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Will there be a Benchmark ADC1?
Old 11th April 2003
  #1
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Will there be a Benchmark ADC1?

There was talk about this sometime ago...

Thx
Imagine
Old 11th April 2003
  #2
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pounce's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
within a months time i'll be buying a new ad converter.
(anyone want a rosetta at a fair used price?)

that said, i -am- getting a dac1 as part of the new setup. an adc1 would be perfect.

i could even wait just a little on the purchase if i knew benchmark had something coming. i'd love it if they gave us a hint. or email me privately and i won't tell a soul.
please benchmark, take my money. that's a converter i'm sure i want.

pretty please.
Old 11th April 2003
  #3
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🎧 15 years
Well there's good news. I just received information that a ADC1 will be available in the near future. I hope they keep it around the same price as the DAC!!!!

Imagine
Old 11th April 2003
  #4
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🎧 15 years
C'mon guys, don't feed the rumor mill. We are doing some cool stuff based upon the requests of our customers. I mean we have some really cool stuff in the works, but I can't comment right now.heh

In the mean time, buy a DAC1!
Old 11th April 2003
  #5
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🎧 15 years
David,

How about an 8 channel ADC?

I absolutely love the DAC1.

Imagine
Old 11th April 2003
  #6
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We already have a super-cool eight channel ADC.
Attached Thumbnails
Will there be a Benchmark ADC1?-ad240896.jpg  
Old 11th April 2003
  #7
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atticus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Or you could get the 48 channel DAC
Attached Thumbnails
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Old 11th April 2003
  #8
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🎧 15 years
Dave,

Thanks for the info... Now I'm real excited!
Old 11th April 2003
  #9
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🎧 15 years
No problem. We're doing our best to build really great stuff.
Old 12th April 2003
  #10
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pounce's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
i am at least hoping that if a adc1 is on the way there is a hint of it in about three weeks when i either buy a lucid or buy this adc1 i was really hoping for. maybe you could schedule your product announcements around me

i have absolutely no self control around gear and all, so someone has to get my tax refund money darn it all.

i'll be waiting

oh, still got a apogee rosetta for sale. really.
Old 12th April 2003
  #11
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🎧 15 years
Pounce,

If it's any help, I have the Lucid AD9624, and if the ADC1 is anything like the DAC, I suggest you wait for its release.

Imagine
Old 12th April 2003
  #12
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Imagine
Pounce,

If it's any help, I have the Lucid AD9624, and if the ADC1 is anything like the DAC, I suggest you wait for its release.

Imagine
that's exactly what i'm thinking. come on benchmark, let's get pounce all set up with yer converters. the two side by side in a rack would be swell.

looking at my imaginary rack space....

adc1 - dac1

also a lucid genx96 or similar for the whole system. very tasty.
Old 12th April 2003
  #13
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🎧 15 years
I *will* have Benchmark DA that much I know.
Old 12th April 2003
  #14
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Sir Bob's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Why dump the Rosetta? Is my Rosetta really that bad?
Old 12th April 2003
  #15
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pounce's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
as far as i'm concerned we are now kind of splitting hairs.

i have a rosetta that i believe has served me very well.

i happen to like the apogee converters. there is a concensus that the benchmarks are a bit more open, and even a bigger improvement over the apogees comes with the prism or lavry converters. all of the above smoke the average converters in music store interfaces. so, now it's twice the price for each little bit of improvement. mostly seems to do with the openess of the top end and the wideness of the sound field. for me, absolute transparency would be a great thing to get from a converter. i think a person would be happy with any of the above. there are many applications where it might be impossible to tell the difference between them. i happen to have a small amount of budget ot upgrade my gear piece by piece to have higher quality, so i'm picking critical pieces one at a time. since i do almost everything digitally, any subtle converter improvements will effect all of my work.
Old 12th April 2003
  #16
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🎧 15 years
Would there be an a cost affective advantage in supplementing a Rosetta with a clocking device? I've heard that clocking/jitter issues are important.
Old 12th April 2003
  #17
Gear Guru
 
NathanEldred's Avatar
 
7 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
If you are talking about the 2 channel version, there is only clock output.
Old 12th April 2003
  #18
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🎧 15 years
yes, jitter is a critical issue in digital audio. many users report even better sounding audio (tighter low end, more open top) with a better clock like an aardsync, big ben, or genx96.

however, as nathan pointed out, the apogee must be the clock. apogee's have decent clocks to begin with. some other interfaces benefit from an external clock more than others. i undrestand things like motu or rme interfaces are greatly improved with a better external clock.
Old 13th April 2003
  #19
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atticus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Sir Bob
Would there be an a cost affective advantage in supplementing a Rosetta with a clocking device? I've heard that clocking/jitter issues are important.
Jitter reduction is an extremely important issue with regards to converters. Check out this link:

http://www.benchmarkmedia.com/appnotes-d/jittercu.asp

This explains a lot of the design philosophy behind our converters, both the ones that we have now and the ones we will have in the (perhaps not so distant) future. Thanks.
Old 13th April 2003
  #20
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Another thing to understand is that there are different "flavors" of jitter that can skew your judgement and that these different flavors can be created by various combinations of gear. Those of us who dealt with multiple analog generations dealt with the same thing and I find it useful to think of jitter as being exactly the same thing we called "wow and flutter."

The reason judgement becomes a problem is that nobody else will probably ever hear the flavor you like outside of your own studio. Adjustments you make that seem helpful in your control room can turn out being harmful to the final product.

Because jitter generates distortion in digital filters, low jitter monitoring becomes far more critical when using digital processing than it is when you are using analog processing.
Old 13th April 2003
  #21
SC
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Good points, Bob, but I dissagree with one thing:

You said, "I find it useful to think of jitter as being exactly the same thing we called "wow and flutter."

There's a problem with that analogy: with analog wow & flutter, every generation contributes to the detriment of the final product. With jitter, the only "flavors" (I like that term) that make it to the final product are the jitter embedded by the A-D's s-h circuit, and the read-jitter induced by the actual cd itself. OK, if you source to an external clock, then that also affect's the A-D's s-h circuit, so the analogy isn't too off.

However, all other flavors, such as from interconnects and such, will only affect what you hear in your monitors. Yes, I'm being a little picky, but I think it's important to make that distinction for people just learning about this somewhat complex issue.


"Adjustments you make that seem helpful in your control room can turn out being harmful to the final product."

-So true! It's something like running a one-off cassette, or a temp club-mix for a DJ. there's no way to compensate for the final playback chain. All you can do is create the most clean and neutral environment for yourself, and hope it translates.

Same as it ever was.
Old 14th April 2003
  #22
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by speerchucker
...with analog wow & flutter, every generation contributes to the detriment of the final product...
Obviously digital jitter is significantly different however the subjective effect while you are monitoring is identical. The fact that non-a to d jitter can be eliminated in the future does not mean its presence in monitoring can be casually dismissed because jitter can lead you into making choices that become detrimental to the final product. Even when you know better, your client will never accept being told "don't worry, it's just the monitors."

In my experience this is exactly where working with digital audio becomes significantly different than working with analog audio. The quality of the monitor chain becomes far more critical because what you hear frequently isn't what you get.

A LOT of that "cold, anemic, small digital sound" and "lack of depth" that people desperately want to "warm up" is caused by jitter in the monitoring chain.
Old 16th April 2003
  #23
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🎧 15 years
we all agree about the trouble with jitter, so now i want to get any opinion about this idea relating to the reduction of jitter and clock stability.

given a really decent converter, does a person still use an outboard clock in a smaller system? per this thread, i am definately replacing my apogee converter with a better one, and it's looking like it's going to be benchmark on the adc and dac sides. that said, i am currently using an apogee converter that acts as the master clock for the system. the wisdom at the time i set it up was that you could often get the best clocking via the converter itself so long as it had a good clock. that is as opposed to having to introduce an external clock.

most of my effects are run digitally i/o of my system getting their clock via aes/ebu signal. so the interface is distributing the clock as supplied via the converter. everything else is digital, so the system is straightforward enough to run this way. a bigger system might require a distributed clock. or a lower quality converter might benefit from the better clock, but for me?

i had at one point anticipated getting a lucid genx96, but would that offer any improvement over using the benchmark internal clock? anything i'm missing here? i suspect i dont 'really need the genx96, or that it might actually be worse than using the internal clock on the benchmark converter? any thoughts appreciated.
Old 17th April 2003
  #24
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I wouldn't invest in clocks until I was using a jitter-free D to A.

Here, a clock that used to improve things makes no apparent difference listening with the DAC-1.
Old 18th April 2003
  #25
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Steve Smith's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Bob Olhsson
Here, a clock that used to improve things makes no apparent difference listening with the DAC-1.
That is a powerful statement.
Old 21st April 2003
  #26
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atticus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
OK, I'm allowed to say it. There will be an ADC1 and it's not far off.
Old 21st April 2003
  #27
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pounce's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by atticus
OK, I'm allowed to say it. There will be an ADC1 and it's not far off.
ok, i'm allowed to say it. you'll probably have money of mine not far off

i'm buying the dac1 for sure, i'll probably get the damn adc1 too and call it good. i didnt' want to be the one to say i got the confirmation that the adc1 was really going to happen, but so long as it's truly kosher to have it out of the bag, giddyup. so will i get serial number 0001 ??
Old 21st April 2003
  #28
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🎧 15 years
Sorry I can't do serial number 001. But I will autograph it for you and tell you that you're number one
Old 21st April 2003
  #29
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by atticus
OK, I'm allowed to say it. There will be an ADC1 and it's not far off.
I'm really glad to hear this! If it's anything like the DAC1, this thread should instantly be moved to "The good news channel".

uosdwis
Old 21st April 2003
  #30
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atticus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
It's definitely good news! Please keep in mind that the ADC1 will cost more then the DAC1 due to increased parts costs. I can't totally spill the beans on it, but let me just say that it will offer far more cool stuff then anything else in the price range. I'll post the whole scoop in the new products section when I can.
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