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What's the deal with "Dawless"?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #1
Gear Head
 
Auer's Avatar
What's the deal with "Dawless"?

Or rather, why is it a thing that some ppl seem to feel they have to point out.

"Dawless setup", "Dawless song". etc.

I dont understand the need to differentiate here.

What am I missing?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Gothi's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
You are missing the pleasure of having a reason to differentiate.

If it causes too much speculation, Mother Mary will have an answer.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #3
Lives for gear
 
tjontheroad's Avatar
 
It's what all the cool kids are doing these days
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #4
Gear Head
 
Auer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gothi ➡️
You are missing the pleasure of having a reason to differentiate.

If it causes too much speculation, Mother Mary will have an answer.
I thought of a few witty replies but it gave me no pleasure.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5
Lives for gear
 
hcppp's Avatar
They use "words" to see if they illicit a response.
I suppose they do!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #6
Gear Head
 
Naru's Avatar
 
My mother's gospel group are dawless. F**kin hipsters.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #7
Lives for gear
 
PuggaMahone's Avatar
 
Why do some people like to brag that they made the cake themselves? It's not "from scratch" - I mean they still used a box mix.

I don't know. Sometimes I record stuff in a single pass. Sometimes I edit TF out of it in Audacity. When it's a single pass... DAWless isn't exactly the right phrase, but audio editorless sounds even stupider. So, I don't usually hang a lamp on it either way.

Gah, I typed this whole thing in a dunkin donuts drive thru line and I'm still waiting
Old 2 weeks ago
  #8
Gear Addict
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auer ➡️
Or rather, why is it a thing that some ppl seem to feel they have to point out.

"Dawless setup", "Dawless song". etc.

I dont understand the need to differentiate here.

What am I missing?
In theory computers make creating music less fun, a sentiment most of us can agree is true at least periodically.

There's something more immediate about sitting at a piano or a guitar.

That said, if you're working on an Mpc the flow isn't much better than just recording in Ableton so who knows.

The idea, I suppose, is that it's "harder" to compose without a computer but I don't buy that if you're using something like maschine or Mpc.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #9
Gear Maniac
 
VonNaphoven's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I guess it's some kind of warning that you're about to listen to a glorified loop that goes on for 8 minutes.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #10
Here for the gear
 
What the deal with a lot of stupid ideas or trends on social media today? That's when you're realize you're too old for that shallow and vacuous stuff...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #11
Gear Guru
 
Jamie munro's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auer ➡️
Or rather, why is it a thing that some ppl seem to feel they have to point out.

"Dawless setup", "Dawless song". etc.

I dont understand the need to differentiate here.

What am I missing?
compare it to those who feel the need to tell people they made something with analogue or digital etc

it is just a thing

nowt to it
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #12
Gear Guru
 
Jamie munro's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by VonNaphoven ➡️
I guess it's some kind of warning that you're about to listen to a glorified loop that goes on for 8 minutes.
arguably all music does that

i watched a hardcore metal band last week - they too were dawless
Old 2 weeks ago
  #13
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auer ➡️
Or rather, why is it a thing that some ppl seem to feel they have to point out.

"Dawless setup", "Dawless song". etc.

I dont understand the need to differentiate here.

What am I missing?
It is important to point out your aren’t using a daw if you are explaining your setup.

However if someone has to mention he cooked a song dawless i’ll take it as an apology for the mess
Old 2 weeks ago
  #14
Lives for gear
 
iksrazal's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
A word that inspires immense insecurity from software users, a punchline, or a completely serious philosophy that provides instant zen.

My entire life of about 3 hours a day has been spent on the latter.

There are lots of reasons:

A) My workflow is live video based on timecode since it gets a better audience and no one wants to see 3 cameras on a computer and mouse. Controllers are still lame.

B) I own my hardware but software is owned by "The Man" with an umbilical cord and I won't click an EULA. No exceptions. See the "four freedoms" link in my sig to see more of the philosophy part.

C) My day job is coding open source and being a "Synth Admin" using closed source proprietary software is out of the question. I compile FFMPEG from source for video editing on Linux. Nothing besides hardware in the audio path.

D) I started out in electronics and spent a lot of time in studios in the 90's with tape. I fix my own gear. Some of my gear is DIY. Complete independence is top priority.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #15
Lives for gear
 
Ed A.'s Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie munro ➡️
compare it to those who feel the need to tell people they made something with analogue or digital etc
Or like the twenty-something hipsters who use vinyl exclusively and hate that nasty 96khz Dolby Atmos streaming for listening to music. They’re living in the past.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #16
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
It’s supposed to denote a better process with higher quality tools. Like “hand crafted” or “artisan produced.” It’s mostly b.s, as I go to the music posting section of this forum and its mostly dead. Over on KVR, where the vast majority of people use software, the music posting section is very lively. I’ve not found a perceptible difference in sonic quality in what the “DAWless” crowd produces.

As someone who lived through the time when “DAWless” was the only option, I find it somewhat funny. Most DAWs are basically analogous to a trade recording studio. You could make a recording in Live using the exact same process you made a recording in 1972, though you didn’t have to make sure you record early tracks with a bit more high end because you know you’re going to lose some after the umptheenth overdub. You don’t have to worry about calibrating your tape decks and you never have to worry about cross-talk.

What’s even sillier to me are the people who buy the hardware recorders which are basically DAWs in a harder to use box. Whatever floats your boat, though!

Do DAWs also offer a lot more? Of course, but you don’t have to use every option on something just because it exists. My car has XM radio in it and I’ve never once used it and now the free trial is over and I’m sure I never will. My espresso machine has options for milk drinks and I don’t like milk drinks, so I never use that feature. I’m sure my DAW (Bitwig) has a ton of features I’ve never used. In fact, I know it has a bunch of included instruments that I’ve never even tried.

I suspect that people love pain, and using a DAW removes a lot of the pain in the production process. The pain is useful because like actual physical pain, it forces one to slow down. I think some people need this type of speed bump to force them into thinking about their choices. Someone here was complaining about software having too many presets and options, which to them meant “analysis paralysis.” Maybe there’s a representative of the Audio Software Users Alliance that comes to their home and holds a gun to their head to force them to use presets. I do find it funny that plugins like compressors have any presets at all… I can’t even imagine why they would, as all compression is so dependent on the source that I can’t imagine a preset being useful and only possibly being right by sheer luck.

But if you hate using a computer, so be it. Nothing wrong in choosing the method that suits you. It’s not like music is full of logical choices. If it make someone feel good that they’re seen as someone who’s in love with an anachronistic method of recording music, good for them. It’s nice when people feel good.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #17
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by PuggaMahone ➡️
Why do some people like to brag that they made the cake themselves? It's not "from scratch" - I mean they still used a box mix.
My wife bakes cakes from time to time and I’ve never once seen her buy a cake mix. She’s not grinding her own wheat, but it doesn’t seem that hard to mix a few ingredients and put it in an oven.

Cake mix is the “MIDI Packs” of the baking world. For people who want to pretend they’re bakers, like people who want to pretend they’re musicians. Frankly, they’re better off buying a store bought cake and using the time they save to better learn their DAW.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #18
Lives for gear
 
Sebastian N's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
All the music i ever published was made using a daw. But i perform live with a groovex i built in eurorack, purely improvised. It's just different. Now, while i own a few ac6tial grooveboxes, i gotta say that I'd rather use push inside ableton than sit and program them to then record. Whatever sound they make, i can recreate inside the computer. And for playing live, no matter what ppl will say, you are basically stuck playing premade patterns with minimal alteration besides closing filters and envelopes. Which is fine, don't get me wrong. Did that as well and any kind of combination. I just moved away from the computer for playing live for stability reasons and also to try and get more fun back into it. But everyone has a different reason to do it

Last edited by Sebastian N; 2 weeks ago at 04:42 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #19
Lives for gear
 
Monotremata's Avatar
I played trumpet, clarinet and tenor sax in the school band in the 80s, I was DAWless before any of these hipsters were even born!

Of course it still takes a "DAW" of some sort to capture that "DAWless" performance whether its a tape deck, one of them 90s Roland VS boxes, or Cubase Pro..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #20
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I do appreciate when live artists advertise a "Live Hardware Set". That means I'm not going to be watching a diorama of a person sitting at their laptop. I want to see elbows flailing while they turn knobs behind a mess of boxes and cables.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #21
Lives for gear
 
A.I. Batule Chee's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
For me, it’s like stating that you won’t see a video of someone clicking on their mouse. You will actually hear the instruments’ own sound, and see someone performing with it. If you like hardware, I reckon that should be important to you?
Now, if it’s a good song or an “8 minute loop” as someone posted above, it’s a matter of taste. I mean, if you are looking for finished songs, don’t waste your time and open your spotify, or whatever song playing appliance you use for this.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #22
Lives for gear
 
NawwwwwSun's Avatar
 
If you’re good at making recorded music, you should be able to do it without a DAW or computer at all.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #23
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auer ➡️
Or rather, why is it a thing that some ppl seem to feel they have to point out.

"Dawless setup", "Dawless song". etc.

I dont understand the need to differentiate here.

What am I missing?
Dawless means the person didn't make the music on the same device they use to do their taxes. That is all.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #24
Gear Maniac
 
AstroSpy's Avatar
A DAW is non-linear, and can do just about anything.

If you're a talentless hack, you can pour a thousand hours into a single tune and get a great sounding result. Or spend 20 minutes making quick inspired choices, either by being good or lucky.

It's a valid brag - when it works
Old 2 weeks ago
  #25
Lives for gear
 
APHELEON's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Literally op


Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #26
Gear Maniac
 
VonNaphoven's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by NawwwwwSun ➡️
If you’re good at making recorded music, you should be able to do it without a DAW or computer at all.
Meh. That would be like saying you can't be a good photographer unless you can operate film cameras and work an old school physical darkroom. There's now a whole generation of amazing photographers that never used an analogue camera in their lives and only associate darkrooms with meeting places for casual sex. That said, it can be a lot of fun and very inspiring to investigate and master the old crafts. But it doesn't really say anything about the amount of creativity and quality of the final output.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #27
Lives for gear
 
NawwwwwSun's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VonNaphoven ➡️
Meh. That would be like saying you can't be a good photographer unless you can operate film cameras and work an old school physical darkroom. There's now a whole generation of amazing photographers that never used an analogue camera in their lives and only associate darkrooms with meeting places for casual sex. That said, it can be a lot of fun and very inspiring to investigate and master the old crafts. But it doesn't really say anything about the amount of creativity and quality of the final output.
I agree, you really aren't a photographer if you require a computer to do it.

You’re just a glorified accountant.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #28
Here for the gear
 
Audiorate's Avatar
 
I think it was a marketing ploy concocted by a consortium of gear manufacturers and YouTube influencers. How do you get people to buy more hardware than they need? You get them to abandon their DAW.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #29
Lives for gear
 
danielb's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Like many of the people in this thread, I can remember before the DAW was invented. In the 80s, I had one or two synthesizers, and I used to make recordings using two tape recorders, each time overdubbing the previous take. The end result was often a horrible low-quality recording.

That was DAWless.

DAWs allow me to make (in principle) very high quality recordings using a large range of hardware and software synths, as well as samplers, audio and everything else, for a very affordable outlay, but with a very steep learning curve. We get to use the same equipment that the pros use.

As much as I like messing with hardware synths, groove boxes and other gadgets, everything ends up in the DAW eventually, and always will.

D.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #30
Gear Maniac
 
VonNaphoven's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by NawwwwwSun ➡️
I agree, you really aren't a photographer if you require a computer to do it.

You’re just a glorified accountant.
Most arts require a creative brain, an idea and the tools and skill to capture it. I don't get this hyperfocus on just the tools. They're probably the least notable of everything once the creative process has culminated in its final delivery.
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