Quantcast
The ultimate *affordable* omni's for main miking large orchestras - Page 7 - Gearspace.com
The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
The ultimate *affordable* omni's for main miking large orchestras
Old 20th March 2019 | Show parent
  #181
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➡️
The answer to this question remains NT5s with Omni caps. Too bright pointing at the group? Turn em around or point them up.

They really are very surprising mics for how cheaply this setup can be had. Try them with balls too.
Yes they fight well above their weight class. Re. balls....do you have any ready-manufactured sources you could recommend, or have you gone the DIY route for these ?
Old 21st March 2019 | Show parent
  #182
Lives for gear
 
king2070lplaya's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➡️
Yes they fight well above their weight class. Re. balls....do you have any ready-manufactured sources you could recommend, or have you gone the DIY route for these ?
You can use the Schoeps spheres as they are the same diameter, or you can buy those 3D printed ones, which are apparently better than they used to be. Or you can make your own.
Old 14th April 2019 | Show parent
  #183
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
I can buy an used pair of neumann km183 OR a pair of at4022. Which pair do you recommend for classical music/Wind bands?
Old 14th April 2019 | Show parent
  #184
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorba1977 ➡️
I can buy an used pair of neumann km183 OR a pair of at4022. Which pair do you recommend for classical music/Wind bands?
The AT will be much lower cost than the Neumann. Maybe you could start with a pair of the AT, and if you don't like them you could sell them with much less loss than if you sold the Neumanns ?

What sort of hall or room are you going to be using them in ?
Old 14th April 2019 | Show parent
  #185
Lives for gear
 
Plush's Avatar
 
5 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorba1977 ➡️
I can buy an used pair of neumann km183 OR a pair of at4022. Which pair do you recommend for classical music/Wind bands?
Between those two the KM183 are the much better mics. Using omni mics--
so-called "real microphones," is both a great challenge and the ultimate sound.
Old 14th April 2019 | Show parent
  #186
Lives for gear
 
didier.brest's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorba1977 ➡️
I can buy an used pair of neumann km183 OR a pair of at4022.
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➡️
The AT will be much lower cost than the Neumann. Maybe you could start with a pair of the AT, and if you don't like them you could sell them with much less loss than if you sold the Neumanns ?
I think the opposite.


2 new AT4022 price ~ 750 €


KM 183 stereo set price ~ 1400 € (It can be found for less than 1300 €). Used price < 1000 €. If sold, loss on 2 new AT4022 is expectingly larger than on an used KM 183 stereo set.
Old 14th April 2019 | Show parent
  #187
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
183s. No question. Like I said about the 184s, it wouldn't be my first choice but I could make a good recording with them.


Quote:
Originally Posted by zorba1977 ➡️
I can buy an used pair of neumann km183 OR a pair of at4022. Which pair do you recommend for classical music/Wind bands?
Old 14th April 2019 | Show parent
  #188
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
They are all used, so if I sell them I don't expect to loss too money.
I will record in theaters, churches, small halls and outdoor.
Old 14th April 2019
  #189
Lives for gear
 
jimjazzdad's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
They are both capable mics. You can achieve credible results with either. The money you save with the Audio Technica AT4022 mics can be used for other gear. But the enjoyment you will have from owning the Neumann mics may be worth the difference in price. If you don't worry about budget, buy the KM183 pair.
Old 15th April 2019 | Show parent
  #190
Lives for gear
 
king2070lplaya's Avatar
Neumann, unless you’re expecting to use them up-close a lot.

They are diffused field EQ’d so they work incredibly well for things like pipe organ, room mics, large ensemble mains, etc where the mics are 10 to infinity feet in the air.

On chamber ensembles or solo setups they’ll start to show their brightness in somewhat unflattering ways, though this can be slightly alleviated with clever mic placement.

But they are Neumann’s, and very good mics. They have “the sound”. Highly recommended
Old 15th April 2019 | Show parent
  #191
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➡️

They have “the sound”.
Careful! You’re starting to sound like Plush. Respect the brand, buddy
Old 16th April 2019 | Show parent
  #192
Lives for gear
 
king2070lplaya's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by avillalta ➡️
Careful! You’re starting to sound like Plush. Respect the brand, buddy
Old 16th April 2019 | Show parent
  #193
Gear Guru
 
John Willett's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by avillalta ➡️
Careful! You’re starting to sound like Plush. Respect the brand, buddy
Old 16th April 2019 | Show parent
  #194
Lives for gear
 
king2070lplaya's Avatar
To be fair, this was my original post here.

I’m partial to diffuse field Omnis with balls, what can I say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➡️
The answer to this question remains NT5s with Omni caps. Too bright pointing at the group? Turn em around or point them up.

They really are very surprising mics for how cheaply this setup can be had. Try them with balls too.
Old 16th February 2021 | Show parent
  #195
Lives for gear
 
YRLK's Avatar
Just weighing in for the posterity of others...

I found the comparison on this thread to be of particular interest:

Schoeps MK 2h vs Sennheiser MKH 8020 Vs Telefunken M60 on Cello

As such, while I think that I preferred the Sennheisers most, I decided to order a Telefunken M60 master set and add some spheres.

At least in the very generous comparison test that the user Jagalle47 posted, I thought the Telefunken M60’s sonic quality left me just about as wowed as the Schoeps and Sennheisers did—the Schoeps felt slightly lacking in low end to me, I thought the Sennheisers were perfect, and the Telefunkens had the low end of the Sennheisers with just a touch of “lift” toward the top.

But once again, we must be reminded of the importance of a good performance beyond any equipment selection.

I just thought that the Telefunken M60’s sounded too good to pass up, and I’ve been wanting to experiment recording piano and drums differently for some time. The kit I ordered should give me a LOT of options.

Also, I know the M60’s aren’t as affordable as others mentioned in this thread, but they’re supposedly quite low-noise, and sounded quite comparable against the best of the best SDC’s to my ears.

Just my two cents. Best to everyone.

Last edited by YRLK; 16th February 2021 at 05:38 PM..
Old 21st February 2021
  #196
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Meanwhile, sE has presented its sdc omni:
https://www.seelectronics.com/se8-omni-mic
Old 21st February 2021 | Show parent
  #197
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by heva ➡️
Meanwhile, sE has presented its sdc omni:
https://www.seelectronics.com/se8-omni-mic
Yes, the sE8 looks to be a good balance of manufacturing quality, performance and price. It's got that typical 8-9kHz 'detail retrieval' bump engineered in, for far-field recording.

If you're going to be using the mic for closer work, would there be anything detrimental by simply inserting an inverse dip eq in your DAW to bring it back to flat response, for that specific HF region...or at least a diminished boost to the one designed in ?
Old 21st February 2021
  #198
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
OT: is the bump “built-in” or simply “not corrected” (because of natural pressurezone build up on-axis)?
Old 21st February 2021 | Show parent
  #199
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by heva ➡️
OT: is the bump “built-in” or simply “not corrected” (because of natural pressurezone build up on-axis)?
I don't know, but I thought the 'built-in' model would account for the 2 families of Omni: the 8k bump family: Neumann KM183, Rode NT 45-O, sE8 Omni, MK2S
The flat family: MKH20/ 8020, Line Audio OM-1

Last edited by studer58; 21st February 2021 at 04:32 PM..
Old 22nd February 2021 | Show parent
  #200
Lives for gear
 
pkautzsch's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➡️
If you're going to be using the mic for closer work, would there be anything detrimental by simply inserting an inverse dip eq in your DAW to bring it back to flat response, for that specific HF region...or at least a diminished boost to the one designed in ?
No reason to not EQ, if it gets you the sound you want. "Flat" omnis actually are just "corrected inside the mic", electronically or mechanically, with same results. The natural response of a pressure omni is treble boosted on-axis and flat at 90°, with center frequency of the boost depending on diaphragm size.

Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➡️
I don't know, but I thought the 'built-in' model would account for the 2 families of Omni: the 8k bump family: Neumann KM183, Rode NT 45-O, sE8 Omni, MK2S
The flat family: MKH20/ 8020, Line Audio OM-1
You might add to the flat family: KM131 and MK2, for example. The MK2H is in between MK2 (free field) and MK2S (diffuse field).
Old 22nd February 2021 | Show parent
  #201
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by pkautzsch ➡️
The natural response of a pressure omni is treble boosted on-axis and flat at 90°, with center frequency of the boost depending on diaphragm size.
I didn't know that....I'd always thought it was 'engineered in' to the mic, either via capsule tuning or preamp eq, to counteract the natural HF losses of the sound passing through air in the more distant 'diffuse' field ?
Old 23rd February 2021 | Show parent
  #202
Lives for gear
 
pkautzsch's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➡️
I didn't know that....I'd always thought it was 'engineered in' to the mic, either via capsule tuning or preamp eq, to counteract the natural HF losses of the sound passing through air in the more distant 'diffuse' field ?
The typical 8k or 10 k bump is the natural diaphragm resonance (which can be damped mechanically for a flat free-field response, so yes it's kinda tuned into the mic, but the easy way), and to a certain degree a boundary layer effect for very short wavelengths in the range of mic diameter.
So it's actually easier to make a treble boosted omni than a flat one, that's why most low-budget omnis from the far east are treble boosted.
Old 23rd February 2021 | Show parent
  #203
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by pkautzsch ➡️
So it's actually easier to make a treble boosted omni than a flat one, that's why most low-budget omnis from the far east are treble boosted.
...great, thank you for the explanation !
Old 26th February 2021 | Show parent
  #204
Lives for gear
 
kludgeaudio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pkautzsch ➡️
So it's actually easier to make a treble boosted omni than a flat one, that's why most low-budget omnis from the far east are treble boosted.
If only they could make two consecutive ones off the line that had the -same- treble boost.
--scott
Old 18th June 2021 | Show parent
  #205
Gear Head
Shure KSM141

Hi
Shure KSM 141 in Big AB with Rode TF5 in ORTF in kind of modified Tony Faulkner Array is a good option.
The Shure are IMHO the most underrated OMNI mics ever and are really impressive almost as good as MK2s
I had 3 session Livestream with both mics and I bought at the end 2 pairs of KSM 141 but ok I like personally the Shure...and I choose TF5 over mk4 with CMC 1 for ORTF because I like the hot mic sounding of TF5.
For info I am recording mostly orchestra mainly for Livestream purpose.
Big AB ORTF combo with outtriger and Windmain NOS is my basic setup and I add to it spots for instruments if needed.
So definetly Shure KSL 141
Old 4 weeks ago
  #206
Gear Nut
 
My best affordables are Oktava MC012s from the SoundRoom, that I've replaced all the internal electronics with a modified version of the Nelson Pass B1 Buffer; powered by a pack of 9v batteries.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #207
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Is there a specific definition of "Big AB"?

Thank you.


DG
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #208
Gear Nut
 
I'd say a useful definition of 'big AB' would anything wider than the center pair of the Decca '4-mic tree', which is 3', but in that case they are panned in a fair amount (7.5dB level difference). This, of course was only used with outriggers. Pg.136 of the Decca book.

Tony Faulkner often uses his M50s at 26-27", panned hard L/R.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #209
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by k brown ➡️
I'd say a useful definition of 'big AB' would anything wider than the center pair of the Decca '4-mic tree', which is 3', but in that case they are panned in a fair amount (7.5dB level difference). This, of course was only used with outriggers. Pg.136 of the Decca book.

Tony Faulkner often uses his M50s at 26-27", panned hard L/R.
Big AB 1.5m-2meters...sorry guys inch system is kind of archaic...at least every where exept US and GB...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #210
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I just posted a quick shootout between KM183's and sE8's with omni capsules: sE8 Omni vs KM183 on Piano
📝 Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 638 views: 124876
Avatar for jamesmafyew
jamesmafyew 2 weeks ago
replies: 27 views: 6830
Avatar for Pablo_prz
Pablo_prz 12th October 2020
replies: 195 views: 10755
Avatar for Plush
Plush 1 week ago
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearspace Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…

Forum Jump
Forum Jump