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Massey or tritone digital?
Old 27th January 2009
  #1
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🎧 15 years
Massey or tritone digital?

TapeHead or ColortTone Pro

Pros & Cons please.

Also what should be the 1st plug too support Masseys independent movement?

Im using intel mac.
Old 27th January 2009
  #2
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Ol' Betsey's Avatar
 
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🎧 15 years
I would go for either the CT4 and/or the L2007.

R.

P.S. I like URS Sat plug ever so slightly more than TapeHead
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #3
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
colortone pro is a frequency domain convolution device. Massey tapehead has compression and saturation characteristics. The Colortone is essentially an eq. Different things for different uses. I use Colortone for it's console board "flavours" more than anything. that is before I got Q -clone.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #4
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hmmmm

so tapehead is the go too i guess.

had someone who wanted to sell me his color tone and I wanted too use it for that analog saturation stuff. But if tapehead is the "whats in" plug then i'll have to purchase it.

the ct4 is a lean sucker and clean also. Might have to buy that and also td5!

After all this im getting the stillwell 73 plug.

wow anymore suggestions?
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #5
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Ol' Betsey's Avatar
 
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Is the Stillwell RTAS?

I assume you're working in Pro Tools, right?

R.

P.S. Oh are you using the VST wrapper?

P.P.S. Man I forgot about the wrapper and that Stillwell does VST! I really like the Stillwell stuff as well...
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Betsey ➑️
Is the Stillwell RTAS?

I assume you're working in Pro Tools, right?

R.

P.S. Oh are you using the VST wrapper?

P.P.S. Man I forgot about the wrapper and that Stillwell does VST! I really like the Stillwell stuff as well...
Yes I have the wrapper. I just need a color set of plugs (within budget) and something clean without breaking the bank. Im not seeking a worldwide distribution, but just some toys that doesnt fillup my plugins list.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #7
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killah_Trakz ➑️
so tapehead is the go too i guess.

had someone who wanted to sell me his color tone and I wanted too use it for that analog saturation stuff. But if tapehead is the "whats in" plug then i'll have to purchase it.

the ct4 is a lean sucker and clean also. Might have to buy that and also td5!

After all this im getting the stillwell 73 plug.

wow anymore suggestions?
you'll get NO saturation elements out of colortone since it's frequency domain only - it's straight convolution. It's very useful, but has no dynamic component to is response.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #8
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🎧 15 years
Massey support here too!
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #9
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman ➑️
you'll get NO saturation elements out of colortone since it's frequency domain only - it's straight convolution. It's very useful, but has no dynamic component to is response.
You can get saturation effects out of colortone pro when messing with the 'warmth' fader.

I wouldn't recommend tapehead on the two buss. Too much for me. It's awesome on drums though.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #10
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🎧 10 years
I'm reluctant to say it but.....Demo both? They are very different beasts. I use Tapehead on every mix. I haven't pulled the trigger on colortone yet as the pluggo codec I find a little annoying....and its very cpu hungry. It is really good though.

I reckon it would be very useful for adding general "body" to a multitrack lacking that oomph.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #11
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
You can get saturation effects out of colortone pro when messing with the 'warmth' fader.

I wouldn't recommend tapehead on the two buss. Too much for me. It's awesome on drums though.
Well - not quite. It doesn't "saturate" but it has a kind of effect. It sort of does the EQ component but it doesn't do the compressive component. It can't since it is static convolution.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #12
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ianbryn11's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
everything MAssey is pretty good in my opinion. I really like the tape head effect. I use it more for extreem coloration or specific elements of a mix, say bass guiitar... . I like the URS saturation plug for more subtle effects. I actually find myself putting it on every track on 30ips setting alot of the time.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #13
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icebox's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I've never tried the Tritone Digital. But the Massey stuff is killer. The ct4 is almost undetectable and has such clean compression in some instances-it just makes things sit better in a mix which is what I want sometimes, and other times the Stillwell Rocket is just the ticket. That thing clamps down hard and has a lot of color. Tapehead is great too. I demoed all the Massey stuff and ended up buying 4 I think.
Demo them all. Go for it!
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #14
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman ➑️
Well - not quite. It doesn't "saturate" but it has a kind of effect. It sort of does the EQ component but it doesn't do the compressive component. It can't since it is static convolution.
According to the TriTone site, ColorTone has a "custom-coded Warmth algorithm to enhance the signal-path with extra harmonic goodness". As far as I know, this algorithm is not based on what "color" you have selected. Of course it will have different effects on your sound when selecting different colors, but this is not due to differences in the saturation algorithm which would be related to those colors if I'm correct.

Plus, compression, as far as I know, is not necessarily a requirement for saturation. "Harmonic goodness", as TriTone describes it, would be saturation. But I might be wrong.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #15
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KingUgly's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Between those two, I'd get the Colortone Pro. The tapehead is pretty much a very subtle distortion box in my opinion. It's cool on some things, not on others. Tritone is also compatible with AU, VST, etc. should you ever need those in the future, even though it uses that funky Pluggo.

The Massey Compressor and Limiter are the flagship plugs, imho. Although that tape delay is damn cool.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #16
Gear Nut
 
🎧 15 years
Can only comment on the Tapehead from experience as far as the saturation plugs. Really enjoy it but I reserve its use only for something that is lacking (& sometimes that's more things than I should) - I know too much of a good thing is prob just too much.... Also, I prefer it over the HD system's Pheonix plugin's many times.

Any any rate, I'd recommend it if that's the type of thing you're looking for. Otherwise what do you need from the other options primarily? My favorite 2 are the Limiter & the TD5 delay for sure. Both used on almost every mix for me.

The compressor is pretty cool but I haven't purchased that one yet so I don't use it as often as the demos don't save the settings (although it's very easy to just save the settings in the comments window below the track & reset upon opening the session).

Good luck
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #17
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
According to the TriTone site, ColorTone has a "custom-coded Warmth algorithm to enhance the signal-path with extra harmonic goodness". As far as I know, this algorithm is not based on what "color" you have selected. Of course it will have different effects on your sound when selecting different colors, but this is not due to differences in the saturation algorithm which would be related to those colors if I'm correct.

Plus, compression, as far as I know, is not necessarily a requirement for saturation. "Harmonic goodness", as TriTone describes it, would be saturation. But I might be wrong.
ah I see - so they've implemented something else on top.

As for harmonic content - that's all time domain, so there is no provision in convolution (static) for that lovely stuff!!
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #18
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
According to the TriTone site, ColorTone has a "custom-coded Warmth algorithm to enhance the signal-path with extra harmonic goodness". As far as I know, this algorithm is not based on what "color" you have selected. Of course it will have different effects on your sound when selecting different colors, but this is not due to differences in the saturation algorithm which would be related to those colors if I'm correct.

Plus, compression, as far as I know, is not necessarily a requirement for saturation. "Harmonic goodness", as TriTone describes it, would be saturation. But I might be wrong.

no. it does not saturate or compress. colortone is a big EQ. it's "static convolution". it does not react to the input changes it just puts a tone on it. check old colortone threads for explanation or the colortone forum. there is no saturation alogo unless they just put it in.

Tapehead in parallel for drums is the truth. also perfect as insert for soft synths
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #19
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by computa ➑️
no. it does not saturate or compress. colortone is a big EQ. it's "static convolution". it does not react to the input changes it just puts a tone on it. check old colortone threads for explanation or the colortone forum. there is no saturation alogo unless they just put it in.

Tapehead in parallel for drums is the truth. also perfect as insert for soft synths
There is saturation for sure. I agree that the colors do not saturate. It's the Warmth slider I'm talking about. Harmonic goodness they call it. If you don't believe me, demo it and mess with the Warmth slider. If that's not saturation, I don't know what is.
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #20
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1 Review written
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peace

Thanks guys, soo ct4 and td5 I guess......
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #21
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A LaMere's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Why not just download every single massey plugin and pick the one that you'd use the most??

One more vote for 'they're all great".

Looking at the plugin counts it would appear that I use the compressor and the limiter on every session that I do... nice.

I love me some tapehead as well.
the de-esser, td5 and the small EQ are also great at what they do.
Best software de-esser that I've ever heard.
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #22
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Benmrx's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Massey CT4, TD5 and L2007 are pretty much "must haves" for me. Never used the Tritone Digital stuff. For a "saturation" type plug, I'm still loving McDSP AC1+AC2.
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #23
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A LaMere's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benmrx ➑️
Massey CT4, TD5 and L2007 are pretty much "must haves" for me. Never used the Tritone Digital stuff. For a "saturation" type plug, I'm still loving McDSP AC1+AC2.
Massey's tapehead actually fits in great with AC1 and AC2 for me...
All 3 are great compliments to one another.
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #24
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🎧 15 years
I DId!

Quote:
Originally Posted by A LaMere ➑️
Why not just download every single massey plugin and pick the one that you'd use the most??

One more vote for 'they're all great".

Looking at the plugin counts it would appear that I use the compressor and the limiter on every session that I do... nice.

I love me some tapehead as well.
the de-esser, td5 and the small EQ are also great at what they do.
Best software de-esser that I've ever heard.
I don't need a computer full of plugins, just some go too's. How does massey license work? can I install for my home and studio use?

And yes the TD5 is my plug of choice then the ct4 comes in right after. SO! are bomb factory plugs north worth it? la2a, la3a or mc-77!
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #25
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
There is saturation for sure. I agree that the colors do not saturate. It's the Warmth slider I'm talking about. Harmonic goodness they call it. If you don't believe me, demo it and mess with the Warmth slider. If that's not saturation, I don't know what is.
I think that's just a custom "volume" knob for the convolved EQ. A but like the amount knob but tailored. I'll look into it....certainly doesn't sound like saturation.


.....had another look - not really saturation since there is no compressive element (not surprising!). Seems to be an EQ shape based on what you've convolved.
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #26
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman ➑️
.....had another look - not really saturation since there is no compressive element (not surprising!). Seems to be an EQ shape based on what you've convolved.
Why is compression necessary for saturation? For instance, PSP MixSaturator is a saturation plugin, but there's no compression going on there! Another example would be the Oxford Inflator. Saturation, but no time settings which would be related to compression.

I've contacted TriTone, curious to find out which one of us is right heh
Old 28th January 2009 | Show parent
  #27
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
There is a compressor in the inflator.... no controls, sure, but certainly is one. Same for PSPs plugin - i think !!

saturation gets "heavier" with more input - without getting louder. When you saturate tape you enter the land of the compressor.... yet there is no compressor controls on tape (!! heh)....

Unless Tritone have added some compression angle into this there isn't a route for there convolution model to handle time domain based events....
Old 30th January 2009 | Show parent
  #28
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🎧 15 years
from my thoughts!

Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman ➑️
I think that's just a custom "volume" knob for the convolved EQ. A but like the amount knob but tailored. I'll look into it....certainly doesn't sound like saturation.


.....had another look - not really saturation since there is no compressive element (not surprising!). Seems to be an EQ shape based on what you've convolved.
yes theirs some sort of eq beauty their in colortone. Ive listened to the tapehead and couldnt justify the smeary and lofi ish sound. But the ct5 has me sold!
Old 31st January 2009 | Show parent
  #29
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman ➑️
There is a compressor in the inflator.... no controls, sure, but certainly is one. Same for PSPs plugin - i think !!

saturation gets "heavier" with more input - without getting louder. When you saturate tape you enter the land of the compressor.... yet there is no compressor controls on tape (!! heh)....

Unless Tritone have added some compression angle into this there isn't a route for there convolution model to handle time domain based events....
I got a reply from TriTone. Here's what I asked:

I have a question about your ColorTone Pro plugin. I have a discussion with somebody regarding the Warmth slider. This guy says that this slider is just "a custom volume knob for the convolved EQ, like the amount knob but tailored, an EQ shape based on what you've convolved". I don't agree with him, and state that this Warmth knob induces your custom manufactured saturation algorithm, regardless of what convolution is selected.

I hope you can tell me who is right ;-)


This is the answer:

The warmth algorithm is custom harmonic generation / distortion that happens after the convolution. So, you are correct. It is not shaped based on the IR. He might be confusing it with the FIRE algorithm in HydraTone is shaped by the current EQ curve.
Old 1st February 2009 | Show parent
  #30
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narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeters86 ➑️
I got a reply from TriTone. Here's what I asked:

I have a question about your ColorTone Pro plugin. I have a discussion with somebody regarding the Warmth slider. This guy says that this slider is just "a custom volume knob for the convolved EQ, like the amount knob but tailored, an EQ shape based on what you've convolved". I don't agree with him, and state that this Warmth knob induces your custom manufactured saturation algorithm, regardless of what convolution is selected.

I hope you can tell me who is right ;-)


This is the answer:

The warmth algorithm is custom harmonic generation / distortion that happens after the convolution. So, you are correct. It is not shaped based on the IR. He might be confusing it with the FIRE algorithm in HydraTone is shaped by the current EQ curve.

Right. So they have implemented a time domain element - but it's not connected to the convolution element.....That also means that the harmonic and saturation elements are not related to the items being convolved....so.... as you like it i guess!!
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