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Old 13th August 2022 | Show parent
  #5671
DAH
Lives for gear
 
DAH's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by spnc ➡️
Triggered haha sorry that I humiliated you in front of everyone kikey
Never knew I was one. Or did you mean "in front of everyone (who is) kikey"?
In any case, exposes you as a miserable creature, trigger-happy to "humiliate". Won't report, let it expose who the loser is.
You are obviously overcompensating your self-hatred for your, not mine, lack of ability to make a complete setup out of devices you own. Need the link to the thread?
Having a car, obviously "upgraded everything at once when you can", and still not knowing how to drive. No, boy, you don't upgrade at once, you upgrade once you exactly know what exactly is missing in a device that holds you back from achieving your goals.
BTW, hahas and lols in every second post are telling. Ask your psychoanalyst.

Exposed enough, or what? Not enough focus to read the devices` user manuals about SMPTE, MIDI Time Clock ?

Last edited by DAH; 15th August 2022 at 02:09 AM..
Old 14th August 2022 | Show parent
  #5672
Gear Maniac
Comparison video review of the following 7 headphones for studio usage from Warren Huart (Produce Like a Pro):

1. Audio Technica ATH-m40x
2. Sony MDR-7506
3. Sennheiser HD 280 Pro
4. Shure SRH1440
5. Neumann NDH 20
6. ADAM Audio SP-5
7. Austrian Audio HI-X60

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbpD52BiUIw
Old 15th August 2022
  #5673
Lives for gear
 
hbphotoav's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
IMO... Headphones, like mics and loudspeakers, are tools. Pretty much all of the brands and models under discussion "work" in a broad sense. I know what I need to hear in a live choral recording or a live-tracked jazz band, and I choose the pair (I've accumulated 5 or 6 different cans and a couple of sets of IEMs through the years) that works best for the job at hand. The 7506s have gotten the lion's share, mainly "live" audio-for-video off the camera, and because I've been using them since the late '90s, but the UltraSones, Shures, AKGs and Westone UM20 Pro buds all have their place. Auditioning with high rez files was highly recommended to me... and well worth the effort... I spent about 90 minutes on five options the first time out, and the older (literally "held together with wire and gaff tape) 7506 are still imparting valid info. One old guy's opinion, of course.
Old 15th August 2022
  #5674
Here for the gear
 
I picked up a pair of hifiman HE5650s in a pawnshop years ago, been working with them ever since and had no complaints. The stereo image & clairty is very nice, not much in the way of bass reproduction but I use my monitors for that anyway.

My daily use pair is Sennheiser HD 6 Mix's, they're not "flat" by any means but I get a very good sense from them of whether the mix will translate for other people. Extremely comfortable and the sound quality is very good imo, especially with the alternate cups.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5675
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somn ➡️
I know this question must be beaten to death by now but I have to ask as I am on the lookout to upgrade. I will be running this with Sonarworks correction unless I find it to be detrimental.

Sennheiser 600 or 650 - which ones should I get? This is for mixdown work in mainly techno, deep house, uk garage and such. Where transients, clarity and ability to hear detailed texture is important. I see the 650's recommended all the time and the 600's much less so, but it's hard to find the differences and what would fit my use case best.

My current cans are DT770's.
I'm in the exact same situation.

HD600 is pretty popular after I read the user reviews, but the HD650 have more bass, which is important in EDM, so maybe it would be a better choice.
Also thinking about Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro too, reviews are ok.
Unfortunately I can't try them in local shops.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5676
iFi audio
 
iFi audio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreizajev ➡️
I'm in the exact same situation.

HD600 is pretty popular after I read the user reviews, but the HD650 have more bass, which is important in EDM, so maybe it would be a better choice.
Also thinking about Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro too, reviews are ok.
Unfortunately I can't try them in local shops.
Just remain aware not to undercompensate with headphones being bassy, though if it's used as a reference between different listening endpoints, that usually helps me get an accurate picture of where the bass is at. The DT770's are reliable and industry standard in my experience. Are you looking at the Sennheiser 600/650 open or closed backs? Generally, opens will lose more bass, but offer more clarity in the width/stereo placement of the mix versus the closed. I've had my eyes on the 990 pros as well. It's always worth going to a tradeshow or finding a buddy who can lend you a pair to try before you buy!
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5677
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFi audio ➡️
Just remain aware not to undercompensate with headphones being bassy, though if it's used as a reference between different listening endpoints, that usually helps me get an accurate picture of where the bass is at. The DT770's are reliable and industry standard in my experience. Are you looking at the Sennheiser 600/650 open or closed backs? Generally, opens will lose more bass, but offer more clarity in the width/stereo placement of the mix versus the closed. I've had my eyes on the 990 pros as well. It's always worth going to a tradeshow or finding a buddy who can lend you a pair to try before you buy!
HD600 open. I would use them to check the levels and clarity.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5678
iFi audio
 
iFi audio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreizajev ➡️
HD600 open. I would use them to check the levels and clarity.
Sounds like a perfect use/strategy with those. I've used those to some success composing or mixing on the road when I need a mobile setup from Logic-> DAC/Amp-> HD600s. Can be a lifesaver when away from your setup, but at that point any cans you know well and get used to the sound signature of will be the most useful tool in the shed remotely.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5679
Gear Maniac
 
tonejunkee's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by goom ➡️
I'm going to try the HD-6XX after owning the 58X (too warm and foggy, although fun) and the 600 (too lifeless and sterile).
The HD-6XX is blowing my mind after over 2 decades of closed-backs. (M40x/MDR-7506/Oppo PM3). After seeing the top ratings from Sonarworks, Amir (Audio Science Review) and then Crinacle (using them as the graph benchmark) I took the plunge.

For tracking, I've been trying neutral IEMs and the Moondrop Chu are quite good. They are impedance-matched with my interface (32 ohm)

,,
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5680
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Neumann NDH 30 Headphones

I collect high-end headphones. I have fifteen pairs. Until now my favorite headphones for mixing were my three Focal headphones. However, after purchasing a pair of NDH30's I find that they are superior, and not by just a little. They stand alone.

Mixing headphones should be neutral. They do not add or subtract or emphasize. They simply tell it like it is. That is exactly what mixing headphones should do.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5681
Lives for gear
 
dotl's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by teashea ➡️
I collect high-end headphones. I have fifteen pairs. Until now my favorite headphones for mixing were my three Focal headphones. However, after purchasing a pair of NDH30's I find that they are superior, and not by just a little. They stand alone.

Mixing headphones should be neutral. They do not add or subtract or emphasize. They simply tell it like it is. That is exactly what mixing headphones should do.
I have the closed back 20s! Have you tried these? And if yes, how’d you compare those two?
Im considering buying the 30s because they are open backs but I don’t know if thatd make sense if I already have the 20s
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5682
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
20 v 30

Quote:
Originally Posted by dotl ➡️
I have the closed back 20s! Have you tried these? And if yes, how’d you compare those two?
Im considering buying the 30s because they are open backs but I don’t know if thatd make sense if I already have the 20s
I own a pair of 20's also. The twenties are wonderful and I use them for tracking in my home studio. However, closed back headphones have limitations compared to open back headphones. The 20's are good for mixing but the 30's are a big step above for mixing and mastering. When I purchased my 30's I was expecting them to be a little better. When I first put them on and listened, I was shocked by how good they are. Yes, you can justify having both.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #5683
Lives for gear
 
dotl's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
@ teashea
Thnx 👍
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5684
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somn ➡️
I know this question must be beaten to death by now but I have to ask as I am on the lookout to upgrade. I will be running this with Sonarworks correction unless I find it to be detrimental.

Sennheiser 600 or 650 - which ones should I get? This is for mixdown work in mainly techno, deep house, uk garage and such. Where transients, clarity and ability to hear detailed texture is important. I see the 650's recommended all the time and the 600's much less so, but it's hard to find the differences and what would fit my use case best.

My current cans are DT770's.
Bought the HD600. Without EQ the sub region is not really present, but man those mids....
I installed a systemwide EQ and use the oratory EQ preset which brings the bass back into the game, far enough to know whats going on. Also I have Sonarworks in my DAW.

Thinking about to sell my DT770 and change it to ath-M50x, which would cover the sub region.

the HD600 - ath M50x combo paired with my monitors would be far enough for a hobby producer like me (maybe the dt770 is enough too).
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5685
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreizajev ➡️
Bought the HD600. Without EQ the sub region is not really present, but man those mids....
I installed a systemwide EQ and use the oratory EQ preset which brings the bass back into the game, far enough to know whats going on. Also I have Sonarworks in my DAW.

Thinking about to sell my DT770 and change it to ath-M50x, which would cover the sub region.

the HD600 - ath M50x combo paired with my monitors would be far enough for a hobby producer like me (maybe the dt770 is enough too).
Owning both the DT770 and ATH-M50X, I much prefer the DT770's for mixing work.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5686
Lives for gear
 
gurubuzz's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Behringer HPS 3000

$20....

Read my review...

The problem is that nobody is going to doubt headphones with the Neumann Badge. Throughout history people will always attach price to quality and brand names...
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5687
iFi audio
 
iFi audio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somn ➡️
Owning both the DT770 and ATH-M50X, I much prefer the DT770's for mixing work.
Can you expound upon what made the difference in each for mixing work in your experience?
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5688
Gear Maniac
Mixing / Studio usage focused comparison video of 3 "professional" headphones: The new
1. Neumann NDH 30 vs
2. Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro vs
3. Shure SRH1840


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWYKntAk74U
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5689
Lives for gear
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFi audio ➡️
Can you expound upon what made the difference in each for mixing work in your experience?
I can't speak to the 770s, but the 50s (and I suspect all in that series, i.e the 20s, 30s, etc) have a hyped low end, and therefore IMO not really even studio headphones. Good headphones overall, but not neutral.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5690
iFi audio
 
iFi audio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill5 ➡️
I can't speak to the 770s, but the 50s (and I suspect all in that series, i.e the 20s, 30s, etc) have a hyped low end, and therefore IMO not really even studio headphones. Good headphones overall, but not neutral.
Yes. Flat frequency response is definitely the bar to set when in studio setting. I've heard people say the 770s/ Beyers in general have a more V shaped FR. I suppose the ATH's had more of a V curve to your ears, but both are neck and neck in my experience with honest, accessible studio headphones, so it's interesting to hear the varieties of experience in these threads. I'll have to snag some 770s and A/B when I'm mixing tracks.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5691
Lives for gear
No correction/crossfeed LCDX

Anybody else tried to use headphone correction/crossfeed etc and ended up ditching it entirely? I am on Audeze LCDX 2021 and have been around the houses trying a whole bunch of "correction" softwares and a million settings and none of them give me the translation I get using them raw!

I found this out by accident thinking I had RealPhones engaged when in fact I had forgotten. I did this a few times lol. The mixes translate better without ANY correction.

I was convinced that a target curve was the way. Like B&K or Oratory etc. But no! My mixes are better without.

So raw LCDX work for me in getting translation how about you?
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5692
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I don't find that Oratory 1990 eq gets anywhere near the flat response of my Kii3's. His eq target is warmer. Nice to listen to but nothing that I find helpful for translation.

Sonorworks methodology is to attempt matching flat studio speakers in a well treated room and their HD600 curve does indeed come closer to the Kii's (which klippel data shows them to be very flat).

That said, I've been slowly working towards my own eq that results in good mix translation. Much less fussing about with lots of mid range points. Sort of wider, gentle eq that demonstrations actual results.

Maddening a bit. Easy to get disoriented.

Hifiman He1000v2's and Audeze MM500's are on my desk these days.
Working on my own eq compensation for both.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5693
Gear Nut
 
Have you compared to Audeze’s correction plug-in compared to Realphones? I was very impressed with Realphones at first, but ended up leaning back towards Sonarworks without any crossfeed, then check mixes with Realphones. I’m on HD600s though.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5694
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Freeland ➡️
Anybody else tried to use headphone correction/crossfeed etc and ended up ditching it entirely? I am on Audeze LCDX 2021 and have been around the houses trying a whole bunch of "correction" softwares and a million settings and none of them give me the translation I get using them raw!

I found this out by accident thinking I had RealPhones engaged when in fact I had forgotten. I did this a few times lol. The mixes translate better without ANY correction.

I was convinced that a target curve was the way. Like B&K or Oratory etc. But no! My mixes are better without.

So raw LCDX work for me in getting translation how about you?
As far as crossfeed, I find Goodhertz-Canopener to be the best/most natural sounding so I highly suggest you to try it.

https://goodhertz.com/canopener-studio/
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5695
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozonepaul ➡️
As far as crossfeed, I find Goodhertz-Canopener to be the best/most natural sounding so I highly suggest you to try it.

https://goodhertz.com/canopener-studio/
Yes I did try Canopener. Do you think is is vastly different to Realphones crossfeed? Do you think Crossfeed helps translation?
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5696
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
The Airwindows Monitoring pIug has 3 different variations of crossfeed onIy. Pretty cooI.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5697
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Freeland ➡️
Yes I did try Canopener. Do you think is is vastly different to Realphones crossfeed? Do you think Crossfeed helps translation?
I don't know Realphones crossfeed function well enough to give you a proper comparison.

I work on Neumann Kh310s as my main speakers + a pair of Avantone MixCube to have an extreme mid focused "magnifying glass" + Sonarworks 60-70% wet corrected Sennheiser HD800 headphones with Canopener. To finetune canopener to my HD800 cans, I tweaked the "official" goodhertz suggested "studio setting" a bit (eg I lowered the amount setting a bit to 80-85).
See the goodhertz suggested "studio settings" here:
https://goodhertz.com/canopener-stud...?sg=1&d=1&hq=1

I find that using sonarworks and canopener together on these modest, non too extreme settings gives me the closest sound to my KH310s, which I like and I'm very familiar with. As the HD800 is the widest, most spacious headphone I've ever heard (has got the biggest soundstage out of any cans), I'm pretty sure I would use different canopener crossfeed settings if I used some other cans with smaller soundstage.
But the HD800 doesn't need any extreme treatment, with the above suggested headphone correction I get a sound that's very close to my KH310 system's sound but with bass that effortlessly goes down deeper (to 20-25Hz), and gives me even more "micro detail" (think stuff like recording mistakes and noises like piano bench squeaks, very soft accidental mic stand kicks etc are easier to find... extreme small setting changes on compressors, reverbs are even more obvious than on my monitors). So in my case, it's not like crossfeed in itself helps me with translation. Rather with crossfeed on my HD800s I get a sound that I'm very comfortable to work with, so it helps me work more easily/efficiently. Ergo I get better translating results faster. So I don't think crossfeed is really necessary but it happens to help my workflow, so I use it. In short: it just gives me a sound on my headphones that I'm more familiar/comfortable with.

I hope what I'm saying makes some sense and I managed to help you,

Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5698
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozonepaul ➡️
I don't know Realphones crossfeed function well enough to give you a proper comparison.

I work on Neumann Kh310s as my main speakers + a pair of Avantone MixCube to have an extreme mid focused "magnifying glass" + Sonarworks 60-70% wet corrected Sennheiser HD800 headphones with Canopener. To suit my cans I tweaked this goodhertz suggested "studio setting" a bit (eg I lowered the amount setting a bit to 80-85):

https://goodhertz.com/canopener-stud...?sg=1&d=1&hq=1

I find that using sonarworks and canopener together on these modest, non too extreme settings gives me the closest sound to my KH310s which I like and I'm very familiar with. As the HD800 is the widest, most spacious headphone I've ever heard (has got the biggest soundstage out of any cans), I'm pretty sure I would use different canopener crossfeed settings if I used some other cans with smaller soundstage.
But the HD800 doesn't need any extreme treatment, with the above suggested headphone correction I get a sound that's very close to my KH310 system's sound but with bass that effortlessly goes down deeper (to 20-25Hz), and gives me even more "micro detail" (think stuff like recording mistakes and noises like piano bench squeaks, very soft accidental mic stand kicks etc are easier to find... extreme small setting changes on compressors, reverbs are even more obvious than on my monitors). So for me, it's not like crossfeed itself is that I think helps me with translation but rather with crossfeed on my HD800s I get a sound that I'm very comfortable to work with, so it helps me make work more easily/efficiently ergo I get better translating results faster. I don't think crossfeed is necessary but it happens to help my workflow.

I hope I managed to help,

Great. So forget everything we know about correction and crossfeed. Try doing a mix from scratch with nothing but your RAW HD800s. How does the mix translate, not to your mains but on everything else?
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5699
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Freeland ➡️
Great. So forget everything we know about correction and crossfeed. Try doing a mix from scratch with nothing but your RAW HD800s. How does the mix translate, not to your mains but on everything else?
My HD800 with it's original tuning is pretty weak in the bass department (weak as far as bass amount, not as far as bass clarity/definition). Also, it has got a noticeable peak at the 6kHz region and it gives me way more detail than what's "natural". When I say natural, I mean something like how much detail you would normally hear in an acoustically great concert hall if you were to sit at the very best seat. Now the HD800 gives you 2x as much detail
So to answer your question: without any correction on my HD800, my first few mixes would sound "overcorrected", tamed, would have too much sub/ low bass, and too little energy at around 6kHz... BUT this is only because the sound I learnt, (the "base line sound" that's in my head and my brain labels as "correct") is the one I mostly imprinted on my brain while working (and referencing other mixes) on my KH310s.
If you forced me to mix 20 songs on my HD800 without any correction, relying on nothing other than it's out of the box sound, I'm pretty sure I could learn it's weaknesses/shortcomings and I could learn how to compensate them. As far as it's spatial qualities the HD800 is phenomenal, so I think my brain could faster learn to compensate for the lack of "crossfeed" than for the lack of bass below 40Hz and it's unnatural amount of detail. But I think after a while I could learn to make decent mixes on them without any correction.

Makes sense?
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #5700
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozonepaul ➡️
My HD800 with it's original tuning is pretty weak in the bass department, it has got a noticable peak at the 6kHz region and it gives me way more detail than what's natural. When I say natural, think something like how much detail you would normally hear in a concert situation if you were to sit at the very best seat. Now the HD800 gives you 3x as much detail
So to answer your question: without any correction I would mix something that's "overcorrected", that's tamed, that will have too much bass, will have too little at around 6kHz... BUT this is only because the sound I learnt, the "base line sound" that's in my head is the one I learnt working on my KH310s. If I mixed 100 songs on my HD800 without any correction, I'm pretty sure I could learn it's weaknesses/shortcomings and I could learn how to compensate them.

Makes sense?
Yes I understand and have been through all that. I know you think that the tuning will not translate with just raw HD800s but just for kicks try it! (if you didn't already) You may be right. I thought that too but now I am not so sure. My LCDX are not at all linear, I thought correction cross-feed would help but no the best translation comes without it. There is a little too much high and the bass is light in the cans BUT the mixes come out great. I have just spent the best part of a year messing with correction/crossfeed etc. Weird! I was soooo convinced I needed it. Maybe not.
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