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Focal Alpha 65 or Neumann KH 120
Old 13th September 2015
  #1
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Focal Alpha 65 or Neumann KH 120

Hi,

I understand that the Neumann's are better, hear me out first.

The employee's at Sweetwater claim that the Focal Alpha 65's are the best in their price range & I don't NEED to purchase the Neumann KH 120 out of the two for simply editing vocals.

1.) If I can get a mix to sound good through the Focal Alpha's, will they sound good in a club as well?

2.) Do you personally think I'd be fine sticking with the Focal Alpha's as well for simply editing vocals for rap vocals?

3.) In your opinion, is the difference between the Focal Alpha's & Neumann huge when it comes to editing vocals?

Please try to answer all three questions and help me.
Old 13th September 2015
  #2
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
I'm also interested in this, considering the huge price gap, in what ways the KH120 are better than the Alpha 65? what will the KH120 will give me that the Alpha 65 will not?
Old 13th September 2015
  #3
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
1) yes
2) yes
3) no

@ foomki100
more detail/precision in the mids and highs, but nothing worth paying nearly twice
the money vs Alpha 65 (which actually are even better in the low end area)

Last edited by mirka; 13th September 2015 at 05:37 PM..
Old 13th September 2015
  #4
Deleted da58416
Guest
Is your room treated? If not, wtf sense does it make to buy monitors that are twice the cost of another that perform?
Old 13th September 2015 | Show parent
  #5
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted da58416 ➑️
Is your room treated? If not, wtf sense does it make to buy monitors that are twice the cost of another that perform?
It will be treated this week...
Old 13th September 2015
  #6
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nyandres's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Oo ...we had a conversation regarding the Neumanns and Focals. I thought you were referring to the CMS65. I prefer the CMS65, to the Neumanns. But now that I see you are referring to the lower end series Alpha 65, the Neumanns will definitelly be the better set.

As someone else suggested though. You will get a vastly better sound if you get the Alphas, and on top of that treat the room. Just yesterday, I saw a craigslist ad on a GIK room treatment kit for like $250 (which of course is gone :( ). The Neumann is better, but good room acoustics make a huge difference in hearing the most of your monitors. It will also make the sound going into your mic clearer, so its a win win in both fronts; not just in hearing, but in recording as well.

If you have good sound treatment in your room I would personally go for the Focal CMS65 (not alpha) at the pricepoint of the Neumanns. You can always add ceiling clouds and stuff, without having to sell your speakers for the sake of upgrade.

Last edited by nyandres; 13th September 2015 at 07:06 PM..
Old 13th September 2015 | Show parent
  #7
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
So...in general, you are saying that high end monitors( like the KH120 )are just not worth the extra $$$ over the price of low end monitors(like Focal Alpha)?
How much better in % would you say that the KH120 are than the Focal Alpha?
Thanks
Quote:
Originally Posted by mirka ➑️
1) yes
2) yes
3) no

@ foomki100
more detail/precision in the mids and highs, but nothing worth paying nearly twice
the money vs Alpha 65 (which actually are even better in the low end area)
Old 13th September 2015 | Show parent
  #8
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyandres ➑️
the Neumanns will definitelly be the better set.

As someone else suggested though. You will get a vastly better sound if you get the Alphas, and on top of that treat the room. Just yesterday, I saw a craigslist ad on a GIK room treatment kit for like $250 (which of course is gone :( ). The Neumann is better, but good room acoustics make a huge difference in hearing the most of your monitors. It will also make the sound going into your mic clearer, so its a win win in both fronts; not just in hearing, but in recording as well.
I understand that the Neumanns are better. I was wondering to what extent though.

Can you answer these three questions in the same format?

1.) If I can get a mix to sound good through the Focal Alpha 65''s, will they sound good in a club as well?

2.) Do you personally think I'd be fine sticking with the Focal Alpha 65''s as well for simply editing vocals for rap vocals?

3.) In your opinion, is the difference between the Focal Alpha 65's & Neumann huge when it comes to editing vocals?
Old 14th September 2015 | Show parent
  #9
Lives for gear
 
nyandres's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by T E C H N I C A ➑️
I understand that the Neumanns are better. I was wondering to what extent though.

Can you answer these three questions in the same format?

1.) If I can get a mix to sound good through the Focal Alpha 65''s, will they sound good in a club as well?

2.) Do you personally think I'd be fine sticking with the Focal Alpha 65''s as well for simply editing vocals for rap vocals?

3.) In your opinion, is the difference between the Focal Alpha 65's & Neumann huge when it comes to editing vocals?
This is not exactly a great answer, but they are both good monitors.

1. In either scenario the monitors just help you hear the frequency balance a bit better. But if the problem is as something of bad mixing technique, like not mixing with MONO COMPATIBILITY in mind... It will sound great in stereo even through both the best, as well as the average speakers in the world, but potentially really awful in the club. In other words you have to understand how to mix with a club in mind (at least not neglect to check for mono).

2. A combination of answers 1 & 3. The Focals should do for sure. But the Neumanns will help you hear things a bit better. For the price of the Neumanns, the higher end Focal CMS65 to me sound better than the Neumanns. If you buy used you may be able to score a pair for about $1200.

3. The differences are there, but is your room acoustically treated to be able to notice? If not the alphas plus room treatment will do better most likely
Old 14th September 2015 | Show parent
  #10
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyandres ➑️
This is not exactly a great answer, but they are both good monitors.

1. In either scenario the monitors just help you hear the frequency balance a bit better. But if the problem is as something of bad mixing technique, like not mixing with MONO COMPATIBILITY in mind... It will sound great in stereo even through both the best, as well as the average speakers in the world, but potentially really awful in the club. In other words you have to understand how to mix with a club in mind (at least not neglect to check for mono).

2. A combination of answers 1 & 3. The Focals should do for sure. But the Neumanns will help you hear things a bit better. For the price of the Neumanns, the higher end Focal CMS65 to me sound better than the Neumanns. If you buy used you may be able to score a pair for about $1200.

3. The differences are there, but is your room acoustically treated to be able to notice? If not the alphas plus room treatment will do better most likely
Oh I just skimmed through our private message. You got the second message mixed up.

What do you think about the Focal CMS 50 vs Neumann KH 120? Have you heard them against each other?
Old 14th September 2015
  #11
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
The Neumann were too bass light in my room. I wish they had 6.5 inch woofers.
Old 14th September 2015
  #12
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
So...in general, you are saying that high end monitors( like the KH120 )are just not worth the extra $$$ over the price of low end monitors(like Focal Alpha)?
In general they are worth the extra cash, but the Alpha's are a real bargain.

Quote:
How much better in % would you say that the KH120 are than the Focal Alpha?
They would substantially better (except for the low end response) in a well treated room, still i would get the Eve-Audio SC205 instead in such a context.
In a non treated room Alpha is definetly the choice to make.
Old 14th September 2015 | Show parent
  #13
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by mirka ➑️
In general they are worth the extra cash, but the Alpha's are a real bargain.
But in your first post you say it isn't?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mirka ➑️
1)more detail/precision in the mids and highs, but nothing worth paying nearly twice the money vs Alpha 65 (which actually are even better in the low end area)
Old 15th September 2015
  #14
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Can we get some more responses?
Old 15th September 2015
  #15
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Clockwise's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
It's needless to say, but you'll get way better idea of these monitors if you can try listening to them.

Regards to bass reproduction, it's all about monitor's bass extention and room response. You'll need to treat your room extensively to get a coherent bass response from say, 30-120hz, no matter what monitors you use (apart from DSP equipped monitors). Some people choose to use headphones to monitor bass and it's better to do so in an untreated room.
Old 15th September 2015
  #16
Registered User
 
🎧 10 years
I have the Neumann KH 120

they don't over hype anything and give you a reliable sound if you have acoustic treatment
I'm really happy I didn't pick cheaper monitors as my first monitors. It means I don't have to think about upgrading my speakers ever.

ask yourself the question if you bought the alphas would you regret it want to upgrade again because of their sound.....
Old 15th September 2015
  #17
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JonMiller's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I've used both. To me, the Neumann's just worked. Everything translated really well.
Old 15th September 2015 | Show parent
  #18
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonMiller ➑️
I've used both. To me, the Neumann's just worked. Everything translated really well.
2.) Do you personally think I'd be fine sticking with the Focal Alpha 65''s as well for simply editing vocals for rap vocals?

3.) In your opinion, is the difference between the Focal Alpha 65's & Neumann huge when it comes to editing vocals?
Old 15th September 2015
  #19
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nyandres's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by T E C H N I C A ➑️
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyandres ➑️
This is not exactly a great answer, but they are both good monitors.

1. In either scenario the monitors just help you hear the frequency balance a bit better. But if the problem is as something of bad mixing technique, like not mixing with MONO COMPATIBILITY in mind... It will sound great in stereo even through both the best, as well as the average speakers in the world, but potentially really awful in the club. In other words you have to understand how to mix with a club in mind (at least not neglect to check for mono).

2. A combination of answers 1 & 3. The Focals should do for sure. But the Neumanns will help you hear things a bit better. For the price of the Neumanns, the higher end Focal CMS65 to me sound better than the Neumanns. If you buy used you may be able to score a pair for about $1200.

3. The differences are there, but is your room acoustically treated to be able to notice? If not the alphas plus room treatment will do better most likely
Oh I just skimmed through our private message. You got the second message mixed up.

What do you think about the Focal CMS 50 vs Neumann KH 120? Have you heard them against each other?
Between the cms50 and Neumann, I'm not so sure. The Cms65 on a treated room however I would definite pick over all the speakers so far mentioned in this thread. On an untreated room, the alphas plus room treatment will beat any other speakers herein in an untreated room I'd imagine
Old 18th September 2015
  #20
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I heard the Alpha 65's and they were very impressive for the price. They have a lot more low end than the KH120's. The KH 120's have more detail in the mids but the Alpha's are pretty good too.
Old 19th September 2015
  #21
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Do the alpha 65 sound much bigger than the kh120?
Old 19th September 2015 | Show parent
  #22
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nyandres's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by foomki100 ➑️
Do the alpha 65 sound much bigger than the kh120?
The Alpha's are a better deal. The CMS65, are a better deal too (cause they are better than the neumann in my opinon). Id say get the alphas, unless you can get the CMS ones used.
Old 20th September 2015 | Show parent
  #23
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyandres ➑️
The Alpha's are a better deal. The CMS65, are a better deal too (cause they are better than the neumann in my opinon). Id say get the alphas, unless you can get the CMS ones used.
I don't understand how the Alpha's are the better deal if music will translate better with the Neumann's.
Old 20th September 2015
  #24
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
So what justifes the kh120's double the price of the Focal?
Old 20th September 2015 | Show parent
  #25
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nyandres's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by T E C H N I C A ➑️
I don't understand how the Alpha's are the better deal if music will translate better with the Neumann's.
Because if your room is not treated, the alpha's just may translate the same. And the alpha's will translate nearly as well, and perhaps better as their low end is more balanced. They are just not as detailed as either the CMS, or Neumann. If your room sucks (not treated and just reverby), you could have the SM9s and it would be a total waste of money because of the room (Maybe not a total waste of money, but not great).
Old 20th September 2015 | Show parent
  #26
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyandres ➑️
Because if your room is not treated, the alpha's just may translate the same. And the alpha's will translate nearly as well, and perhaps better as their low end is more balanced. They are just not as detailed as either the CMS, or Neumann. If your room sucks (not treated and just reverby), you could have the SM9s and it would be a total waste of money because of the room (Maybe not a total waste of money, but not great).
But the thing is I am treating my room though. I have the staff at GIK Acoustics assisting me in treating my room. So in this case, it looks like Neumann is now the better choice then? All I'm worried about is how well my music will translate.
Old 21st September 2015
  #27
Registered User
 
🎧 10 years
I just set up my first studio this summer with gik acoustics and the Neumann speakers.... if you putting the effort to get gik then they will shine
I was pretty blown away by the depth and detail they offer in a treated room started hearing details in background vox /breath noises I had never heard before in other peoples songs
Old 21st September 2015 | Show parent
  #28
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nyandres's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by T E C H N I C A ➑️
But the thing is I am treating my room though. I have the staff at GIK Acoustics assisting me in treating my room. So in this case, it looks like Neumann is now the better choice then? All I'm worried about is how well my music will translate.
The CMS65 will translate better than both though. I don't understand why not compare that one to the Neumann instead.
Old 22nd September 2015
  #29
Registered User
 
🎧 5 years
^ Once I ask about that someone is going to tell me about something that's even better than that and I'd rather not keep on searching for more studio monitors. It seems like the Neumann KH 120 will be fine. Actually I'm 100% sure it's fine, I guess my main concern is how well I'd be with the Focal Alpha 65.
Old 23rd September 2015
  #30
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I think the Alpha 65 would be fine. The 120's did not have enough low end in my room . I would have to hear them side by side but I am not sure the 120's would have much more detail. The Alpha 65's had good mid detail when I heard them in a store.
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