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Got a new amp!
Old 1st March 2014
  #1
Gear Nut
 
kmaaj's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Got a new amp!

But I'm not going to say exactly what it is until I've gotten some unclouded feedback. I recorded some chording and some riffs just to get a feel for the dynamics. I moved the amp into my living room where it could breathe a bit, put a KM184 just off the center of one cone and another KM184 @6 feet away and blended to taste. Just my stock 70's strat into a mij TS9 and a Guyatone delay. Sorry for the low keyed mood, but I'm not currently practiced enough to shred at the moment. Tell me what you think of the sound and after a few replies, I'll tell what the amp is.

Old 1st March 2014
  #2
Gear Addict
 
Ergo's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Some kinda AC15 reissue? Sounds low wattage el84 to me.

On my phone speaker, that is.
Could be a fender style too. Pretty clear cleans.
Old 1st March 2014
  #3
Gear Guru
 
FFTT's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Nice playing!

I think the TS-9 may be causing some fizziness on the top end?

Cleans are wonderful!
Old 1st March 2014
  #4
Lives for gear
 
mcgruff's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Not good. Sorry.
Old 1st March 2014
  #5
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Forgive me it's not my mother tongue, I hear a couple of brittle brighty frequencies taking over throughout. British?
Old 1st March 2014
  #6
Lives for gear
 
mcgruff's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
That could be the mics which push highs a bit and don't always work on a bright source. I always hated KM184's on acoustic guitars because of that.
Old 1st March 2014
  #7
Gear Guru
 
FFTT's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years


heh
Old 1st March 2014
  #8
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I don't..know. It's brave to take a km184 and throw it on an amp set up clean with a Strat ..especially a new one with a speaker that's most likely not broken in.

Im actually surprised that it didn't take my head off. It does sound bit brittle and it's also probably nudging at some of the nasty frequencies that get tickled by some digital interfaces.

It sounds marginal a little to tight and not very organic. I'd play through amp for a couple of weeks and also run some music into your amp and let it play when your not at home -to break in that speaker and then try this again with a different mic.

Then do one with the Km184. I'd be interested in hearing that for sure.

I've messed about with SDC's on cabs and it can work pretty well in some cases..ALmost immediately, the sound you're getting reminds me of the sound of a solid state amp.

: )
Old 1st March 2014 | Show parent
  #9
Gear Nut
 
kmaaj's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
The mics are the same ones that I used on my album of classical guitar solos, and I have always wondered if I had not mentioned them by name on other recording forums, if the people that typically like to diss KM184's could tell what they were. That was my motivation for keeping the identity of the amp "blind". At this point I will say this much: the amp was a surprise from my wife and it was waaaaay more than I was shopping for on my own.

As to the overall brightness, I'm curious: has anyone ever heard a Brian May or a Jimmy Page guitar track solo'd with the other parts muted? They don't sound very good on their own, but in the context of the mix, they work. I always go a bit brighter than my ear tells me in anticipation of that. Of course, when I do stuff for real, I may very well dial highs back.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Edoardo ➡️
Forgive me it's not my mother tongue, I hear a couple of brittle brighty frequencies taking over throughout. British?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgruff ➡️
That could be the mics which push highs a bit and don't always work on a bright source. I always hated KM184's on acoustic guitars because of that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pchicago ➡️
I don't..know. It's brave to take a km184 and throw it on an amp set up clean with a Strat ..especially a new one with a speaker that's most likely not broken in.

Im actually surprised that it didn't take my head off. It does sound bit brittle and it's also probably nudging at some of the nasty frequencies that get tickled by some digital interfaces.
......the sound you're getting reminds me of the sound of a solid state amp.

: )
Old 1st March 2014
  #10
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I'll speak for myself..When I said Im surprised it didn't take my head off it was (generally a positive remark) with regard to using an SDC on a new amp with a new speaker and a generally bright guitar, your strat...meaning, it was reasonably listenable. It doesn't sound bad and is certainly listenable...just a bit brittle sounding.

Why don't you just say what the amp is..sort of pointless to do the mystery thing.

Are you demoing the amp or the mic choice?
Old 1st March 2014 | Show parent
  #11
Gear Nut
 
kmaaj's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pchicago ➡️
I'll speak for myself..When I said Im surprised it didn't take my head off it was (generally a positive remark) with regard to using an SDC on a new amp with a new speaker and a generally bright guitar, your strat...meaning, it was reasonably listenable. It doesn't sound bad and is certainly listenable...just a bit brittle sounding.

Why don't you just say what the amp is..sort of pointless to do the mystery thing.

Are you demoing the amp or the mic choice?
The mics were the only ones at hand at the moment. If I decide to move the amp, it will be because of practicality, not sound. I love the amp. But I don't care for how the TS9 interacts with it. I've got the gain dialed way back on the pedal, and it's still too fizzy. If I keep the amp, and I probably will, I will experiment with various drive pedals, get another SDE1000 for delays (mine shot craps), and play around with ribbon mics. I'll say what the amp is in short order. I just did not want the identity to cloud the judgement.
Old 1st March 2014
  #12
Gear Nut
 
kmaaj's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Thread seems to have run it's course, so here we go.....told my wife that I wanted either a 90's Korg made AC15 or an equivalent knockoff, and she responded with this, an all original 1965 AC30 w/ top boost. I did the recordings in the Brilliant channel's high input. It is waaaay more amp than I need, but I'm digging it. Volume was at @10 0'clock.
Attached Thumbnails
Got a new amp!-vox-front.jpg   Got a new amp!-vox-back.jpg  
Old 1st March 2014
  #13
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Nice!! I thought it sounded VOX..think someone else felt it too. Does your wife have a Seester I could take to dinner??

It's not a 'new' amp though as per thread title..everyone thought you were rolling with a shiny new amp. Bad boy!

: )
Old 1st March 2014 | Show parent
  #14
Gear Nut
 
kmaaj's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pchicago ➡️
Nice!! I thought it sounded VOX..think someone else felt it too. Does your wife have a Seester I could take to dinner??

It's not a 'new' amp though as per thread title..everyone thought you were rolling with a shiny new amp. Bad boy!

: )
It's new to me! :-)
Old 2nd March 2014
  #15
Gear Guru
 
John Eppstein's Avatar
 
58 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edoardo ➡️
Forgive me it's not my mother tongue, I hear a couple of brittle brighty frequencies taking over throughout. British?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgruff ➡️
That could be the mics which push highs a bit and don't always work on a bright source. I always hated KM184's on acoustic guitars because of that.
KM184s are known for that. "Brittle" is what they excel at. I'd like to hear what is sounds like with a good dynamic like a Beyer M201 or M88 or a good LDC (NOT a new Neumann or a Chinese mic.)
Old 2nd March 2014 | Show parent
  #16
Gear Nut
 
kmaaj's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein ➡️
KM184s are known for that. "Brittle" is what they excel at.
I've also "heard" that. I have also "heard" that the pre's in my interface (RME Fireface UC) are "clinical" and "sterile".

To my ears, what is described as "Brittle", "clinical" and "sterile" translates as "transparent". But I'll be the first to admit that my ears need to trained when it comes to how the amp responds to high end pre's and various mic's. Just a few miles from my house is a recording studio run by a gent that made a few waves with an alternative band in the 80's and 90's, and AC30's were their amps of choice. If anyone knows the ins and outs of recording such an amp, he would, so I'll drop him a note.
Old 2nd March 2014 | Show parent
  #17
Gear Guru
 
John Eppstein's Avatar
 
58 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmaaj ➡️
I've also "heard" that. I have also "heard" that the pre's in my interface (RME Fireface UC) are "clinical" and "sterile".

To my ears, what is described as "Brittle", "clinical" and "sterile" translates as "transparent". But I'll be the first to admit that my ears need to trained when it comes to how the amp responds to high end pre's and various mic's. Just a few miles from my house is a recording studio run by a gent that made a few waves with an alternative band in the 80's and 90's, and AC30's were their amps of choice. If anyone knows the ins and outs of recording such an amp, he would, so I'll drop him a note.
You need some experience with some really good microphones. I would not call the brittle distortion of the KM184 (and many other post Sennheiser Neumanns) "transparent" at all.

It's "transparent" like my mid '70s Twin Reverb with JBL120s is "transparent".

Which is to say icepick in the ear time.

I wouldn't know about your interface. I use a Studer 2". Most digital interfaces sound clinical and sterile to me - or worse - except for the Radar.
Old 2nd March 2014
  #18
Gear Guru
 
FFTT's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Just using the rooftop concert as one reference, you see the Beatles have the Neumanns at about 18" in front of their amps.

In the much more affordable range, you might try a Sennheiser MD 421.

I'm very happy with the results I'm getting from my TAB Funkenwerk modded SM57. Zen Pro Audio sells them now with the T-58 transformer upgrade for $200.00. I use mine on all kinds of stuff. Much smoother than a stock SM57.

Just noodling, TAB 57 on the Fane Medusa 150-C
Old club worn AKG D-1000 on the EVM12L

Straight up into my M-Audio Project Mix I/O



Here my old friend John, same cab, Reeves Custom Jimmy



I love the Eagles Joe Walsh tones he gets starting at :45

I am certain your AC30 is fully capable of magical tones.

I think some of that brittleness may be due to 49 year old ceramic Vox drivers.
Not sure if you were routed through your TS9 for the clean parts
but, I'm thinking if so, it may have deteriorated the clarity a bit too.

Your amp is in remarkably clean condition for a '65

Sounds like a really good match for your playing style too.

Congratulations!
Old 2nd March 2014 | Show parent
  #19
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein ➡️
KM184s are known for that. "Brittle" is what they excel at. I'd like to hear what is sounds like with a good dynamic like a Beyer M201 or M88 or a good LDC (NOT a new Neumann or a Chinese mic.)
What John is saying is spot on..there's a reason people aren't commonly slapping this mic on guitar amps..other SDC mics as well.

It's what I meant when I said that you're "brave" to use this mic. Your zoning in on all these frequencies in the VOXy clean sound and hyping them--using a mic that's gonna exacerbate them, a mic that already has some tightness in this area, preamps that are sterile and doing the same thing and then into a converter that's probably spiky in that area (mostly due to cheap analog paths in that box)... until the listener is holding his bloody ears and looking for a window to leap out of.

And, RE you friends knowledge of recording this particular type of amp..

The best thing you can do is to get down on your knees and put your ears on axis with "beam" of the speaker and really listen to what's coming out. Get the amp up off the floor and listen to it with your head level and centered on ONE of the speakers.

Set the EQ on the amp with your ears in front of the speaker....So it sounds good..listen for things that humans wont like..listen to it for musicality. Being in this position is critical during amp setup if you are using a close mic technique.

Once you have a musical, listenable sound coming out... you could pick a BUNCH of different mics that would work. Most folks don't bother taking the time to really put their ears in the line of fire-----then they wonder why their recordings sound different..it's because their Knees or their Groin are doing the listening.

90 percent of recording any amp is actually setting up the amp properly with your ear's in the right spot. You can move off axis a very tiny bit and the change in sound is immediate and dramatic.

: )
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