The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
Working with PT Mix + on high track count sessions & avoiding "thinness"
Old 17th May 2003
  #1
Working with PT Mix + on high track count sessions & avoiding "thinness"

Recently during as session we had a great drum sound, then a great drum & bass sound, then a great drum bass & rhy gtr sound...

Then as the tracks built up, it was clear that the overall sound was deteriorating, gone somehow was our "kicking" drums, we knew they were 'on tape" (! OK on Pro Tools) but the Mix + mix buss had choked them and they were suffering.

Drums & guide bass & gtrs were all tracked with Prism Dream ADA converters. For overdubbing we switched to Using the Cranesong Hedd as we prefer it for guitars..We also were using the Hedd's D/A to monitor the out of the session.

For vibe I routed the drums to an Aux and put the Sony Dynamic compressor on em for some "rock squash" on em... fantastic...

Anyhow as I say, as the tracks built up things took a turn for the worse..

Now I am setting up for mixing..

I am using the Dangerous 2 Buss analog summing box fed via 16 Prism Dream ADA

As I was quite happy with the Sony compression I thought I had better a/b it with the SSL comp. I also had in mind for drum squash duties..

So...that's

Aux in PT with Sony - versus - Direct outs from PT into SSL comp

I duplicated the 10 drum tracks and sent each of the 2 versions to the two compressors to compare them..

They both had their character, and both were excellent (ok I was a tiny bit biased to the hardware SSL) but what was clear was that with both compressors in bypass, the drums that had made a trip via the Aux were worse sounding than the direct out drums. I dont know if the high track count session & the 'Nika's Law' (the old over 53 track chip sharing truncation thang) effected the Aux sound, but the direct outs sure sounded WAY better..

(note. I didn't think to create a "master fader' for the direct outs and pop the Sony on that...Doh! I wonder if THAT would have sounded better)

The moral of this story? Well to me it's that the clear degradation of internal mix sound with high track count sessions on the Mix + platform can be easily cheered up with external summing.

IMHO.

All kinda obvious to those following PT mythology on web forums, but never before have I experienced such an obvious example of the 'thinning' phenomenon..

heh

(PTHD is supposed to be better and not suffer this problem...)
Old 17th May 2003
  #2
Lives for gear
 
C.Lambrechts's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Re: Working with PT Mix + on high track count sessions & avoiding "thinness"

Quote:
Originally posted by Jules
(PTHD is supposed to be better and not suffer this problem...)
it is better because the number of instances before actual summing occurs has been increased ... )dunno the exact numbers by heart ) ... but it hasn't vanished. At some point with HUGE sessions you still hit that summing wall IMHO. That's why we recently installed the Dangerous 2 bus.

And fwiw not only for large track counts. I did a 14 track song the other day. The D2B gives me a better feeling. Dunno why ... guess I have changed my mind recently concerning the Mix bus in ProTools.
Old 17th May 2003
  #3
Lives for gear
 
dave-G's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Re: Re: Working with PT Mix + on high track count sessions & avoiding "thinness"

Quote:
Originally posted by C.Lambrechts
it is better because the number of instances before actual summing occurs has been increased
It's also significantly better because once you cross that threshold (68 tracks in HD) and need multiple chips to handle a large mix, it doesn't truncate each chip's submix to 24 bits prior to the final 48 bit sum (as Mix-rigs do). Instead, HD uses multiple TDM time-slots to pass each chip's submix to the final sum, maintaining their full 48-bit wordlength.

-dave
📝 Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 295 views: 71354
Avatar for anguswoodhead
anguswoodhead 26th March 2013
replies: 15929 views: 1525439
Avatar for Ragan
Ragan 11th January 2019
replies: 1296 views: 176778
Avatar for heraldo_jones
heraldo_jones 1st February 2016
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearspace Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…

Forum Jump
Forum Jump