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Recording Classical music outdoors
Old 3 weeks ago
  #1
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Gaston69's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Recording Classical music outdoors

Hello Fellow Engineers,

Next weekend I will be recording a Chamber Music ensemble (Folk/Baroque) at a Carre shaped castle (outdoors) which means the ensemble is surrounded by three walls of the castle and covered with large umbrella.
I know recording outside can be tricky in respect to wind and lack of "acoustic" / "reverb"

Ensemble consists of the following members:

6x Violins
1x Clarinet
1x Contra-Bass Clarinet
1x Cello
1x Speech (reading Poems)


My questions are as follow:

1.) How to setup microphones
2.) Windshield/Jammers required?
3.) Close miking?
4.) 45min time to setup my microphones (all by myself)

Herewith my collection of microphones:

2x DPA4006
2x B&K4006
2x DPA4011
3x DPA4099
1x Schoeps MSTC 64 (ORTF)
4x DPA4060
5x Line Audio CM3

My Suggestion I had in mind:

Main AB DPA4006 with Bumblebee Wind Jammer
Outriggers Close to the violins B&K 4006 with standard wind foam and use spot mics DPA4011 (on the lead violin player(s))
Schoeps ORTF in front of Cello/Clarinet/Bass Clarinet with spot mics either DPA4099/Line Audio CM3

All goes into a Merging Horus and as backup 6channels MAIN + Outrigger + ORTF into a Nagra VI

Maybe I overlooked something therefore I am asking for your opinions on recording an outdoor Baroque / Chamber Music event.

Many thanks in advance for sharing your experiences and thoughts on this matter.

P.S.: I'm so happy to get back on the road again recording music after the long Covid-19 lockdown(s)

Cheers
Attached Thumbnails
Recording Classical music outdoors-alden-biesen.jpg  

Last edited by Gaston69; 3 weeks ago at 07:51 AM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #2
Gear Addict
 
norfolksoundman9's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaston69 ➑️
Hello Fellow Engineers,

Next weekend I will be recording a Chamber Music ensemble (Folk/Baroque) at a Carre shaped castle (outdoors) which means the ensemble is surrounded by three walls of the castle and covered with large umbrella.
I know recording outside can be tricky in respect to wind and lack of "acoustic" / "reverb"

Ensemble consists of the following members:

6x Violins
1x Clarinet
1x Contra-Bass Clarinet
1x Cello
1x Speech (reading Poems)


My questions are as follow:

1.) How to setup microphones
2.) Windshield/Jammers required?
3.) Close miking?
4.) 45min time to setup my microphones (all by myself)

Herewith my collection of microphones:

2x DPA4006
2x B&K4006
2x DPA4011
3x DPA4099
1x Schoeps MSTC 64 (ORTF)
4x DPA4060
5x Line Audio CM3

My Suggestion I had in mind:

Main AB DPA4006 with Bumblebee Wind Jammer
Outriggers Close to the violins B&K 4006 with standard wind foam and use spot mics DPA4011 (on the lead violin player(s))
Schoeps ORTF in front of Cello/Clarinet/Bass Clarinet with spot mics either DPA4099/Line Audio CM3

All goes into a Merging Horus and as backup 6channels MAIN + Outrigger + ORTF into a Nagra VI

Maybe I overlooked something therefore I am asking for your opinions on recording an outdoor Baroque / Chamber Music event.

Many thanks in advance for sharing your experiences and thoughts on this matter.

P.S.: I'm so happy to get back on the road again recording music after the long Covid-19 lockdown(s)

Cheers
The courtyard at Alden Biesen Castle has walls on all four sides and the umbrella covering is high up and pretty tight to the eaves, so wind - unless whistling through the modest-sized gateway (behind the photographer in the photo you attach) - shouldn't be such an issue as it normally is outside (but still be prepared). Likewise, lack of reverb shouldn't such an issue. What about the nearby road: what noise do you hear from that?

Cheers,

Roland
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #3
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Gaston69's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolksoundman9 ➑️
The courtyard at Alden Biesen Castle has walls on all four sides and the umbrella covering is high up and pretty tight to the eaves, so wind - unless whistling through the modest-sized gateway (behind the photographer in the photo you attach) - shouldn't be such an issue as it normally is outside (but still be prepared). Likewise, lack of reverb shouldn't such an issue. What about the nearby road: what noise do you hear from that?

Cheers,

Roland
Hello Roland,

First of all thanks for the prompt reply ;-)

I have been there only once with my family for a walk never did any recording over there. The Alden Biesen is in the country side however can't tell if there is air- or road traffic to be heard.
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #4
Gear Guru
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
i mix and record classical music outdoors quite often...

most of the time, i'm using all but (more or less) directional mics and hence windshields on all of them but as long as no amplification is involved, i don't have any problems using omnis (or fig8's or even shotguns) which then is a matter of separation between instruments (but not direct vs ambient sound).
outdoors, i try not to rely on mains (too much) but use them as close ambis and add another more distant ambient pair; i put a mic on each individual instrument (or on groups of two if the seating allows).
i'm using the distant ambis to get some crowd noise/applause but also to feed them into another efx device (but not necessarily route them to the main bus).

___


(i'd probably use ortf for mains, 4006's in wide a/b for distant ambis (if not at some distance, on each side of the ensemble), cm3's on violins, 4011 on speech (i'd prefer a hypercardioid), 4011 on clarinet, 4006's on conta-bass clarinet and cello)
Old 3 weeks ago
  #5
0VU
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
I do outdoor classical things in most summers. I tend to go with close mics for the main balance, using overall cover ('mains') just as a bit of aural glue to help bed everything into a common acoustic world.

With the mics you have, I'd probably go with something like:

Lead violin 4011
Other violins CM3
Clarinet 4099
Contra-Bass Cl 4099
Cello 4099
Speech 4011
(unless the speech is a less important part in which case I'd use the 4011 on cello or clarinet and a 4099 or 4060 with lav clip for speech)
Overall MSTC64
Ambience/Audience wide AB 4006

Preferably with fluffy windscreens on everything, particularly the directional mics. It doesn't take much breeze to create a major pita in the mix and, while fluffy windshields do introduce some compromise, it's a lot less compromise than the effects of filtering/processing-out a lot of wind noise. For light breezes and/or omni mics, I have a load of the Schoeps B5D hollow foam spoffles; for higher winds I use the Schoeps W20, W20R1 or various Rycote BBG, Baseball or Softies.

Given the tight setup time, I'd probably put the mics in their clips/shock mounts, with their fluffy windshields fitted before I set off, as it'll save valuable minutes on location. So long as you're the one carrying the cases and not some random gorilla type rigger or roadie who'll chuck them about, they should be adequately protected in transit for a one-off job. Or take an assistant who can help with putting things together, setting up mics on stands, and running cables while you get on with positioning things and getting the Horus and computer(s) running happily.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #6
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surflounge's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
another option for outdoor performance recording would be CINELA Albert Windshield For Ortf, Xy Pair Or 3-Channel
but don't know what happened to http://www.cinela.fr
website has been down for a while

Last edited by surflounge; 2 weeks ago at 07:05 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #7
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Be prepared for a completely different sound than you are used to when recording inside. No reverb and no hall acoustics. It will be, hopefully, a very rewarding experience for you and the ensemble. Best of luck!
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #8
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kludgeaudio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe ➑️
Be prepared for a completely different sound than you are used to when recording inside. No reverb and no hall acoustics. It will be, hopefully, a very rewarding experience for you and the ensemble. Best of luck!
It's not a bad sound, though. It's not unnatural. It's just different. You can try and fake it and make it sound like it's indoors, but I think it's better just to take it for what it is and enjoy it.

If you're up against a wall and maybe have some stone walls on the side, then there is some acoustical effect from that stuff and I think that's a good thing. Just listen to the rehearsal with one ear and see what you're in for.
--scott
Old 2 weeks ago
  #9
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Depending on where you are there could also be "nature sounds" including birds singing. Outdoors also creates lots of problems for musicians especially if the sun is out and it is hot. Stringed instruments in particular don't like to be "baked" and can go out of tune fairly quickly. Best of luck!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #10
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Gaston69's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Rented windshields

Just to be safe then sorry I rented 8 windshields/jammers just in case the weather would change.

Bubblebee
Rycote
Cenela Leonardo (Schoeps ORTF)

I plan use

DPA4006 incl. APE and Blackgrid for my mains (see pictures)
Schoeps ORTF for the Cello /Woodwinds (See picture)
DPA4011 for spots on Violins
CM3 in case needed as spots on the cello/woodwinds
B&K 4006 for ambient/outriggers
Attached Thumbnails
Recording Classical music outdoors-dsc03750.jpg   Recording Classical music outdoors-dsc03751.jpg   Recording Classical music outdoors-dsc03754.jpg  
Attached Images
Recording Classical music outdoors-image.png 

Last edited by Gaston69; 2 weeks ago at 08:08 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #11
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kludgeaudio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaston69 ➑️
Just to be safe then sorry I rented 8 windshields/jammers just in case the weather would change.
Those Rycote ball gags are great and work amazingly well although the video people complain about their sight lines.

Personally I use the WindTech UltraScreens at outdoor festivals because they are effective and rugged and inexpensive. They are not as effective as dead cats but the dead cats are a major pain to clean and maintain and do poorly in the rain. They are almost as transparent as the Rycotes and cost far less.
--scott
Old 2 weeks ago
  #12
Lives for gear
 
surflounge's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
brilliant! love the use of ape in half sphere rycote. thank you.

I will use with Josephson 617's
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