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Warm Audio WA87 - Sensitivity???
Old 12th October 2017
  #1
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MarkF48's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Warm Audio WA87 - Sensitivity???

Warm Audios specs don't state the sensitivity (mv/PA) nor can I find it anywhere in a search. Any other mic I've got has this published. Any ideas what it might be for each polar pattern? I mostly keep it as reference so when I set a preamp gain I have ballpark idea where it should be compared to other mics.
Old 27th March 2019
  #2
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TVPostSound's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkF48 ➡️
Warm Audios specs don't state the sensitivity (mv/PA) nor can I find it anywhere in a search. Any other mic I've got has this published. Any ideas what it might be for each polar pattern? I mostly keep it as reference so when I set a preamp gain I have ballpark idea where it should be compared to other mics.
Yes, Im resurrecting a dead thread!

But I had a chance to test a new U87ai vs a WA87 today.
What I CAN tell you, is that it needed 10dB more gain than the U87.
Using an Avid Omni HD, the U87 was at 39, the WA 87 was at 49!!!
But I understand the WA87 also has more headroom.
Old 27th March 2019
  #3
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Mertmo's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I have a zen modded WA-87.

I’ve noticed it needs a lot of gain, so this thread helps explain it!

Sounds awesome with my Great River, which luckily has a lot of quiet gain
Old 27th March 2019
  #4
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The one I tried was several dB hotter than my U87s.
Old 17th April 2019
  #5
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Gideon K's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkF48 ➡️
Warm Audios specs don't state the sensitivity (mv/PA) nor can I find it anywhere in a search. Any other mic I've got has this published. Any ideas what it might be for each polar pattern? I mostly keep it as reference so when I set a preamp gain I have ballpark idea where it should be compared to other mics.
You can contact most microphone companies to ask them, which is what I did. I have been thinking of getting a wa87.

The guy from warm audio said "wa87's sensitivity is 8mV/Pa and the S/N is 79db(A)".
Old 18th April 2019 | Show parent
  #6
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gideon K ➡️
You can contact most microphone companies to ask them, which is what I did. I have been thinking of getting a wa87.

The guy from warm audio said "wa87's sensitivity is 8mV/Pa and the S/N is 79db(A)".
Thanks Gideon. Made note of it on my mic spreadsheet.
Old 18th April 2019
  #7
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Gideon K's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkF48 ➡️
Thanks Gideon. Made note of it on my mic spreadsheet.
I have one of those too.

Is that a common practice? I thought I was being a geek.
Old 18th April 2019
  #8
JAT
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The wa model is based on the original 87, not the 87ai. It is about 3 dB down from the modern 87.
Old 20th January 2020
  #9
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How much gain WA87 needs to get usable levels?

I am having issues of output being too low (e.g. not even close to -18 dBFS) when connected on my Audient ID22, which has 60dB of gain, and cranked to max.

Thanks in advance,
Old 20th January 2020 | Show parent
  #10
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MickeyMassacre's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey91 ➡️
How much gain WA87 needs to get usable levels?

I am having issues of output being too low (e.g. not even close to -18 dBFS) when connected on my Audient ID22, which has 60dB of gain, and cranked to max.

Thanks in advance,
Just making sure: the id and the mic have the pads turned off?
Old 20th January 2020 | Show parent
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MickeyMassacre ➡️
Just making sure: the id and the mic have the pads turned off?
Yes, both pads turned off, phantom power on, 6m long cable.

I have checked the ID22 preamps using preamp check procedure provided by Audient, turned out to be in fine working condition.

My older AKG P120 is doing fine with loud results with preamps around 3-4 o'clock.

Warm Audio replied that, as marketed, WA87 is based on older gear and it requires 70 (dB), which is more that I have at the moment (60db). What puzzles me is that, while doing research before I went with WA87, that I have stumbled upon people having same setup, without reporting anything similar. Sweetwater even sells ID22-WA87 combo!
Old 21st January 2020 | Show parent
  #12
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey91 ➡️
Yes, both pads turned off, phantom power on, 6m long cable.

I have checked the ID22 preamps using preamp check procedure provided by Audient, turned out to be in fine working condition.

My older AKG P120 is doing fine with loud results with preamps around 3-4 o'clock.

Warm Audio replied that, as marketed, WA87 is based on older gear and it requires 70 (dB), which is more that I have at the moment (60db). What puzzles me is that, while doing research before I went with WA87, that I have stumbled upon people having same setup, without reporting anything similar. Sweetwater even sells ID22-WA87 combo!
70dB?? Hardly. When I tested the WA87, it was 49 with a spoken voice at 6inches.
And that was a hot recording in Protools via an Omni HD.
Old 21st January 2020 | Show parent
  #13
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVPostSound ➡️
70dB?? Hardly. When I tested the WA87, it was 49 with a spoken voice at 6inches.
And that was a hot recording in Protools via an Omni HD.
Solved. Tested with different cable it was all fine

It seems that one of connector pins was loose.

Thanks for the help
Old 4 weeks ago
  #14
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low output for WA87 R2

I know this is an old thread, but I just bought a WA87R2. I like the sound of this mic, but it has really low output.

I was wondering what those of you who have this mic do to get it louder. I have to turn it up to 2:30, which brings in noise, to get a decent signal for vocals.
I'm using a Solid State Logic SSL2 interface.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #15
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Gideon K's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by greg54 ➡️
I know this is an old thread, but I just bought a WA87R2. I like the sound of this mic, but it has really low output.

I was wondering what those of you who have this mic do to get it louder. I have to turn it up to 2:30, which brings in noise, to get a decent signal for vocals.
I'm using a Solid State Logic SSL2 interface.
I have had to crank the preamp gain on it somewhat. Not to ridiculous levels, but most other LDCs I have used are hotter in output.

Gain at around 40db on my fireface is not unusual. Maybe more. I tend to use it for voice and quieter sources mostly.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #16
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What do you do about the excess noise from turning up the gain?

And has anyone tried the WA 47jr? Does that have the same output issue?
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #17
ZEF
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVPostSound ➡️
Yes, Im resurrecting a dead thread!

But I had a chance to test a new U87ai vs a WA87 today.
What I CAN tell you, is that it needed 10dB more gain than the U87.
Using an Avid Omni HD, the U87 was at 39, the WA 87 was at 49!!!
But I understand the WA87 also has more headroom.
The U87 is lower sensitivity than the U87ai.
I think,,,,the WA87 is cloned to the older U87 sensitivity...which is 8mv +/-

The new U87ai is 22 to 28mv.

per Recording Hacks for mic specs.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #18
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Gideon K's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by greg54 ➡️
What do you do about the excess noise from turning up the gain?

And has anyone tried the WA 47jr? Does that have the same output issue?
Can't say it has been too much of an issue for the most part. The stuff I have been recording with it has been fairly densely arranged, and tends to be processed a fair bit during mixing. I noticed one vocal I did recently seemed noticeably noisy in places but it wasn't a deal-breaker.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #19
Gear Maniac
Actually I like low sensitivity mics. You can crank up the input gain on your pre, to get some mojo.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #20
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Thanks for your input. I have a couple songs where the vocals don't have a lot of instruments in some places, so having excess noise would be an issue. But I do like the tone of the WA87 R2.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Husky Squad ➡️
Actually I like low sensitivity mics. You can crank up the input gain on your pre, to get some mojo.
“Mojo” or whatever that means is not a function of how high the gain is set on a particular preamp, but on how close to the top of the pre’s headroom you are getting with the input signal. If you have a Neve 1073 and you’re feeding a really hot signal into it from say an M149 on a strong vocalist, and you have the gain all the way down to 25db plus the trim turned back to not clip the A/D, you wouldn’t have any more of that “mojo” if you put a -30db pad and turned the gain up to 55. It would just sound worse because pads aren’t transparent. And if you used a low-output mic like a C37A and had the gain at 55 you’d just have more noise, not more “mojo”.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #22
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismercifulfate ➡️
“Mojo” or whatever that means is not a function of how high the gain is set on a particular preamp, but on how close to the top of the pre’s headroom you are getting with the input signal. If you have a Neve 1073 and you’re feeding a really hot signal into it from say an M149 on a strong vocalist, and you have the gain all the way down to 25db plus the trim turned back to not clip the A/D, you wouldn’t have any more of that “mojo” if you put a -30db pad and turned the gain up to 55. It would just sound worse because pads aren’t transparent. And if you used a low-output mic like a C37A and had the gain at 55 you’d just have more noise, not more “mojo”.
Based on my observations with the vintage u87 and neve1073, every 5dB of input gain produces a certain color, while with hot and high sensitivity mics like the m149 there is not much room for variation between colors ( especially on loud vocals) because these microphones require little gain. i heard some people use inline pads to push neve harder for "that sound"? what do you think about it? P.s. I don't like pads for recording vocals
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #23
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2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husky Squad ➡️
Based on my observations with the vintage u87 and neve1073, every 5dB of input gain produces a certain color, while with hot and high sensitivity mics like the m149 there is not much room for variation between colors ( especially on loud vocals) because these microphones require little gain. i heard some people use inline pads to push neve harder for "that sound"? what do you think about it? P.s. I don't like pads for recording vocals
I would say they are mistaken. If the signal coming in is too hot on a 1073 then I’d sooner switch to a different preamp with a lower minimum gain value (25db is on the high side as such) than to compromise the tone with a pad. And if they want to push the pre into distortion, there’s nothing stopping them from doing so. It just means that with a hot mic “that” sound will happen at perhaps 30db gain rather than at 50db gain or however much. It’s not like you have the gain at a specific number, regardless of the mic to properly drive the preamp.
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