better depth and felt more natural. On both systems I felt like I could identify when I didn't like the mix of a commercially produced song, but on Neumann I felt like I could more clearly identify what specifically was wrong.

I currently mix on focal cms 65s so I went in expecting to like the Focal sound better. But I left worried that the top end on the Focal felt almost a little too good. Almost shimmery in comparison to the Neumann.

lastly, Neumann really handled the low end much much better! Felt like it extended lower but was not boomy.

All just my opinions.
Old 28th September 2014
  #21
Lives for gear
 
rhizomeman's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Congrats hollaback! Love my kh120s. Such a great feeling to find the right monitors.
Old 31st January 2015
  #22
Deleted b5734b5
Guest
I have the Neumann KH120 and I've been thinking of purchasing the KH310, the other contender is the Genelec 8250A. How they compare? The goal is mixing mainly ambient music.
Old 1st February 2015
  #23
Gear Guru
 
Musiclab's Avatar
I have Focal Twins and love them, but for this kind of money you should check whatever speakers you're thinking of in your own room. They're both great but one will probably be better in YOUR ROOM.
Old 1st February 2015 | Show parent
  #24
Deleted b5734b5
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Musiclab ➡️
I have Focal Twins and love them, but for this kind of money you should check whatever speakers you're thinking of in your own room. They're both great but one will probably be better in YOUR ROOM.
Yes, the problem is, I usually rent an house for an year then I move, so the room it's not fixed...That was the reason I was thinking the genelecs because they have room calibration DSP... Any thoughts?
Old 1st February 2015 | Show parent
  #25
Gear Guru
 
Musiclab's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted b5734b5 ➡️
Yes, the problem is, I usually rent an house for an year then I move, so the room it's not fixed...That was the reason I was thinking the genelecs because they have room calibration DSP... Any thoughts?
Well it's always said better to treat the room than use eq, which is basically what's going on with DSP. Perhaps there are some portable room treatments you could get. Since I've never used those Genelecs or the 310's, I can't speak of them. I do use a pair of Neumann KH120's along with the Focals, I like them as a secondary set, but I trust the Focals in my room.
Old 1st February 2015 | Show parent
  #26
Deleted b5734b5
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Musiclab ➡️
Well it's always said better to treat the room than use eq, which is basically what's going on with DSP. Perhaps there are some portable room treatments you could get. Since I've never used those Genelecs or the 310's, I can't speak of them. I do use a pair of Neumann KH120's along with the Focals, I like them as a secondary set, but I trust the Focals in my room.
So in your opinion the extra cash on the DSP tech is useless?
Old 1st February 2015
  #27
Deleted b5734b5
Guest
1.179 euros for the 8050

vs

1.650 euros for the 8250 (8050 + dsp built in)
Old 1st February 2015 | Show parent
  #28
Gear Guru
 
Musiclab's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted b5734b5 ➡️
So in your opinion the extra cash on the DSP tech is useless?
I've never used those speakers so for me to voice an opinion on them is just someone spouting off. What I do know is it's always better to treat the room than to eq your speakers, but since you're not doing a purpose built studio, you might need some combination of treatment and eq. The less the DSP has to work the better. So my advice would be invest in some easy to move and install treatments and the speakers that seem to work the best for where you are now. Since where you'll be in the future is unknowable, deal with the here and now with an eye to the future. What I can tell you about the Focals is they've been honest, more so than any other monitor I've owned.
Old 9th August 2018 | Show parent
  #29
Deleted 49e1b71
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted b5734b5 ➡️
Yes, the problem is, I usually rent an house for an year then I move, so the room it's not fixed...That was the reason I was thinking the genelecs because they have room calibration DSP... Any thoughts?
I have GIK acoustic panels on mic stands for mobility/vocal booth.

And they hang on walls with OOK picture hangers...

For a few hundred bucks you can make a room sound much better and you could take it all down in a few minutes if need be
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