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What hardware flanger for mixing?
Old 5th October 2013 | Show parent
  #31
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbob1 ➑️
It's a good question and possibly how he does it (Dave Fox). I have to admit that my eyes glaze over a bit when I read the product info and I end up just twisting knobs.
Yeap....That's why I'm HARDware all the way! heh
Old 5th October 2013
  #32
Gear Head
 
Scriabin's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'm surprised noone has mentioned the original Eventide Instant Flanger...it's all over Zeppelin's later albums. The H949 also has an interesting flanger algorithm.
I picked up a pair for just under a grand on eBay last week. Together they look like something from the Death Star. I'm still on the hunt for the Instant Phaser and Omnipressor...All of Eventides early products were so unique and cool.
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What hardware flanger for mixing?-deathstar.jpg  
Old 7th October 2013 | Show parent
  #33
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scriabin ➑️
I'm surprised noone has mentioned the original Eventide Instant Flanger...it's all over Zeppelin's later albums. The H949 also has an interesting flanger algorithm.
I picked up a pair for just under a grand on eBay last week. Together they look like something from the Death Star. I'm still on the hunt for the Instant Phaser and Omnipressor...All of Eventides early products were so unique and cool.
Good buy....careful though as.... No doubt the Instant Flanger/Phaser 910/949 are great products, though when....and I mean ...WHEN...One Eventide part on a Board goes "Thunk, Crack, Boom, Sizzle..Puff..That's it...Gone. Unless you have David Kulka in your pocket and a spares machine, they are not...really 24/7 viable in 2013. Omnipressor's are amazing though only the white VU can be fixed and most sold are black VU again part of Eventide using custom eventide parts etc....(Yes, this will happen with certain Lexicon parts one day as well, and as always parts machines are mandatory in my scenario. Say my Lexicon Primetime II for Flanging, and even though I keep a $700 buck 2nd working unit for Spares etc.... as I know one day it will go down slowly no matter how much TLC it has been given!).

A Roland SBF Flanger/Phaser from the RSS Studio Series is easier to Fix then Eventides with their Custom IC Everything Inc All Parts save DBX! I have an RSS-80 Roland Studio Spring Reverb from the actual system and it's 3 Rack units 1/4" Steel Front Racking and built from Low Z to Mic / Line with 2 Compressors built inside the Rack (Stereo). The Actual Roland number is Unit RSV8 as people think of RSS Studio System of the Mid 90's that was surround sound etc). This RSS Version and the flangers etc are totally BBD and Spring Verbs. If you really want a "Great Sounding Flanger - MXR Flangers are brilliant"
Old 10th October 2013 | Show parent
  #34
Gear Head
 
Scriabin's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastByte ➑️
Good buy....careful though as.... No doubt the Instant Flanger/Phaser 910/949 are great products, though when....and I mean ...WHEN...One Eventide part on a Board goes "Thunk, Crack, Boom, Sizzle..Puff..That's it...Gone. Unless you have David Kulka in your pocket and a spares machine, they are not...really 24/7 viable in 2013. Omnipressor's are amazing though only the white VU can be fixed and most sold are black VU again part of Eventide using custom eventide parts etc....(Yes, this will happen with certain Lexicon parts one day as well, and as always parts machines are mandatory in my scenario. Say my Lexicon Primetime II for Flanging, and even though I keep a $700 buck 2nd working unit for Spares etc.... as I know one day it will go down slowly no matter how much TLC it has been given!).

A Roland SBF Flanger/Phaser from the RSS Studio Series is easier to Fix then Eventides with their Custom IC Everything Inc All Parts save DBX! I have an RSS-80 Roland Studio Spring Reverb from the actual system and it's 3 Rack units 1/4" Steel Front Racking and built from Low Z to Mic / Line with 2 Compressors built inside the Rack (Stereo). The Actual Roland number is Unit RSV8 as people think of RSS Studio System of the Mid 90's that was surround sound etc). This RSS Version and the flangers etc are totally BBD and Spring Verbs. If you really want a "Great Sounding Flanger - MXR Flangers are brilliant"
Fear not with the Eventide gear...contact Dane @ Beamish Electronics in Cleveland. He's brought back to life two H949s and a FL120 Flanger for me that everyone else said it was better worth trashing.

His rates and service are top notch...sort of a mad wizard for electronics repair.

Any leads on an Omnipressor? I'm looking at the monolithic digital delays as well but I'm not sure they're much better than the delay in my H949s...thoughts?
Old 12th October 2013 | Show parent
  #35
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scriabin ➑️
Fear not with the Eventide gear...contact Dane @ Beamish Electronics in Cleveland. He's brought back to life two H949s and a FL120 Flanger for me that everyone else said it was better worth trashing.

His rates and service are top notch...sort of a mad wizard for electronics repair.

Any leads on an Omnipressor? I'm looking at the monolithic digital delays as well but I'm not sure they're much better than the delay in my H949s...thoughts?
Regarding Beamish - I put them up as Repair agents for Lex/Eventide/Others as the were one of the few still fixing Lexicon & Eventide units in 2011 such as 224's and 480L's plus m/L300's etc. The Omnipressor, Amazing unit & sadly missed by most people much like the SP2016 Reverb FX Unit. The Omnipressor came in 2 versions 1 had a White face VU and the later units were all Black Face VU Metered. Again the BF Omnipressor is a brilliant unit though can have many fickle troubles (As can the WF Model). I nearly one a unit in an Auction on eBay from a great seller, though in the end was thankful I was outbid. Eventide were very into self building rather then out sourcing OEM parts and the White VU version Omnipressor had DBX Chips and other numerous type - able to be sourced Spare Parts, when they changed to the Black VU metered version, once again it was all very Eventide In-house redesign, and this has made for parts un-obtannium unless you have a 2nd unit to cannibalise!

A simple trip to STUDIO ELECTRONICS will tell the story in more depth and detail then I can here: Though Dave Kulka and his team specialise on plenty of gear on the Omnipressor area they offer a pretty thorough bunch on details and why for's and what not's etc. Part of the Eventide Legacy runs from their own design RAM Chips from the IBM Systems computers they used (The IBM "SPUD" System being one), and a testament to this In-House development is the delay and subsequent "RAM Chips" Eventide made in-house from the 1745 Delay to the BD-500 And early under 15kHz units to Hi-end BD-20kHz units for Radio & Broadcast (Broadcast Profanity Delay Systems Ram) using the same RAM as those used on Eventide H3000 Sampler boards, although not socketed, I have had a Tech fix a H3500B unit's 30 Sec sampler card with Spare BD-RAM Chips.

Though For Compression/Expansion & Reverse Audio Gain Adjusting and Companding etc.....The Omnipressor's really do colour and make the signal something else, unless a White VU Meter version came at a reasonable Price; I would be reluctant to buy a BF VU version, as even these units sell for average of $600-$800 and then you could spend another $500 making sure the unit could live another 5 years -10 Years again. YMMV though when you hit a massive bump in tech troubles with older Eventides it can be a long road back (Often 18 months) and many people sell as the never get around to fixing them up again, so buying a unit on eBay is a gamble - unless by a trusted re-seller an the item is fully 7-14 day returnable, then it would be a exception, though still maybe a purchase, a better idea would be to buy one from say a friend of a friend who had a working unit ready to let go!

It seems as though the Mists of time and Operational HQ Changes of OEM Facilities has resulted in a Loss of Schematics and design Spec's from the SP2016 to the Omnipressor and I'm actually surprised no one has reverse engineered the Omnipressor by 2013. Sure the SP2016 was "Re-Made" with various Programs (A 100% Full Ground up Re-Design of the unit being as faithful to the original as possible though with fewer Algo's) so ...say from the Eventide SP2016 the Princeton SP2016 which was redesigned with Physical controls in mind and actual Knobs for access and most used controls were put in the unit alongside Decay and Randomization, Depth of Front/Back and filter controls etc. (There is a decent Youtube video showing the detail). The newer unit seems to be basically a Hardware controlled Driven Menu (like the Old Lexicon M200 or PCM-60 & PCM41/42 + PrimeTimes) which were manually operated devices with little or no Deep menu driven scenarios. If an SP2016 had the Operational O.S of even half the Original Eventide 2016 then I would buy one in a nano second - a Brief session with a Modern 2016 was cool, though nothing like an original SP2016 by Eventide.

Though this "Ground Up Re-design" of the 2016 by Princeton Digital preserves and enhances certain 2016 Reverbs to be as good as it could get with no Hard Archival Notes to refer to, to me the unit is no where near what the actual "Eventide Original SP2016" unit was or could achieve and do with Various Rom scenarios, being able to run 2 Programs at he same time (Dual Functionality) while retaining another 20-30 odd plus in it's Operating System, many of which filtered up thru the 949 and down into the 969 and H3000 units. An Algo to Algo match up from reading the SP2016 Manual explaining it's Algo Use (Hence the H3000 Similarities) which you'll find online makes this plain as daylight. Still and H3000 and the Princeton SP2016 make no dent into what was the original Eventide SP2016 (Price reflective). One thing regarding the Omnipressor that I did found very informative and quite mouth watering for purchase of an actual unit was, the designed model that showed up in the later Eventide DSP4000 series Harmonizers which had an Omnipressor Preset; this also gave a VSIG demonstration showing just how much detail had gone into the design of the Omnipressor and the version in the DSP4000 was/can be extremely useful to see how an Original unit might suit you - either that or the Plug In.

Overall it seems to many older Engineers like myself that the Omnipressor was one of those units that has been overlooked in the history annuls and lost in the LA-2A, 1176 and Fairchild, Pultec type scenarios. They in my Compressor Parlance where one of the 1st units that were 100% Studio and FOH units, they could be used for a Multitude of tasks and were actually not that expensive by the standards of the day compared to the 2016 and the "New Wave" of Digital Eq's, Compressors, Expanders, Compander's, Reverse enable program material Elements and so on! Seriously Amazing Operational capabilities! and certainly in my top 10 of Compressors that I wish I had 2 of.

So what Am I Exactly saying about buying Old Eventide Gear: (Personally I love the stuff, from 910's to H8000's which are now getting to 10 years old plus, though really of great sound & operation). Know what your getting into, know that you could run into some trouble (As with all older gear) and if you can pick up any 2nd hand junked Eventide Units 1st, often then, I feel this can be the starting place or Spring Board to find an Operational unit leaving you with spare Parts and and a touch of room to breath, the older "Murata Filters" now have a replacement in 4 pole "Butterworth Designs" and this takes a huge weight of many shoulders considering those filters were crucial in many early OEM designs from Eventide to many other OEM's. THe Price for Both the Omnipressor and SP2016 Originals from Eventide can be pretty hefty though as anything worthwhile their is a reason! These Units simply do what no other could at the time and to many still can't. The Instant Flanger/Phaser and 949/910 & H3000's seem to be much more reliable then other Eventide gear and in 2013...... People are still exploding with "WOW!!!!! after buying a 25 Year Old Eventide H3000! If that doesn't say something about Eventide's Products I'm not quite sure what does. Best of Luck!

TLB
Old 18th October 2013
  #36
Gear Head
 
Scriabin's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Very insightful post...I appreciate it! I'm waiting to receive the H949 and FL120 back from Beamish. It's always interesting to pick his brain when he's digging through the units. Both units show a remarkable amount of ingenuity in the designs.

Interestingly, it seems like a regular occurence with small oversights made by the builders such as reversed DBX cards or loose solder joints that appear to have left the factory in that way.

You're right about the crap shoot with buying a unit off ebay. Every unit I've purchased has some sort of issue that required repair. Thus far, I've been lucky that the issues were serviceable and parts were not unobtainium...

What uses do you find for the omnipressor? Finding sound examples online is pretty much impossible.
Old 18th October 2013
  #37
Gear Addict
 
brethes's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
The best analog hardware flanger is possibly the Roland SBF-325. It is also true stereo.
Old 19th October 2013 | Show parent
  #38
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scriabin ➑️
Very insightful post...I appreciate it! I'm waiting to receive the H949 and FL120 back from Beamish. It's always interesting to pick his brain when he's digging through the units. Both units show a remarkable amount of ingenuity in the designs. Interestingly, it seems like a regular occurence with small oversights made by the builders such as reversed DBX cards or loose solder joints that appear to have left the factory in that way.

You're right about the crap shoot with buying a unit off ebay. Every unit I've purchased has some sort of issue that required repair. Thus far, I've been lucky that the issues were serviceable and parts were not unobtainium...
What uses do you find for the omnipressor? Finding sound examples online is pretty much impossible.
I would say when I've had the Pleasure to use an Omnipressor Hardware, (Sadly never 2) that on vocals it was quite simply a lovely device, a Sub Group/Buss-Compressor as well for BV's and Guitars etc, the reverse function was always a favourite, and a Wow factor... and in some Studios I've seen them unloved, though... used or sitting and awaiting for use with "Specialist Tasks" while looking unloved in a Studio corner. It seems others prefer an 1176, Distressor, 1178 or Focusrite Red, etc. These E-tide Plug In Versions now made, don't hold a candle to the Whoomph and Impact the Hardware has IMHO.

Once you hook up your 949 into the FL120 I think your going to Grin like an Idiot as you realise "IT"S THAT SOUND"..... etc. To me that is a very satisfying reason to buy the hardware, you seem to understand that while it can be a gamble buying 2nd hand unloved Eventide 30 Plus year old gear, that your willing to go the extra mile....keeping it serviced and running for another 10-15 years! Props to you Man! I can only say the reason I keep a stack of Vintage FX and Hardware is quite simply that often turning the knob, or Fader (And the wrong one at that) can bring amazing and unheard of results you simply would not bother with if using a Plug In and it's GUI. If you enjoy "F*cking with the Fabric of Time......Eventide is that Heaven your seeking! Google Omnipressor and you will find the sales brochure, a very funny portrayal of what the unit can do! (Oh... and @Brethes - The Roland Flangers were mentioned 4 posts or so ago!) Scriabin also...remember to use the CV Gates from the Flanger to the 949/910 that makes stuff go wild w/ a CV Drum Machine etc or Synth!

You'll sure Enjoy
F*cking with the Fabric of time (As Tony told Bowie!)
Cheers
TLB
Old 20th October 2013
  #39
Gear Head
 
Scriabin's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'm glad to hear you've found them so versatile. I'll definitely need to pick one up to supplement my distressor.

Good tip on the CV gate too...combined with my now stereo pair of H949s it sounds like I'm about to travel back in time to Hansa in 77' ...
Old 21st October 2013 | Show parent
  #40
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scriabin ➑️
I'm glad to hear you've found them so versatile. I'll definitely need to pick one up to supplement my distressor.

Good tip on the CV gate too...combined with my now stereo pair of H949s it sounds like I'm about to travel back in time to Hansa in 77' ...
Two? 949 Harmonizers & a Flanger, are they both the same software and w/DBX Cards for keeping the Harmony? Man those units are serious head spinners, and make seriously amazing Poker machine or Slot machine Sounds, I'd be going so way, way, way, way...........past simple 3rd's or a fifth with these units, driving them into Octave regeneration simply makes them sound Amazing! (Though Keep a Compressor on them, a DBX 120 XT is perfect etc!) Don't Sell these man, no matter what! These are Life Pieces of Gear now!
Cheers
TLB
Old 21st October 2013
  #41
Gear Head
 
Scriabin's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Both H949s are similiar in timeline and have the latest DBX comp/expander boards. Interestingly, unlike other DBX boards, there is a difference between the comp and the 2 output expander boards. The unit shown in the above photo had those boards installed in the wrong locations which threw the calibration way off.

The FL 120 LED suffered from a loose connection that was repaired. The current fed through the LED applied the envelope follower content to the sweep control voltage. Evidently, this LED has been bad a long time, compromising the unit. It kinda worked with just LFO sweep but the coolest effects were not attainable.

Everything should be working now

I have no idea what octave regeneration sounds like but I'll PM you a link to a few examples of what I come up with after I dig in for ****s and giggles

Thanks again!
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