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Yes you can mix with plug ins
Old 6th November 2009 | Show parent
  #331
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB872 ➡️
What ITB mixing needs is an affordable DAW controller with at least 24 faders, 8 encoders/channel for eq and dynamics, and a meter bridge. I know the ICON, Euphonix MC-5, and a few others do this already but lets face it, most people mix ITB because it's feasible and if they had the kinda money to buy one of these controllers they'd probably buy the SSL instead...I know I would. Let me turn off the computer screen, put the mouse aside, use the DAW as a medium, and focus on sounds rather than visuals.
That exists. It's called a console.

They're very affordable and they don't have to be upgraded with each new DAW.
Old 6th November 2009 | Show parent
  #332
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBoy ➡️
They're some many variables in reference to this on going and none important debate! Analog processing is here to stay and so are plugins. They both have their advantages and dis-advantages. If you can get the job done with plugins than so be it, If you can't the problem could be you, not the gear or the lack of.

I don't know how many GS were present @ the AES in 2007, but MHB played a mix he did for a client in his studio with all of his toys and then played the exact mix duplicated in the box. It was apparent to everyone in the room that the OTB mix was far superior to the ITB mix. Now with that being said, If we never heard the OTB mix, everyone in the room would have been kissing his ass about how great his ITB mix sounded! Why you say? Because the man can mix his ass off!

Now, stop this nonsense!
Does that demonstrate that OTB is better or his proficiency in OTB vs ITB?
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #333
Gear Head
 
BigBoy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Caffrey ➡️
Does that demonstrate that OTB is better or his proficiency in OTB vs ITB?
Are you saying MHB isn't proficient ITB? I didn't think so! I didn't say the ITB mix was bad or that he wasn't happy with the results. He's a great mixer no matter what the tools are at his disposal. All I'm saying, here's a fantasicly proven engineer, who has history in this industry, using the same approach to reach his goals for one song OTB and ITB. Both mixes were good, but out of 100 people listening that day 99 of them picked the OTB mix.

In conclusion, Plugins are great tools in the right hands, but don't you believe for one minute that the hardware emulation plugins are as good as their analog counterparts. Because, if they were as good, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #334
Gear Head
 
BigBoy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.R. McNeely ➡️
I hate to break it to you but, you won't get the "Exact" same mix EVER...even if you don't use plugs! In other words, if you mix a song.....print the mix.....come back a week later.....zero EVERYTHING and start from scratch....mix the same song WITHOUT listening to the first mix while using all the same gear....it will always sound different than the first mix. Like I said in an earlier post, mixing is an art. It's not paint by numbers and there will ALWAYS be a different result. The question is ultimately which mix do you like better. Gear is really not the issue....TALENT is and how it is applied.
I'm Sorry, but what your talking about has nothing to do with my quote nor is it breaking news!
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #335
Gear Nut
 
J.R. McNeely's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBoy ➡️
I'm Sorry, but what your talking about has nothing to do with my quote nor is it breaking news!
"The designers of these plugins and some top engineers swear that they can use plugins and achieve the exact same sound that they were getting from their hardware counterparts. And they can't get the exact sound and a top notch engineer proved it with his attemp to duplicate his OTB mix ITB!"

Your words.

What I said is NOT breaking news but it has everything to do with what YOU said.

MY point was....."The exact same sound" is NEVER possible. Plugs or not. Good mixer = Good mix.

No need to get offended.
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #336
Lives for gear
 
colinmiller's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
It would be technically impossible for the 2 mixes to be the same. But that doesn't mean they will be reasonably different. that would have to be determined by blind listening tests and in most cases most everyone would fail them. Of course unless there are huge mistakes between the two. But when done correctly most recalls are indistinguishable from the original to the majority of ears.

One could argue that on a printed analog master that no two playbacks are identical.
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #337
Gear Guru
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
That's Mr. Monkey to you....
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #338
Gear Head
 
BigBoy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.R. McNeely ➡️
"The designers of these plugins and some top engineers swear that they can use plugins and achieve the exact same sound that they were getting from their hardware counterparts. And they can't get the exact sound and a top notch engineer proved it with his attemp to duplicate his OTB mix ITB!"

Your words.

What I said is NOT breaking news but it has everything to do with what YOU said.

MY point was....."The exact same sound" is NEVER possible. Plugs or not. Good mixer = Good mix.

No need to get offended.
Sorry McNeely, I wasn't offended! You are basiclly saying the same thing I said, but in a different way!
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #339
Gear Head
 
BigBoy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Roddey ➡️
That's Mr. Monkey to you....
LOL!! You must be the BabySitter!
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #340
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I would love to know one thing.

Why people will spend years arguing ''digital or analog''

Protestant or Catholic? Coke or Pepsi? Man or Woman, MAC or PC, black or white, fender or gibson? Ribbon or Condenser?


No really.....why??

You're never getting any closer to an answer, and by say page 4 of threads it just becomes an argument about what someone typed or didn't type or who misunderstood this and that. Just like many posts above this one....go on ^^^ take a look. You can try and prove it with big numbers and big words but in the end how many people are actually gonna hear your work and how many people are actually gonna appreciate the thousands you spend when all they are getting from it is several minutes of noise for £0.99 (or free) when they'll probably press the skip button on their Ipod (after 30 secs) and are only playing the MP3 of it....I hope your idol mixing engineer starts using behringer exclusively just to piss on these sorts of arguments
Old 7th November 2009 | Show parent
  #341
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.R. McNeely ➡️
I hate to break it to you but, you won't get the "Exact" same mix EVER...even if you don't use plugs! In other words, if you mix a song.....print the mix.....come back a week later.....zero EVERYTHING and start from scratch....mix the same song WITHOUT listening to the first mix while using all the same gear....it will always sound different than the first mix. Like I said in an earlier post, mixing is an art. It's not paint by numbers and there will ALWAYS be a different result. The question is ultimately which mix do you like better. Gear is really not the issue....TALENT is and how it is applied.
And the ends justify the means.
Old 12th November 2009 | Show parent
  #342
Lives for gear
 
PlayRadioPlay's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Such a pointless, hateful thread. And it's not even like there's any good discussion coming out of this. It's just sh** slinging from two opposite sides that will never, and have no reason to be, a sole winner over the other. This is why they cancelled Crossfire. Crap like this isn't productive.

Fact: 99.999% of people use both digital and analog. Done. The argument is over.
Old 12th November 2009 | Show parent
  #343
Gear Nut
 
J.R. McNeely's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlayRadioPlay ➡️
Such a pointless, hateful thread. And it's not even like there's any good discussion coming out of this. It's just sh** slinging from two opposite sides that will never, and have no reason to be, a sole winner over the other. This is why they cancelled Crossfire. Crap like this isn't productive.

Fact: 99.999% of people use both digital and analog. Done. The argument is over.
Fact: By you posting this, you have just brought back to life a thread that has been dead for quite a few days. Congratulations! you are now part of the problem.
Old 12th November 2009 | Show parent
  #344
Lives for gear
 
gussyg2007's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Ah now only if this were true those ppl who have invested heavily in analog are slowly watching the demise of the whole LCF way of making music dying in front of there eyes , in fact we are going further than that!!! we are watching ppl who have invested heavily in pt hd2/3 see there investments crumble as native takes over !! Eventually it will all be ITB! surely there can be no doubt about that ? In ten years time there will be no engineers qualified to fix large consoles . The march of time the advances in technology will mean that music will be cheap to make and cheap to consume ! you could of bought a house for the price of a fairlight !!So even threads like this will be stupid "yes you can mix with plugins" well there won't be anything else !save a few boutique places where the white stripes can record
Old 12th November 2009 | Show parent
  #345
Lives for gear
 
PlayRadioPlay's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.R. McNeely ➡️
Fact: By you posting this, you have just brought back to life a thread that has been dead for quite a few days. Congratulations! you are now part of the problem.
A full 5 days. It's so ancient.
Old 29th November 2009 | Show parent
  #346
Lives for gear
 
Hardtoe's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
YOU GUYS ARE ALL [email protected]!





























just kidding - lighten up everyone - lets make some music...
Old 31st January 2011 | Show parent
  #347
Gear Head
 
jojamba's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
ITB vs OTB - no winners on this thread and we're 11 pages into it! Everyone has a way of doing things - IMHO it is unfair to say OTB is better than ITB - they are very different - just go check out some of the shoot outs - Cats cannot tell the difference between a ITB mix or a OTB mix and they do this for a living!

Enough with the jibber-jabber!



JAMBA
Old 31st January 2011 | Show parent
  #348
Gear Maniac
 
redrum's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojamba ➡️
ITB vs OTB
..I thought the op was about GEAR vs SKILLS heh
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