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Taylor Swift- "Speak Now" Album- Clipping/Distortion?
Old 5th November 2012 | Show parent
  #31
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey
Up to you really! But if it contradicts what you hear, I'd trust the ears first.
I don't care.
That's the aesthetic independence that makes you a great engineer! You don't even care what your ears tell you! heh



j/k
Old 5th November 2012 | Show parent
  #32
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she sings good. better then me.

Old 5th November 2012 | Show parent
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
she sings good. better then me.

The video posted is 'private' and can't be seen by others (unless they have the required password). :(



My 'problem' with records like (what I've heard of) Speak Now (and I've heard obvious tuning in all three tracks from it I've heard so far) is not so much that the artist can or can't sing -- it's when the obvious artifacts of correction remain in the finished product. I think it's an insult to the audience and, in a sense, to the artist.

Now if the artist is simply too lazy to do his/her part -- and it's not the label A&R and productions staff rushing them through to save money -- clearly, the artist has, effectively, insulted himself. As well as the audience.
Old 5th November 2012 | Show parent
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 ➡️
... insulted himself. As well as the audience.
Yeah that might be the complicated way to see it. Thing is the regular MP3 buyer on iTunes don´t care; and they love this music obviously. And I hardly think she believes she insulted herself. Even if YOU told her.
Maybe before T-pain. I don´t know

Last edited by Heyclown; 5th November 2012 at 10:26 PM.. Reason: So nowadays we need a reason to edit? Get out
Old 6th November 2012
  #35
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
she sings good. better then me.

Hmm...not having heard you sing, who knows what sort of benchmark that is?

I'm with blue of course...if she can sing and the album still sounds tuned, it's either done in purpose or it's just bad production decisions ( for the style, possibly both).

If not...might be the best they can get!
Old 6th November 2012 | Show parent
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 ➡️
The video posted is 'private' and can't be seen by others (unless they have the required password). :(

the video is uploaded again on the vevo channel.. i dont know what they did.. first they uploaded then made private, then removed it. now its back again
Old 6th November 2012 | Show parent
  #37
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyclown ➡️
Yeah that might be the complicated way to see it. Thing is the regular MP3 buyer on iTunes don´t care; and they love this music obviously. And I hardly think she believes she insulted herself. Even if YOU told her.
Maybe before T-pain. I don´t know
I know.

The voice in the wilderness and all that. Also, I don't have a lawn any more so there's no kids to yell at to get off it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
[...]

I'm with blue of course...if she can sing and the album still sounds tuned, it's either done in purpose or it's just bad production decisions ( for the style, possibly both).

If not...might be the best they can get!
Right.

I get tuned-for-effect. Use it on a vocal all the way through a verse, chorus, or whole song, I get it. It's not a sound I'm comfortable with, but I get it. It's an effect.

But when the tuning goes from nonexistent or unnoticeable to quite obvious every once in a while and that just happens to coincide with the tricky-to-sing bits, well, I just think that's a production lapse that reflects poorly on the whole project. That's probably a better way of saying what I was ranting about.

I was pretty grumpy when I wrote the posts above. The problem is, whenever I hear that sore thumb tuning phenom, it puts me in a bad mood. It's a visceral thing, honestly.

There was an alt country guy whose writing -- and untuned singing -- I really liked (liked the writing really well and the voice well enough, it wasn't bad, at all, by singer-songwriter standards), but whose albums starting about 2002 were all marred by such stick-out artifacts. There'd be some subtle stuff on and off through pretty much all the songs, but at least once or twice a song, there would just be this unbelievably weird, chirping tuning artifact. It made me crazy, 'cause I really liked everything else about what was going on in his otherwise down to earth, slice-of-life country. But the tuning artifacts made it just unlistenable for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
the video is uploaded again on the vevo channel.. i dont know what they did.. first they uploaded then made private, then removed it. now its back again
I'll try to hunt it down.

You know, for a few bars at the intro of the song , "Speak Now," (on the album) I thought her seemingly untuned singing sounded kind of nice: vulnerable, real. And then the standard big production kicked in and it wasn't too long before some fairly obvious tuning came in (and then the super-obvious tuning on the oh-oh-oh melismas, of course).
Old 6th November 2012
  #38
Gear Nut
 
🎧 5 years
Her voice can be quite piercing at times in the 5khz range. Her first album was, but on Fearless it was a bit mellower. 'Story of Us' on Speak Now sounds distorted to me... unless it's a synth I'm hearing.
Old 6th November 2012
  #39
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I heard a little bit of Swift's latest at the beginning of a Ken Tucker review (on Terry Gross's otherwise excellent NPR show) and... well... we won't be arguing about whether or not there's tuning on that one. She's gone mainstream pop, complete with hard tuned vocals. At least on the track I heard -- which I do not think will be knocking Gaga off her crit fave pedestal any time soon but which will nonetheless probably sell a bazillion units, anyhow.
Old 6th November 2012 | Show parent
  #40
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Old 8th November 2012
  #41
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Shame the over use of autotune or whatever variation in todays music. So easy in the digital age to just, do it over and over till you get it right.
Old 8th November 2012 | Show parent
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BushmasterM4 ➡️
Shame the over use of autotune or whatever variation in todays music. So easy in the digital age to just, do it over and over till you get it right.
unfortunately artist cant survive without autotune in this digital age...

before u had to become a singer u had to know how to sing. weird right? thats not the case anymore thanks to autotune.
Old 8th November 2012 | Show parent
  #43
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
God, that song´s pretty stupid. I can appreciate fine session players playing for this kind of teen idols, but the whole dancing and the faces are too stupid/inmature for my taste. Need to put some Tori Amos or Me´Shell to restore my inner balance! jajaj aj
Old 9th November 2012 | Show parent
  #44
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
unfortunately artist cant survive without autotune in this digital age...

before u had to become a singer u had to know how to sing. weird right? thats not the case anymore thanks to autotune.
I don't think the former is actually the case.

I hear lots of fine, contemporary artists who don't appear to use tuning.

It's not like people who already knew how to sing forgot how.


That said, in the world of those trying desperately to knick the me-too, cookie-cutter sound of secretary/shop boy pop, a la Glee, well, I guess you gotta do what you gotta do. Me, I don't listen to it, and I don't have the slightest desire to emulate it.
Old 9th November 2012
  #45
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Am I a bad man for not being a Swift fan? My son's GF plays her stuff incessantly and thinks she's the best thing since sliced bread.

I believe Blue is right - it sounds tuned to my ear. And at times thin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
the video is uploaded again on the vevo channel.. i dont know what they did.. first they uploaded then made private, then removed it. now its back again
Her mom probably asked them to retweak the autotunes...
Old 9th November 2012 | Show parent
  #46
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syncamorea ➡️
Am I a bad man for not being a Swift fan? My son's GF plays her stuff incessantly and thinks she's the best thing since sliced bread.

I believe Blue is right - it sounds tuned to my ear. And at times thin.



Her mom probably asked them to retweak the autotunes...
I have some online music biz friends, whose insights and professionalism I respect, who love her.

These same folks don't seem to have any problem with tuning-artifacts in general which has been a point of discussion a number of times between us, since I obviously feel it's a production lapse in a vocal intended to sound 'natural.' So we certainly don't always see eye to eye on pop music issues, for sure.

Me, even if she were to have all the sore-thumb tuning magically removed from her oeuvre, her stuff would still be a long way from my comfort zone, in large part. That big, slick formula production just turns me right off.
Old 9th November 2012 | Show parent
  #47
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syncamorea ➡️
Am I a bad man for not being a Swift fan? My son's GF plays her stuff incessantly and thinks she's the best thing since sliced bread.

I believe Blue is right - it sounds tuned to my ear. And at times thin.



Her mom probably asked them to retweak the autotunes...
The latter thought had crossed my mind.

Certainly it would be far from the only well-budgeted video shoot (presumably for DVD release) that was tuned, possibly or likely repunched, remixed, and generally heavily manicured for formal release. And, of course, sometimes even those carefully manicured DVD releases of "live" recordings have ended up with some pretty obvious corrections.
Old 9th November 2012 | Show parent
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 ➡️
Me, even if she were to have all the sore-thumb tuning magically removed from her oeuvre, her stuff would still be a long way from my comfort zone, in large part. That big, slick formula production just turns me right off.
Yea, the auto-tune isn't a problem for me. But the big slick formula is. I'm not anti-country per se, but I grew up around the classic "I was drunk when my momma got out of prison" kind of country, and even though I loved much of Chet Atkins' music, I didn't like the effect he had long term on the genre through his RCA machine. I think the folk/blues, alt and outlaw stuff that still sounds incredible.
Old 9th November 2012 | Show parent
  #49
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syncamorea ➡️
Yea, the auto-tune isn't a problem for me. But the big slick formula is. I'm not anti-country per se, but I grew up around the classic "I was drunk when my momma got out of prison" kind of country, and even though I loved much of Chet Atkins' music, I didn't like the effect he had long term on the genre through his RCA machine. I think the folk/blues, alt and outlaw stuff that still sounds incredible.
I've actually come to appreciate some of the 'uptown country' sounds of the 60s and 70s Nashville crooners that turned me off when I was an Outlaw Country-lovin' hippie. Hank may not have done it that'a way, but some of those cats could sing. Stuff that made me laugh during late night commercials for seemingly lugubrious country collections -- like Faron Young's iconic "Hello, Walls" -- worked their way over the decades into my subconscious.

But, for sure, it's the rootsy, folk, and bluegrass-influenced stuff I really love.


PS... despite my antipathy for the tuned vocals and the manufactured pop sound, I think I have to give some respect to the hookiness of "We Aren't Ever Getting Back Together." It's almost infectious enough to reach me. And, for the genre, THAT is heady praise.
Old 10th November 2012 | Show parent
  #50
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
unfortunately artist cant survive without autotune in this digital age...

before u had to become a singer u had to know how to sing. weird right? thats not the case anymore thanks to autotune.
Of course they can. Not every singer is "tuned to death". Some can't even sing WITH autotune...

Pop - it's part of the sound, if you were to do ultra-pop like the stuff you're constantly on about, yes tuning is part of the sound.

You still get a better sounding record if the person can sing in the first place though.
Old 10th November 2012 | Show parent
  #51
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Wow Taylor swift Vevo now has total 1,000,000,000 views .
and it has 1 million subs too

We are never getting back together - 72 million views in 3 months ( #5 on youtube 100 )

Half of those view are probably mine..
Old 10th November 2012
  #52
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nznexus ➡️
Half of those view are probably mine..
I don't doubt it!
Old 10th November 2012 | Show parent
  #53
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
I don't doubt it!
PM you're killing me dude

Nznexus you really need to be inspired by some other producers, there are a lot of creative people out there
Old 22nd November 2012 | Show parent
  #54
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........
Old 22nd November 2012 | Show parent
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H-Rezz ➡️
PM you're killing me dude

Nznexus you really need to be inspired by some other producers, there are a lot of creative people out there
what producers?
Old 22nd November 2012 | Show parent
  #56
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theblue1's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
Of course they can. Not every singer is "tuned to death". Some can't even sing WITH autotune...

Pop - it's part of the sound, if you were to do ultra-pop like the stuff you're constantly on about, yes tuning is part of the sound.

You still get a better sounding record if the person can sing in the first place though.
I'd heard from a number of people I respect that Lady Gaga really could sing, but I was nonetheless kinda stunned by how true that was when I saw her duet with Tony Bennett on "The Lady Is a Tramp." She might be a little overlong on sass (hey, but I like sass), but it's clear that she has a fine vocal instrument and plenty of control.
Old 22nd November 2012 | Show parent
  #57
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Taylor Swift is another beautiful young girl who young people can look up to. She lived in Hendersonville, right outside of Nash-vegas... Or Nashville if you may.

Anyway, her father is a stock broker or something so obviously they have a lot of money. Hendersonville is full of very wealthy people (including many famous country/bluegrass stars such as the late Johnny Cash).

She is doing a great job bringing millions of people together! I have mucho respect for her.

Also something to keep in mind, having been on stage singing in many different bands, it gets very loud and difficult to hear yourself - that makes it really hard to sing well! And there is always some nerves that come into play.

I say go to the concert if you want to! Its all about making memories and bringing people together.
Old 22nd November 2012 | Show parent
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 ➡️
I heard a little bit of Swift's latest at the beginning of a Ken Tucker review (on Terry Gross's otherwise excellent NPR show) and... well... we won't be arguing about whether or not there's tuning on that one. She's gone mainstream pop, complete with hard tuned vocals. At least on the track I heard -- which I do not think will be knocking Gaga off her crit fave pedestal any time soon but which will nonetheless probably sell a bazillion units, anyhow.
From what I hear, that applies to most of what is called "country music" these days.
Old 22nd November 2012 | Show parent
  #59
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilDW ➡️
From what I hear, that applies to most of what is called "country music" these days.
Well, the Nashville studios were clearly at the forefront of those initially using Auto-Tune as a standard tool in pop production -- and we have a decade or so of Nashville pop ('country' if you must) marred in large part by sore-thumb tuning wrenchmarks left behind by production staff and artists who apparently felt that was 'good enough.'

But the tune to which I refer is hard-tuned, contemporary pop, not the poorly-corrected Nashville style 'country' pop that was the sonic signature of her ascendance to Grammy Country Vocalist of the Year (leading to that onstage mega-trainwreck at the awards show).


Now, I will say this, it does appear that Swift has put some attention into finally learning how to sing. I have heard some clearly carefully rehearsed vocal with acoustic accompaniment vids where her singing is at least girl-next-door quality -- which is a long way up from some of what we had heard previously.

Still, it's a funny world where someone starts learning to sing AFTER winning a Vocalist of the Year award.
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