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How the hell do you get Guitar Rig 3 to sound good?
Old 9th February 2009 | Show parent
  #31
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorg ➑️
i actually quiet like guitar rig, especially compared to other similar products out there.
I'm just wondering if a POD pro is better or worse.
I don't know about a Pod Pro but the Pod XT is complete garbage. Noisy and another weak amp sim.
Old 9th February 2009 | Show parent
  #32
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mdme_sadie's Avatar
The best way to look at the various amp sims out there is simply as another FX in the pipeline rather than an actual simulator. If you do that it's no different from a MultiFX or an EH HOG pedal, just another tone you can make use of for when e.g. you need to sound like a 1930's telephone, or want that pure 80's sawtooth synth tone.
Old 9th February 2009 | Show parent
  #33
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awakened's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcm ➑️
+1

+1+1

I really don't think I ever liked my guitar tones until I stopped going direct.
Old 9th February 2009 | Show parent
  #34
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awakened's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Zick ➑️
I don't know about a Pod Pro but the Pod XT is complete garbage. Noisy and another weak amp sim.
actually, IMO, the POD is the best sounding amp sim if you buy the POD XT Pro and run it SPDIF. It has SPDIF outs.
Old 9th February 2009 | Show parent
  #35
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awakened ➑️
actually, IMO, the POD is the best sounding amp sim if you buy the POD XT Pro and run it SPDIF. It has SPDIF outs.
Hmm...good to know.
Old 9th February 2009 | Show parent
  #36
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Empire Prod's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
It is a little wierd how some digital technology has gotten better, while others seem to sound a lot worse.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #37
Gear Nut
 
Halexx's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Sonya ➑️

Don't look to a synth plug-in company for authentic guitar sounds. If you think about it, it's an unrealistic expectation.

- c
If i follow you well, Yamaha could not make great guitar because they make great piano?
And what about drum, wind instrument, recording gear, etc?

You may not like GTR3, it's your taste, nice,but it ain't because they make soft synt, in my opinion.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #38
Gear Nut
 
Halexx's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by H-Rezz ➑️
It's funny to read some of the comments on here from, 'you have to get know it' or 'yes there are good sounds but you have to muck around with this or that ', all seemingly defeat the purpose of actually using a guitar sim in the first place , for quick and easy results ........

I don't know the reason why the OP is using GR3 but it seems to me that setting up an amp with an Sm57 in front of it is quicker and will get better results without the cheese grating.
It may be easy for you to put a mike in front of an amp and get a nice sound, but it seems miking amp is also an art in itself as i read a lot of thread with titles like :''Why don't i get a killer sound out of my expensive amp and complex mike setting?''

I believe that when looking for the perfect sound, all roads takes a lot of effort, and experience gratifying mistake.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #39
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
An article in the current Electronic Musician casts an interesting light on this topic.

Emulations were compared with real amps in a blind test. The real amps were neither identified nor preferred consistently.

Now certainly this will provoke the usual storm of criticism that the experiment was in some way flawed or meaningless. But evidence is mounting which supports the conclusion that analog sound can be effectively emulated in the digital domaine. It's good news. It makes everything easier, cheaper and less traumatic to the ears.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #40
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas3 ➑️
An article in the current Electronic Musician casts an interesting light on this topic.

Emulations were compared with real amps in a blind test. The real amps were neither identified nor preferred consistently.

Now certainly this will provoke the usual storm of criticism that the experiment was in some way flawed or meaningless. But evidence is mounting which supports the conclusion that analog sound can be effectively emulated in the digital domaine. It's good news. It makes everything easier, cheaper and less traumatic to the ears.
I see where you're coming from but GR3 out of the box is very traumatic to my ears. What makes you draw that conclusion?
Old 10th February 2009
  #41
Gear Nut
 
Halexx's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Just by curiosity Michael,

what guitar do you record with?

I have this 'theory' that like real amp, some matches with guitar just don't work.

For instance, i have an old 70's tube amp(Garnet) that just don't like the high output of the EMG's i have on a guitar.

Also, i read sometimes that amp sim nead a hi-z input in a soundcard/preamp.

I have noticed that like real amp, some simulations are really sensible to the input level you gave them.

Check the 'low/high quality' setting. It make a big difference on Amplitube.

Good luck!
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #42
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Zick ➑️
I see where you're coming from but GR3 out of the box is very traumatic to my ears. What makes you draw that conclusion?
Different sense of "traumatic". Emulation spares you the physical aural trauma of cranking amplifiers to damaging levels.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #43
Gear Guru
 
10 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
generally speaking I'm a big fan of NI Software, but GR is just really not a got amp/sim. i've gotten much better results from waves GTR and amplitube which are much less "digital/effect" sounding.

I'd put GR on par with a 90s box like the A3, which ironically is designed to be run into an amp - not replace it... which is to say if you ran the effects chain from GR into an actual amp - that might actually make it sound good - but it defeats the purpose if you are trying to use it without an amp.

someone should start an "AMP TRAX" website. there are those drum sites where can send sessions and live drums are tracked for you and you are sent back stems.

Seems to me there could be a decent little cottage biz in re-amping files for people who don't have access to real amps, mics, pre's...

some interprising person with a few nice amps, mic and pre's could probably turn some good coin... AC30, Fender Twin, Orange, Marshall... just a thought...
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #44
Gear Addict
 
soypancho's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Bring your own pedals, as many people have suggested on this board regarding many amp sims. In GR specifically, stay away from the built in EQ/DYN. I've found uses for the tube compressor, but it's nowhere near my guitars . Using decent compressors you can squash it and make it bigger and badder, but it will always lack detail and clarity. I've been screwing with GR for 3 years now and I haven't gotten sounds I'd feel comfortable putting on a record. It's great for practicing and not pissing off your neighbors.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #45
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H-Rezz's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halexx ➑️
It may be easy for you to put a mike in front of an amp and get a nice sound, but it seems miking amp is also an art in itself as i read a lot of thread with titles like :''Why don't i get a killer sound out of my expensive amp and complex mike setting?''

I believe that when looking for the perfect sound, all roads takes a lot of effort, and experience gratifying mistake.
A good guitar sound starts with you sitting in front of your amp tweeking and saving different guitar sounds , that is first base , as a guitar player if you're not doing this for various other reasons like setting up sounds to play live for example then what are guitar players working on these day's ? There is no instant gratification unless this is done .....

Once you have the sounds you like then you go about capturing them in your room , a lesson learned only once for each room , then repeat procedure with great results ......

Good luck in your quest
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #46
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awakened's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halexx ➑️
It may be easy for you to put a mike in front of an amp and get a nice sound, but it seems miking amp is also an art in itself as i read a lot of thread with titles like :''Why don't i get a killer sound out of my expensive amp and complex mike setting?''

I believe that when looking for the perfect sound, all roads takes a lot of effort, and experience gratifying mistake.
uhh, that might be a mic preamp problem. With a decent pre, you should really never have a prob getting good tube amp tone quickly.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #47
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I can only seem to get good results when plugging my guitar directly into my MOTU 8pre. When I use the DI on for instance my Vintagedesign M73D I don't like the sound at all, for some reason. I agree, it takes some tweaking, but I think you can get fairly good results with it. Still don't know if it beats a real amp though.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #48
Gear Maniac
 
Agreed's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
I can only seem to get good results when plugging my guitar directly into my MOTU 8pre. When I use the DI on for instance my Vintagedesign M73D I don't like the sound at all, for some reason. I agree, it takes some tweaking, but I think you can get fairly good results with it. Still don't know if it beats a real amp though.
I don't think GR3 beats a real amp, but it can be tweaked for good sounds.

I find it ironic that some have panned the 3.0 update, as I personally think the amps and cabinets added in version 3 are actually the best of the bunch as far as the accuracy of their modeling and "feel" realism goes! Just shows you that it doesn't pay to make sweeping generalizations, people are going to differ in their perceptions no matter how authoritative one claims to be That's why I focus so much on offering clips after I've spent time trying to make each program sound good on its own terms.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #49
Gear Nut
 
🎧 10 years
Strange, I get superb results with Guitar rig 3 with my strat. Better than I ever got with my Marshall back in the day. I played a song in my local music store, and they guys jaw dropped when he heard it was Guitar rig.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #50
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halexx ➑️
Just by curiosity Michael,

what guitar do you record with?

I have this 'theory' that like real amp, some matches with guitar just don't work.

For instance, i have an old 70's tube amp(Garnet) that just don't like the high output of the EMG's i have on a guitar.

Also, i read sometimes that amp sim nead a hi-z input in a soundcard/preamp.

I have noticed that like real amp, some simulations are really sensible to the input level you gave them.

Check the 'low/high quality' setting. It make a big difference on Amplitube.

Good luck!
Excellent point. Now that I think about it, my Strat sounded way better than my Lucille. Seems that the less gain and the less meatier the signal is the better.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #51
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by orjankarlsson ➑️
Strange, I get superb results with Guitar rig 3 with my strat. Better than I ever got with my Marshall back in the day. I played a song in my local music store, and they guys jaw dropped when he heard it was Guitar rig.
Yes. The best sounds I got with GR 1 and 2 were with a Strat.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #52
Lives for gear
 
mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
I can only seem to get good results when plugging my guitar directly into my MOTU 8pre. When I use the DI on for instance my Vintagedesign M73D I don't like the sound at all, for some reason. I agree, it takes some tweaking, but I think you can get fairly good results with it. Still don't know if it beats a real amp though.
At this point I'd say it definitely does not beat a real amp. It's not even an analog vs. digital debate because the sounds are so different. GR will take a wide amp tone and squash it to sound like a bad mp3 in a heartbeat.

But...I have to make it work since that's what the client is looking for: choices in the mix.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #53
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
how to get it to sound good?

take the software CD/DVD....break it into triangular pieces....shape one of the shards into a guitar pick....plug guitar into a real amp which is hooked up to a speaker....mic that speaker with a good mic which in turn is plugged into a nice pre amp. then toss the crappy pick you made out of the GR-3 CD into the garbage, get your favorite kind of pick and go to work.

yes....i am a wise ass.

however i also think amp sims are only useful for demo/temp tracks or disposable music of some other kind.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #54
Gear Maniac
 
Agreed's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by eligit ➑️
how to get it to sound good?

take the software CD/DVD....break it into triangular pieces....shape one of the shards into a guitar pick....plug guitar into a real amp which is hooked up to a speaker....mic that speaker with a good mic which in turn is plugged into a nice pre amp. then toss the crappy pick you made out of the GR-3 CD into the garbage, get your favorite kind of pick and go to work.

yes....i am a wise ass.

however i also think amp sims are only useful for demo/temp tracks or disposable music of some other kind.
So wait, what you're saying is that the best way to get a good tone with an amp modeler is not to use one?

I haven't heard that before, an interesting idea.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #55
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Chaellus's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
trying to get something acceptable out of amp sims is like trying to take a **** and hope it turns to gold.....not going to happen...and it leaves a foul stench
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #56
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaellus ➑️
trying to get something acceptable out of amp sims is like trying to take a **** and hope it turns to gold.....not going to happen...and it leaves a foul stench
Well, I've definitely gotten "acceptable" from amp sims after a lot of tweaking and layering. This, however, was not achieved in GR3...yet. I will find a way!
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #57
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Jorg's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaellus ➑️
trying to get something acceptable out of amp sims is like trying to take a **** and hope it turns to gold.....not going to happen...and it leaves a foul stench
haha,
however i do think that its not entirely true. It just depends on what sound you're after.
For guitars that are more in the background than the main instrument of the track it does work.

The problem is: Sims are supposed to make life easier = Plug in the guitar and get amazing, instantly usable sound. Now thats not really what you're getting and having to sit there and busting your butt to make them sound usable kinda goes against the whole idea behind them.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #58
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mbradzick's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorg ➑️
haha,
however i do think that its not entirely true. It just depends on what sound you're after.
For guitars that are more in the background than the main instrument of the track it does work.

The problem is: Sims are supposed to make life easier = Plug in the guitar and get amazing, instantly usable sound. Now thats not really what you're getting and having to sit there and busting your butt to make them sound usable kinda goes against the whole idea behind them.
Well, there are other benefits to using a sim other than just making life easier or work faster. It's another tool that has to be finessed to get it to sound right. Just gotta keep an open mind. If you're in a room with a bed and a desk, and that's all you have to work with, getting GR or any other amp sim to sound good would be great for that particular environment. If you can't afford to buy, or can't afford to use/crank amps to taste (apt, condo etc), then an amp sim is a pretty tasty option.

Being that different pickups with different outputs affect amp sims differently, I came across a way to squeeze a little more life outta GR3. Behold:

Route the clean amp or DI signal to a group or aux track, and put the amp sim on that track. Now, you have a variable output fader into the sim to find that sweet spot. Put the sim directly as an insert to the clean guitar track and you're F'd. Now, double/tripple/quad the same clean guitar track as well as the group/aux track. Apply different amp settings/patches to each GROUP or AUX track associated with the clean guitar tracks to add different layers. Simple as that.
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #59
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The Beatsmith's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I found GR3 a big leap compared to GR2... suddenly didn't sound like cardboard anymore

And my guitar has a coil tap - yeah, i agree that it sounds better with single coil guitars than humbuckers...
Old 10th February 2009 | Show parent
  #60
Gear Maniac
 
Agreed's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorg ➑️
haha,
however i do think that its not entirely true. It just depends on what sound you're after.
For guitars that are more in the background than the main instrument of the track it does work.

The problem is: Sims are supposed to make life easier = Plug in the guitar and get amazing, instantly usable sound. Now thats not really what you're getting and having to sit there and busting your butt to make them sound usable kinda goes against the whole idea behind them.
I compare it more to learning how to mic up and record an amp. There's an initial learning curve after which your skill level is uniformly high enough to get good results much more quickly.
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