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Cable question
Old 21st February 2003
  #1
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Ruphus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Cable question

Hi there,

I just soldered a new cable ( ( MTI 4x 0,22 mm2 microphone cable with 2 TRS Neutriks on each end ). Plus being wired to tip, minus to ring and ground to sleeve.

But when I replaced it for the unbalanced cable that was going from the Ddrum4 brain outs ( it has balanced jacks ) to the Digi 001 ins it appeared that the signal level was slightly lower :eek: and also that there is more hiss.

In the same time I have the impression that the high frequencies are reflected a little bit better though with the new cable.

Can it be thelike or am I just thinking?
Maybe connection is not right that way / wrong cable taken?
I have also single microphone cable here ( Klotz 2x 0,22 mm2 microphone cable ), could it had been better if I had taken that one ( = channels being more separately wired )?

Thank you for any help!

Ruphus
Old 21st February 2003
  #2
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cashewcupcake's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
You need to attach cold (-) or negative to ground on both ends. The cable might still be a little noisier depending on the shielding because you've got a spare wire in there picking up RF and MF.

You could also attach cold to (+) or hot if you want a bassier cable. Higher impedance attenuates high frequencies and is better for bass.
Old 21st February 2003
  #3
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Ruphus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Great to learn a bit about these particulars, Faeflora, thank you.

If you or others won´t mind I have still three questions though:

1.
Quote:
You need to attach cold (-) or negative to ground on both ends.
Does this mean that I should desolder either + or - and attach it to ground, or rather to solder a bridge between one of the poles and ground?

2.
Quote:
The cable might still be a little noisier depending on the shielding because you've got a spare wire in there picking up RF and MF.
The cable has two wires in each of the two ropes ( I connected a TRS to each rope ). Did I understand wrong that with balanced connection the noise picked by shielding would then been sorted out from the signal bearing wires? Or ... was it maybe about three wires and the third needed for noise picking / detecting?

3.
Quote:
You could also attach cold to (+) or hot if you want a bassier cable.
I´m no native speaker. Could you please let me know what cold means electrically?

Thanks a lot!

Ruphus

PS: Just came to the genius idea of opening a prefabricated cable grggt ... It looks in the same way like what I had done.
Old 27th February 2003
  #4
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Ruphus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Guess it must be a quite boring theme for those who really dig it already. But I have found out that the vast majority of reording folks actually don´t know too much about cables and connections ( not to speak of salesman, especially here in Germany ).

So if anyone knowing would be so nice to spend a few words on my questions, I believe he would help also a bunch of other people to understand better about this.

Thank you.


Ruphus
Old 27th February 2003
  #5
Old 28th February 2003
  #6
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cashewcupcake's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Ruphus
Great to learn a bit about these particulars, Faeflora, thank you.

If you or others won´t mind I have still three questions though:

1.
Does this mean that I should desolder either + or - and attach it to ground, or rather to solder a bridge between one of the poles and ground?
Hi Ruphus. I was going to reply to your questions but I forgot to and closed the window or something. You should desolder - (also know as negative or cold) on both ends and attach it to ground.



Quote:
Originally posted by Ruphus

2.
The cable has two wires in each of the two ropes ( I connected a TRS to each rope ). Did I understand wrong that with balanced connection the noise picked by shielding would then been sorted out from the signal bearing wires? Or ... was it maybe about three wires and the third needed for noise picking / detecting?
Your question confuses me. What are these ropes you speak of? With a balanced connection the signal is split into two phases. The signal is summed at the receiving end and anything that is out of phase (noise picked up on each wire) is rejected. The third wire is the ground wire.


Quote:
Originally posted by Ruphus

3.
I´m no native speaker. Could you please let me know what cold means electrically?
Cold means negative.

I hope I answered your questions accurately and effectively.
Old 1st March 2003
  #7
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Ruphus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Benjy King and Faeflora,

thank you both a bunch for your help!
I took the hints into my library.

Faeflora,

what I meant with the rope I guess was described very badly. It was about one of those cables that are two in one.
I had chosen that sort for the long distance to the drum brain as I thought it more practically than having two ropes ( one per channel ) separately.

Thank you once again for your nice action

Ruphus
Old 2nd March 2003
  #8
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Ruphus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Kill me, but I just came to another question too

There is a TRS patchbay coming soon ( Neutrik ).
But as XLR is considered a better connection I wonder if I should omitt the batchbay whenever there is a way to go directly from one gears XLR to another ones.

Is that right? Would / could it mean a loss of signal quality when using TRS connection in cases where there are XLR options too?

Thank you!




Ruphus
Old 2nd March 2003
  #9
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
I have a fairly large amount of large outboard gear. [Seven Altec pieces, Pultec, 1176, Trakker, 2254A's, 1073, etc]. I have most of the smaller stuff [Distressors, DBX160's, Symetrix, TLA Audio and other pre's and compressors on the patch bay]. I have large racks which are easy to access from behind. So...to answer your question: It works for me to 'directly patch certain signal chains' with out the patch bay. Example: Lead vocal>tape out (from patch bay)>Altec 1567A>Trakker>BSS 901>Pultec>line in on patch bay. I have 1 ft. to 3 ft. XLR's hanging off the back of the rack and I just move things around for a particular chain. I hope this is of some help. I guess I could have just said "Yes". Ha!!
Old 3rd March 2003
  #10
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cashewcupcake's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Ruphus
Kill me, but I just came to another question too

There is a TRS patchbay coming soon ( Neutrik ).
But as XLR is considered a better connection I wonder if I should omitt the batchbay whenever there is a way to go directly from one gears XLR to another ones.

Is that right? Would / could it mean a loss of signal quality when using TRS connection in cases where there are XLR options too?

Ruphus


Yah, it's better to skip the bay if possible, in any circumstance. The fewer cable feet and solder joints the signal flows through, the better.

In some situations though, like if the bay to rack wiring isn't that long, using the bay (if it's a good well maintained bay your signal will be AOK.

There should be almost no audible difference between using an XLR jacks and plugs and TRS jacks and plugs.

Personally, I think XLR are better than TRS because the connectors lock (neutriks do) and the jacks don't wear out as quickly and become loose.

I tried using my studio without a patchbay and it slowed me down majorly. Plus it was a mental strain to remember how and where the signal flowed.
Old 3rd March 2003
  #11
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Ruphus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Great, so I´ll know what to do whenever there is a choice for XLR.

Thank you two again!

Ruphus
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