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A different tone for BV that Lead vocals!
Old 22nd May 2006
  #1
Gear Maniac
 
jazztone's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Using LA-610 for lead vocals and want different sound for BAX

I am using a nuemann 87 and a UA LA-610 for leads on a female vocalist with a Alto voice. She has a smokey edge to her soft pallet part of her tone. The combo is working good for leads. I find that stacking with this combo takes too much sonic room. I want to use another set up for backgrounds. I also own a Se h3500, marshall
V69 ME. I was thinking a solid state pre would be a good compliment. Unfortunately I don't think the fireface pres are up to the task. What would be a good compliment(PRE) to what I'm using on leads. Or should I get rid of the LA-610 and get a summit half rack for compression and maybe a discreet pre and a second with transformer for color. Would the second idea yeild better results or should I build from the current set up?


Also I think at mix time better monitors than my Alesis M1 active could help my in the box mixxes which are well balanced but slightly lacking in low end thump. I also find vocal placement difficult on my monitors. Any suggestions?
Old 22nd May 2006
  #2
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Just back away from the mic on BV's ....
Old 23rd May 2006 | Show parent
  #3
Gear Maniac
 
jazztone's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwiburger
Just back away from the mic on BV's ....

what about picking up too much room when compressing the backs. I already record out about atleast a foot. Also i find when the leads and bax have different colors they mixx more easily.
Old 23rd May 2006 | Show parent
  #4
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Plenty of ways to push BV's into the background ...

Lowered level
eq rolloff
compression/saturation (emulate analog tape bounces perhaps?)
small track delay - if BV's are close mic'd, emulate the natural time delay of moving further away from the mic
More reverb - in particular, mono or narrow reverb
Old 23rd May 2006
  #5
Kush Audio
 
u b k's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
all the other points here are spot on, especially the one about backing off the mic more; just an extra 10 or 12 inches does a lot. but all of that's only helpful in terms of getting the backing vox to sit behind the main vox.

ime the biggest factor in how well they blend is whether the parts were sung in a timbre that blends. one of the problems with singers who do their own backing tracks is that they'll often sing every part in a lead voice. there's a way to shape your sound so that your voice becomes, as a matter of course, a support to the primary vocal.

usually that involves being more resonant and head, less focused and chest. softening/slurring esses, plosives, and hard consonants can be helpful too, it masks timing inconsistencies. nail the vowels, match every long and every short and every elide. the more you got all that dialed, the more these things mix themselves.


gregoire
del ubik
Old 23rd May 2006 | Show parent
  #6
Gear Maniac
 
jazztone's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
So are you saying I should cut leads from a foot and BX from two feet. Also the vocalist is excellent at stacking bax no problems there. In fact they are sometimes too perfect. We use alot of the techniqes you mentioned UBIK and many others including changing style and position for stacks. Two bax at the mic, two singing to the ground and two sung in the room away from the mic etc. I just know that using a different chain on lead and Bax is not an uncommon production technique in R&B
(not the trying to sound like hip hop stuff). Many albums( India Arie,Destiny's child) have used the technique and it seems to make the vocals mix themselves more easily as there timbre will have different colors but the FX treatment can place them in the same space. I have done it before in top end studios using Avalon tube on leads with solid state avalon on Bax. Also using different mics. I just don't know what to pair with my La-610. In modern R&B these days the Bax in Chorus are sometimes loud as the lead or louder but spread stereo and dryer with the lead.But maybe you guys just don't agree with this. I also feel it would give me more choices when picking a sound for vocals for songs in different keys and genres. Any feedback is appreciated.



Quote:
Originally Posted by u b i k
all the other points here are spot on, especially the one about backing off the mic more; just an extra 10 or 12 inches does a lot. but all of that's only helpful in terms of getting the backing vox to sit behind the main vox.

ime the biggest factor in how well they blend is whether the parts were sung in a timbre that blends. one of the problems with singers who do their own backing tracks is that they'll often sing every part in a lead voice. there's a way to shape your sound so that your voice becomes, as a matter of course, a support to the primary vocal.

usually that involves being more resonant and head, less focused and chest. softening/slurring esses, plosives, and hard consonants can be helpful too, it masks timing inconsistencies. nail the vowels, match every long and every short and every elide. the more you got all that dialed, the more these things mix themselves.


gregoire
del ubik
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