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Clearmountain Interview in Sound On Sound
Old 24th January 2009
  #1
Lives for gear
 
vodka gimli's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Clearmountain Interview in Sound On Sound

Quote:
I had brought some Apogee Mini-MP mic preamps for Mick’s vocal, snare, bass drum and the overhead mics. The Mini-MPs are the best mic pres on the market, but nobody knows about them, and Apogee has stopped making them.
Old 24th January 2009
  #2
Moderator
 
psycho_monkey's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Did you know Bob's wife is the head of Apogee?

Not that I disagree that the apogee preamps have a good reputation or anything.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #3
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
Did you know Bob's wife is the head of Apogee?
.
Dude why even go there?

The man has a proven history & track record better than anyone here and if that is what he thinks or feels than its probably coming from a good place.

If you disagree state it as so, but don't throw the guy under the bus with heresay.
(Very unprofessional IMO).
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #4
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Barish's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Yep. Agreed with Thrill.

If there were a gear pimping attempt in there as you suspect, why choose a product that is long discontinued anyway?

Silly thoughts. Move on.

B.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #5
FAT
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
Did you know Bob's wife is the head of Apogee?

Not that I disagree that the apogee preamps have a good reputation or anything.
Totally fair call. Why should highlighting information such as this about the Clearmountain's be a problem??
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #6
Lives for gear
 
leaper's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Well.. having been blown away by their "Trak 2" years ago (i think that was it's name), it doesn't surprise me that they continued to make first division pres.
I kind of dismissed their mini series just because it was all desk top orientated.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #7
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Barish's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAT ➡️
Totally fair call. Why should highlighting information such as this about the Clearmountain's be a problem??
Because that's punching below the belt, and then asking if it did hurt... You know what's in there, but you pretend that you don't. You know why you slotted that piece of filtered information in, but you are pretending that you were not aware of what that meant.

Everybody who knows about Bob CM enough to care what he does, also knows who his wife is and what she does. Why hit there even though you know that fact, and you know who the guy himself is and what he's capable of and what he has done in his career?

Very unprofessional. What are you gonna do? Are you gonna challenge him for expressing his thoughts about a product his wife happens to sell? Are you gonna be able to prove that he's actually secretly liking another mic pre, but he deliberately namedrops his wife's company so that they can sell more of a product they don't even manufacture anymore?

Should Bill Putnam have not engineered any records because he also owned a company making audio gear and selling them? Or vice versa? They are classics today forgodssake. Why shouldn't Apogee's mic pres be, if they are good enough to be called so? Wait and see, classics stand the test of time, the others dry and fall on the way.

Have you not heard of other great recording engineers whom also were great design engineers that came up with great products and inventions for the industry through third-party developer affiliations and collaborations?

Bringing that up in a topic like that is very childish and amateur in my opinion.

B.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #8
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jamwerks's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor ➡️

If you disagree state it as so, but don't throw the guy under the bus with heresay.
(Very unprofessional IMO).
What's wrong with pointing out an eventual conflict of interest?
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #9
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asagaai's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor ➡️
Dude why even go there?
If you disagree state it as so, but don't throw the guy under the bus with heresay.
.

Uh actually Thrill- if psycho monkey has direct knowledge that Bob Clearmountains wife is the head of Apogee- then his expressions are "direct evidence" and not hearsay.

If he has read about Clearmountains wife or heard about Clearmountains wife being head of Apogee then what he has said is second hand hearsay. But this is not a court of law and generally I did not think that primary source material was required in a post on Gearslutz.

Rather, what seems to be your beef is that he is asking people to draw an inference from his representation that Clearmountains wife is head of Apogee. The law has very specific protections regarding inferences to be drawn from facts- but this again is gearslutz....

Whether it is proper to mention that fact and ask people to draw an inference from that fact I leave to you.

Cheers

GJ
Newcastle/OZ
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #10
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Barish's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamwerks ➡️
What's wrong with pointing out an eventual conflict of interest?
I don't think that it is a conflict of interest.

The guy is one of the greatest AE's of our time, also with his sig as a producer on some great albums as well, and he says he likes the pres his wife sells. Where is the conflict of interest in this?

Are you gonna be able to prove the contrary? Or are you going to introduce new laws to prevent him from using the gear his wife's company makes so that when he's asked about his favourite gear he doesn't sound like a shill?

I asked earlier: Should Bill Putnam have not made compressors and EQs because he also engineered famous records? Or should he have not praised his compressors because he also owned the company that was making them?

Bringing his wife's affiliation up as if it was some sort of defect in his ethics is very unfair and with bad-intentions. Even worse than the shill intention BCM might have in his expressions.

He could well be designing and producing those mic-pres through his own company AND using them in his recordings in the mean time. What were you going to do about it? Call him a gear-pimp?

I mean, you want to know what he uses in his recordings because his discography is up there with the best of the best, BUT you don't want him to say he's using a piece of gear his wife's company does because that might be making him unethical money. Uh?

Talk about conflicts now...

That's amateur.

B.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #11
Lives for gear
 
vodka gimli's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
All I know is, if Bob Clearmountain uses those pres to record Mick Jagger's vocal, and Charlie Watts' kick, snare and overheads....the MOST important inputs on ANY Stones record...I might be well served in finding a Mini MP for my very own. They're going for $500-600 on eBay...at least for now. They be nice compliments to my LA 610 and Amek CIB for slots 3 and 4 on the Focusrite 428 A/D card. Hmmmm.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor ➡️
Dude why even go there?

The man has a proven history & track record better than anyone here and if that is what he thinks or feels than its probably coming from a good place.

If you disagree state it as so, but don't throw the guy under the bus with heresay.
(Very unprofessional IMO).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barish ➡️
Yep. Agreed with Thrill.

If there were a gear pimping attempt in there as you suspect, why choose a product that is long discontinued anyway?

Silly thoughts. Move on.

B.
I have no skin in the game, but pointing out potential conflicts of interest is always appropriate. But I imagine Bob means it.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #13
70% Coffee, 30% Beer
 
Doc Mixwell's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barish ➡️
Yep. Agreed with Thrill.

If there were a gear pimping attempt in there as you suspect, why choose a product that is long discontinued anyway?

Silly thoughts. Move on.

B.
Agreed. BC is right! The Mini-MP was GREAT!! And now SO ARE the Duet and Ensemble Preamps! How's my gear pimping doing?
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #14
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Barish...you're blowing this out of proportion...I happen to think Psycho Monkey is an ass sometimes, but I kinda enjoyed the fact that he brought this up...I really don't think anyone will question BC's integrity....even if they do, who f**ing cares....he hardly needs to prove anything...and, BTW, hardly needs you to defend him...the scope of his work is obvious...and now I'd really like to check that pre out....and I like Apogee products...even if they are secretly harbouring wives of iconic recording engineers.

Nick
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #15
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
i use to love the trak2. 2ch converter with a great pre.

there's a mini-me on ebay for 500
just saw a trak2 for under $500
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #16
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
I read the interview, and it was interesting how much work Clearmountain put
in on the project. It was surprisingly complicated, with different mixes for the movie, the CD, the DVD, etc., etc.

It was interesting how he mixed so that the sound would mirror the movement of the
camera.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #17
Lives for gear
 
Barish's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Mixwell ➡️
Agreed. BC is right! The Mini-MP was GREAT!! And now SO ARE the Duet and Ensemble Preamps! How's my gear pimping doing?
Getting there I think...

B.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #18
Lives for gear
 
colinmiller's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by slopeshoulder ➡️
I have no skin in the game, but pointing out potential conflicts of interest is always appropriate. But I imagine Bob means it.
What would be the conflict of interest?
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #19
Lives for gear
 
Barish's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickynicknick ➡️
Barish...you're blowing this out of proportion...I happen to think Psycho Monkey is an ass sometimes, but I kinda enjoyed the fact that he brought this up...I really don't think anyone will question BC's integrity....even if they do, who f**ing cares....he hardly needs to prove anything...and, BTW, hardly needs you to defend him...the scope of his work is obvious...and now I'd really like to check that pre out....and I like Apogee products...even if they are secretly harbouring wives of iconic recording engineers.

Nick
Eh?

It's the principles I am defending here, not BC or namely any other person.

And the fact that BC doesn't need third party defending doesn't give anyone a licence to come up here and anonymously imply that BC has, or MAY HAVE, unethical intentions with that statement of his either. That's a slander.

B.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #20
Lives for gear
 
RCM - Ronan's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Unless Bob C, has a secret stash of Mini MPs that he is about to start posting on ebay, what is the conflict of interest about saying that something apogee no longer makes was great? If he said the Apogee duet is the best converter ever, that might look a little dicey, but not this. Not by a long shot.
Old 24th January 2009 | Show parent
  #21
Lives for gear
 
Sk106's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey ➡️
Did you know Bob's wife is the head of Apogee?
No, I didn't know that. Interesting as trivial knowledge.

I don't know what this above squabbling is all about either .. the man has a wife, and now we're told she works at an audio hardware manufactorer. Where's the problem?

As for the interview, I'm gonna get SOS just to read it, since I'm not a subscriber. Thanks for the tip.
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #22
FAT
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barish ➡️
I don't think that it is a conflict of interest.

The guy is one of the greatest AE's of our time, also with his sig as a producer on some great albums as well, and he says he likes the pres his wife sells. Where is the conflict of interest in this?

Are you gonna be able to prove the contrary? Or are you going to introduce new laws to prevent him from using the gear his wife's company makes so that when he's asked about his favourite gear he doesn't sound like a shill?

I asked earlier: Should Bill Putnam have not made compressors and EQs because he also engineered famous records? Or should he have not praised his compressors because he also owned the company that was making them?

Bringing his wife's affiliation up as if it was some sort of defect in his ethics is very unfair and with bad-intentions. Even worse than the shill intention BCM might have in his expressions.

He could well be designing and producing those mic-pres through his own company AND using them in his recordings in the mean time. What were you going to do about it? Call him a gear-pimp?

I mean, you want to know what he uses in his recordings because his discography is up there with the best of the best, BUT you don't want him to say he's using a piece of gear his wife's company does because that might be making him unethical money. Uh?

Talk about conflicts now...

That's amateur.

B.
I think some of Bob Clearmountain's work is exceptional, and I also think Apogee makes some great gear.

However, judging by the tone of your posts, your emotions/hero worship for the Clearmountains seem to be clouding your interpretation of the post in question.

Nothing wrong with worshipping the Clearmountains- but it doesn't entitle you to jump all over this particular op for mentioning this relationship between people/products. Because you are very passionate about these people/products, you appear to have read all kinds of nastiness into an innocent post.

That's what it reads like anyway.
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #23
Gear Maniac
 
Preme Diesel's Avatar
 
5 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
What are you guys debating something so trivial?
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #24
Lives for gear
 
noiseflaw's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preme Diesel ➡️
What are you guys debating something so trivial?
Welcome to Gearslutz!
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #25
Moderator
 
narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor ➡️
Dude why even go there?

The man has a proven history & track record better than anyone here and if that is what he thinks or feels than its probably coming from a good place.

If you disagree state it as so, but don't throw the guy under the bus with heresay.
(Very unprofessional IMO).

it's unprofessional to give a glowing endorsement of a product when you have a conflict of interest. BC or not. I have Mini MPs.... and they're far from the best, good , but GMLs are better. And yes - I'd argue with the man.....on this and this point alone
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #26
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAT ➡️
I think some of Bob Clearmountain's work is exceptional, and I also think Apogee makes some great gear.

However, judging by the tone of your posts, your emotions/hero worship for the Clearmountains seem to be clouding your interpretation of the post in question.

Nothing wrong with worshipping the Clearmountains- but it doesn't entitle you to jump all over this particular op for mentioning this relationship between people/products. Because you are very passionate about these people/products, you appear to have read all kinds of nastiness into an innocent post.

That's what it reads like anyway.
Then we would have to call out & question every GS member that has some special hook up or relationship with a manufacturer that makes gear. By this line of thinking all of their opinions would be in doubt because their motives while honest are tainted because of the relationship to said gear manufacturers. But we know this not to be true don't we?

Sure some manufacturers in certain cases do give out perks or discounts on gear if they think it will help get their products name out there especially if the endorser is someone famous or someone people respect. And in some cases the user of said gear has no problem because they really like what the gear does and feel like giving a positive recommendation is only saying what they really believe. Is that really a conflict of interest? Would it change your view if you knew so?

My original beef is really why write something you wouldn't say to someone's face if they were in the room with you? I mean really if Bob C were in the room and said "the mic pres in the mini are the best" would you really say "yeah you say that because your wife owns the company"? I've always believed there is an internet ettiquette here and while you can freely give your opinion that is the line you don't cross because it comes across as backhanded and petty.
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #27
Moderator
 
narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor ➡️
Then we would have to call out & question every GS member that has some special hook up or relationship with a manufacturer that makes gear. By this line of thinking all of their opinions would be in doubt because their motives while honest are tainted because of the relationship to said gear manufacturers. But we know this not to be true don't we?

Sure some manufacturers in certain cases do give out perks or discounts on gear if they think it will help get their products name out there especially if the endorser is someone famous or someone people respect. And in some cases the user of said gear has no problem because they really like what the gear does and feel like giving a positive recommendation is only sayibg what they really believe. Is that really a conflict of interest? Would it change your view if you knew so?

My original beef is really why write something you wouldn't say to someone's face if they were in the room with you? I mean really if Bob C were in the room and said "the mic pres in the mini are the best" would you really say "yeah you say that because your wife owns the company"?
I would.
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #28
Lives for gear
 
mobilemozart's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quick to google:

Apogee Electronics at 20

Betty Bennett is Clearmountains' wife

I think it's OK for him to mention Apogee in all his interviews. Most interviews add the fact that his wife co-founded and co-owns Apogee anyway.

It still gives the company some credibility.

However, I wouldn't buy something Apogee builds based JUST on what BC says about these products.

And YES, I'd use the ADDA converters from my wife's company, too. In fact I'd ask her to bring a bunch of her best 16 Channel-boxes so I can finally afford a 80 Ch. Output setup for my Logic. ;-)
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #29
Moderator
 
narcoman's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by mobilemozart ➡️

However, I wouldn't buy something Apogee builds based JUST on what BC says about these products.
exactly.
Old 25th January 2009 | Show parent
  #30
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman ➡️
it's unprofessional to give a glowing endorsement of a product when you have a conflict of interest. BC or not. I have Mini MPs.... and they're far from the best, good , but GMLs are better. And yes - I'd argue with the man.....on this and this point alone
So for discussion sakes you've never ever been presented with any endorsements, freebies or free trials on software/plug ins or gear or music that you've come on this forumn and stated that you really liked?

And if you said no i would have to give you doubt because i don't really know you and would have to go on your word. And if you said yes to me it still wouldn't matter because its still just your opinion and it would be up to me tomake a decision based on what i felt about it anyways.

Maybe i just see the world differently than other do.
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