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Can you identify these MICs
Old 11th March 2014
  #1
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Can you identify these MICs

I see at least 6 mics being used for his vox in this recording:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmTs1c_K720




It looks like 2x U47Fet in back & 2x TLM170 (or Gefells?) in front? And a Schoeps in middle & DPA (sideways)?

Last edited by aremos; 12th March 2014 at 06:45 PM.. Reason: Clearer explanation
Old 13th March 2014
  #2
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Yup. 2 47 FET, 2 tlm170, a schoeps (can tell by the shockmount). A dpa omni in the foreground, but probably not for the vocalist.

-Ben
Old 13th March 2014
  #3
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Much too close !
Its not pop music !
Trailer sounds good though, the Lexicon must be steaming.
Old 13th March 2014
  #4
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
If, like you said, it "sounds good", the placement (almost 2 ft.?) of the 4 LDC's (& the 1 SDC), I guess, doesn't matter - whether pop or classical.

It seems that their SPL is enough for handling this distance.

The entire thing is intriguing: from the 2 stereo pairs to the closeness of the source (powerfull tenor vox).

Lexi verb?
Old 13th March 2014
  #5
dtf
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
That's not a DPA in the foreground, but a Neumann KM8x, I assume a cardioid KM84. You can see them being used all through out the orchestra in other shots.
Old 13th March 2014
  #6
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Ahh you're right... Missed the close shot a few min in with the Teldec name on it. Definitely a Neumann KM series. The silver capsule on the black body threw me.

--Ben
Old 14th March 2014 | Show parent
  #7
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by aremos ➑️
If, like you said, it "sounds good", the placement (almost 2 ft.?) of the 4 LDC's (& the 1 SDC), I guess, doesn't matter - whether pop or classical.

It seems that their SPL is enough for handling this distance.

The entire thing is intriguing: from the 2 stereo pairs to the closeness of the source (powerfull tenor vox).

Lexi verb?
It does matter
Close vox sound very different from distant vox
Its better for the performer not to project, but not for the listener
My Decca Kingsway Halls tell me that.
Old 14th March 2014 | Show parent
  #8
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
I love JDF. It sounds closer than recordings from the 60s and 70s. But I don't think it's that close. I have heard closer voices.
Old 14th March 2014
  #9
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Yes, Juan Diego Florez's vox sounds "like him" & just fine. That's the whole thing. The distance he's singing at "looks" like one for a pop session but it just goes to show you that there are "no rules".
Old 16th March 2014
  #10
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rumleymusic's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
I does sound too close for my liking as well. Way too much singer, not enough orchestra, makes me want to squint while listening. The album consists of operatic excerpts, not crossover, pop, or even Neapolitan songs. Further back would have been more appropriate in my opinion.
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #11
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rumleymusic ➑️
I does sound too close for my liking as well. Way too much singer, not enough orchestra, ...
Absolutely, in the MIX, the blend of vox & orchestra is not balanced. But the voice itself sounds clean & fine & at a "correct" distance.
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Hi all,
This is my first post here.
How about this microphone positioning? Looks like 2 67's, w/ the MK(4?) center.
It was 2013 best classical album.

Jonas Kaufmann: Wagner - YouTube
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #13
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by emonteirobr ➑️
Hi all,
This is my first post here.
How about this microphone positioning? Looks like 2 67's, w/ the MK(4?) center.
It was 2013 best classical album.

Jonas Kaufmann: Wagner - YouTube
Microtech Gefell's I think, not 67's.
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #14
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Sorry, I mean M 49
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #15
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rumleymusic ➑️
I does sound too close for my liking as well. Way too much singer, not enough orchestra, makes me want to squint while listening. The album consists of operatic excerpts, not crossover, pop, or even Neapolitan songs. Further back would have been more appropriate in my opinion.
The singer does sound unrealistically loud but it is no worse than many of the violin concertos I have heard over the years.
Old 16th March 2014
  #16
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Mic stand is awfully wobbly...
Old 16th March 2014
  #17
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
These trailers always sound better than the cds !
Are the dubbing mixers given a free hand with the files ?
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #18
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by emonteirobr ➑️
... How about this microphone positioning? Looks like 2 67's, w/ the MK(4?) center. It was 2013 best classical album.
Jonas Kaufmann: Wagner - YouTube
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Spearritt ➑️
Microtech Gefell's I think, not 67's.
These are definitely M49's!
And the center one does look like a Schoeps but would not know about the capsule (MK4, 41, 21?) & would be great if someone that knows for sure about this recording could chime in.

From where the camera is it looks like a "typical" classical vox recording distance.
And Kauffman has to be one of the greatest (if not THE greatest) tenors of all time.
I've seen this set-up being used a lot now - 2 LDC's w/ 1 centered SDC - even 2 Brauner VM1's with a Schoeps or DPA in the middle.
Old 16th March 2014
  #19
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
You guys are funny
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #20
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➑️
You guys are funny
Hey Kevin,
Yes, some parts here look silly.

So what do you think of the sound of JDF's record?

(And, BTW, ironically, I think you were the 1st to send me the link to Kaufmann's video.)
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #21
Lives for gear
 
king2070lplaya's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by aremos ➑️
Hey Kevin,
Yes, some parts here look silly.

So what do you think of the sound of JDF's record?

(And, BTW, ironically, I think you were the 1st to send me the link to Kaufmann's video.)
I haven't listened to either of these actual discs, so I don't have an informed opinion. But the engineers who recorded them were top notch, and there's a lot to be learned from how they work.
Old 16th March 2014 | Show parent
  #22
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➑️
I haven't listened to either of these actual discs, so I don't have an informed opinion. But the engineers who recorded them were top notch, and there's a lot to be learned from how they work.
I like JDF so much that his voice, to me, is already larger than life. So if it sounds relatively a bit bigger than it should, it doesn't really bother me one single bit.
Old 16th March 2014
  #23
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
I think there's a good chance there's another mic (or pair of mics) up higher and out of the shot. Good chance, too, that the balance in the video ain't the balance on the record. I can see putting up something closer to get some optional heft, but that pair of 47 fet's? If you're gonna use them both, he'd better stand pretty darn still.
Old 17th March 2014 | Show parent
  #24
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn ➑️
I think there's a good chance there's another mic (or pair of mics) up higher and out of the shot. Good chance, too, that the balance in the video ain't the balance on the record. I can see putting up something closer to get some optional heft, but that pair of 47 fet's? If you're gonna use them both, he'd better stand pretty darn still.
And opera singers rarely stand still. He almost knocked off that tree of mics.
Old 17th March 2014 | Show parent
  #25
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pkautzsch's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn ➑️
I think there's a good chance there's another mic (or pair of mics) up higher and out of the shot. Good chance, too, that the balance in the video ain't the balance on the record. I can see putting up something closer to get some optional heft, but that pair of 47 fet's? If you're gonna use them both, he'd better stand pretty darn still.
Yep, there might well be some main pair, or at least his voice bleeds into a few other mics enough to achieve glue and a sense of "natural" spaciousness.
I also think that possibly this mic array has been placed there for the video crew, and "promotional" duties. Consumers - possible CD buyers - might be impressed by seeing a large mic setup.
Another component might be psychological. A mic in front of a singer often keeps them from moving around too much. Even if it's not that closeish mic's sound being used.
Old 17th March 2014
  #26
0VU
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Of course there's no way to know whether any/all of the mics shown are being used on the final CD mix. If they're not just there, as pkautzsch suggests, as set dressing, it's quite possible that the two pairs are up to offer alternative balances.

It's also possible that the SDC is something put up by the video crew for their sound and it isn't part of the session balance. Or it could even be there as a return talkback mic for the sessions. Given the closeness of the other mics, a dedicated talkback mic might seem a bit pointless/unlikely but there could be circumstances where the main vocal pickups for some reason are muted or not being monitored and the soloist wants to attract the attention of the control room or allow the producer to have a conversation with the soloist whatever the rest of the room is doing.
Old 17th March 2014
  #27
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rumleymusic's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Absolutely, in the MIX, the blend of vox & orchestra is not balanced. But the voice itself sounds clean & fine & at a "correct" distance.
I agree with you, could just be a bad/temporary mixing job for the video. The voice doesn't sound distorted of boomy, just very present.

Can't see the main pair in the video, it looked like he was facing the orchestra and that may be a problem for good presence in the mains. I am curious now to listen to the album.

Quote:
The singer does sound unrealistically loud but it is no worse than many of the violin concertos I have heard over the years.
The worst offender I have heard was a harp concerto. A harp should not drown out a trombone.
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