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Monitors or....
Old 2nd June 2003
  #1
Gear Maniac
 
Heterodox's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Monitors or....

I'm kind of getting uncertain about a soon-to-be-made purchase. I've been planning for quite some time to get a Dynaudio monitoring setup consisting of

2 BM6As
1 BX-30

$3300 list.

For some reason I've had one of those "This is the one for me" feelings for awhile. However - the more I notice the < $700 price tag on the HR824s I get queasy. With the money saved I could get countless other fun things (or maybe a Distressor?).

The whole setup is for a hip-hop/r&b/rap/singer songwriter studio, and I'm not quite sure I'll be needing the ultimate fidelity provided by the Dynaudios...though the Mackie's may not provide the THUMP needed to monitor rap/hip-hop. Thoughts?

Even with the Dynaudios I can afford the rest of the gear so far on the list, which consists of:

Grace and/or Great River and/or Millennia pres
Studio Projects C1/T3 mic (along with assorted others)
MOTU HD192
FMR RNC

I'd like a spanking good compressor though - and I'm not sure the FMR RNC will cut it. Plus its unbalanced and only easily configurable with the Great River pres...which I'm not sure I'll be getting. A 1176 or Distressor seems like it could possibly offset the difference in monitoring quality with tracking quality. Of course that's assuming the HR824s are really that much WORSE than the Dynaudios?

Help. =[
Old 2nd June 2003
  #2
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
I would dump the BM6s with the sub and go after some BM15's or BM15A's.

The BM6's are too small for hiphop. Trust me they won't last.heh

The BM15A's are a fun speaker that puts out hot levels and still retains some clarity.

If you want cheaper maybe the Mackie's and some old Tannoy's(12" or 15"). It will probably be around the same as the BM15A's and you have two monitors to reference with. You just provide the amp for the Tannoy's.


Old 2nd June 2003
  #3
Lives for gear
 
Saucyjack's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Hmmmm,
sounds like we have similar gear....
I've had the Mackies about a year and am generally pleased with them they did take me some time to learn...particularly the Low end.
Don't worry they have plenty of low end thump,probably will be louder and bassier than the BM6s...(which is there main problem AFaIK).

I've researched the Dynaudios several times and although I have never heard that they are probably a step up from the Mackies.
My reasoning has been that the Mackies are good enough for me presently and I threw my money on Mics and Outboard gear.

I think the Mackies can work well and translate once you learn them.For the money(1000/pair) I don't think they can be beat in that price range.

Still would love to hear the Bm6s or Adams though......
Old 2nd June 2003
  #4
Gear Maniac
 
Heterodox's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
The more words spoken the more I want to cave and save $2500 on Mackies. BUT...

Thrill, you seriously don't think BM6s augmented with a sub would be able to handle hip-hop at normal mixing levels? I'd have to assume that was some moderate hyperbole on your part. All of the low frequency energy would be taken care of and the BM6s would be able to shine at what they do best (high end)...unless I'm missing something.

And I'm sure the 824s would alone blow the BM6s out of the water on low end and sheer volume, but the bass reflex BX-30 sub would crank out cleaner, louder, and *PUNCHIER* bass than the ported/foamed woofers on the Macks. I've heard alot of negative feedback on how the ported setups can smear punchy bass as an expense of volume. One thing is for certain, I could never never NEVER mix my bass right on the Alesis M1MKII mons until I added a Tannoy PS 110-b sub. I NEED to feel the bass when I mix or I just never think its right. Usually when forcing myself to accept a lack of booming bass on small monitors I end up not mixing enough in at all.

Hmph. I'm about 5 minutes away from calling GC and going to pick these up. Even though I don't have my MOTU yet I could use the RCA ins while testing the sound. Hell I guess I could buy another PS 110-b down the road if the bass isn't quite right. Makes me wish I never sold it. =[

Thanks for comments, suggestions. Keep em coming!

Ideas for other gear to buy, given the $2000+ in savings?
Old 2nd June 2003
  #5
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Heterodox
The more words spoken the more I want to cave and save $2500 on Mackies. BUT...

Thrill, you seriously don't think BM6s augmented with a sub would be able to handle hip-hop at normal mixing levels? I'd have to assume that was some moderate hyperbole on your part. All of the low frequency energy would be taken care of and the BM6s would be able to shine at what they do best (high end)...unless I'm missing something.

And I'm sure the 824s would alone blow the BM6s out of the water on low end and sheer volume, but the bass reflex BX-30 sub would crank out cleaner, louder, and *PUNCHIER* bass than the ported/foamed woofers on the Macks. I've heard alot of negative feedback on how the ported setups can smear punchy bass as an expense of volume. One thing is for certain, I could never never NEVER mix my bass right on the Alesis M1MKII mons until I added a Tannoy PS 110-b sub. I NEED to feel the bass when I mix or I just never think its right. Usually when forcing myself to accept a lack of booming bass on small monitors I end up not mixing enough in at all.

Hmph. I'm about 5 minutes away from calling GC and going to pick these up. Even though I don't have my MOTU yet I could use the RCA ins while testing the sound. Hell I guess I could buy another PS 110-b down the road if the bass isn't quite right. Makes me wish I never sold it. =[

Thanks for comments, suggestions. Keep em coming!

Ideas for other gear to buy, given the $2000+ in savings?
The BM6a is a much better monitor than the Mackie.

Still I know they get destroyed by HipHop/Rap producers(my friend is a Dyna dealer and calls me everytime he gets that "I payed this much for a piece of sh*t that can't handle bass?"call.)

Implementing a sub in a monitoring setup is an exact science(trust me on this one). To my ears many people just can't get it right. I prefer an all in one approach, a full range speaker designed to interact in close areas.

I know the BM15's can take the punishment. The BM15's are the most popular selling monitors here in NYC to the hiphop community(most of the guys that buy them are former Mackie users who want a bigger sound).

When I was speakin about Tannoy, I was speaking in regards to a used DMT12 or DMT15". Something that can put out some bass.
Old 2nd June 2003
  #6
Lives for gear
 
sonic dogg's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
The old Tannoys are nice and monstrous on thebass...Maybe even an old set of Urie 813's...You'd have to spring for a killer amp for either of these but you'd still have some scratch left for your other itch............You cannot destroy either of these two...
Old 3rd June 2003
  #7
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
What about the Blue Sky 2.1 system? I haven't heard it myself but most of the reviews I've read have been pretty favorable.
Old 3rd June 2003
  #8
Lives for gear
 
dave-G's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
As an aside, frankly, I'm a bit amazed at how many people like the Mackies... Then again, there are lots of people that like Jagermeister and I don't get that either..

I think Thrill's advice is good, and well-founded, but it all really depends on who's using them ... If it's just you, and you just want a good reference to work with at reasonable mixing SPLs, and if you seldom need to try to make your nearfields shake the paint off the walls and impress some hearing-impaired A&R types at 130dBSPL (hell, that's what mains are for) then your options are wide open.

To me, fidelity is the first priority of monitoring, and monitoring is among the first priorities in terms of essential gear (to me) period. "Spanking good" compressors are good to have too, but IMO, knowing what you're doing with what you're working with is greatly assisted by having good reference monitors. For me, working without them is like driving a really nice BMW with a frosted windshield (or with my contacts out, and my -9 eyes in full-effect).

On the other hand, if you need something to crank and entertain your clients at high SPLs, maybe a pair of old UREIs, JBLs or Tannoys could be found on ebay to fit that role, while your smaller monitors actually help you get the work done. And if you're one of those who actually mix at very high SPLs, then I agree, you'll probably be disappointed with the BM6's

Overall, I'd suggest you try a few mixes on whatever you think you'd like to get, and see if they help you make mixes that work as well as you'd like them to in the world outside your studio. Try the BM15s, try the BM6As with sub, etc, etc, but try to do some actual work with them in your actual studio and see where you get. Many dealers and many manufacturers will allow a demo period like this, and I highly recommend you take advantage of that opportunity.

Best of luck!
-dave
Old 3rd June 2003
  #9
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by JBlake
What about the Blue Sky 2.1 system? I haven't heard it myself but most of the reviews I've read have been pretty favorable.
If its for rap, you will toss them out the window.

They are very neutral almost dull. I was very dissapointed when i checked them out. I read all the hype and expected something magical and instead it was a "dud".

My 2 centavos.
Old 3rd June 2003
  #10
Gear Maniac
 
Heterodox's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'm leaning towards the BM15s based on your advice Thrill.

I was *extremely* happy with the thump provided by the Tannoy PS110B. Once I rigged a home theatre system with the sub and some 12" Mains to watch Requiem for a Dream...dear god the intense parts were blowing me out of my seat.

Considering that the tannoy was only a 10", 110 watt driver, I have to assume the Dynaudios (10", 200 watt) will wail - even if not specifically made for the purpose of subbing).

And the high SPLs isn't "required"...but I think everybody knows how helpful it can be for business to blast a mix for new clients - and of course to hear the mix from a different perspective.

Could you give me more insight into the "thump" of these Thrill (or anybody). I'd like to know how they will compare to an actual sub (of the smaller/cheaper variety).
Old 3rd June 2003
  #11
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
I have 5 BM6a's with a custom Yamaha sub for my surround mixing (very nicely calibrated thanks to the fine help of Bobby Owsinski.). Proac studio 100's, ns-10's with a bryston 4b-st for most of my stereo stuff. I dig the bm6a's for surround, very efficient little suckers. I did not dig the HR82 when auditioned. Bm6a’s with sub? It would depend on the size of your room and how much you want to wow your client. You might want to consider the BM15a’s to deliver the non-fatiguing clear Urban Jungle.
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