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Super micro minimalism, on steroids
Old 2 weeks ago
  #31
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Reading through this thread reminds me of Rolo's having finely distilled his rig based on decades of craftsmanship to that certain refined level of purest essence.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #32
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🎧 10 years
I don't think it can replace a main array of real microphones without seriously sacrificing sound quality, but it can easily function for instance as an adequate means for recording spot mics that will stay at least 10 dB under the main system. Putting such a recorder in front of woodwinds or timpani (mind the max spl though), saves one rolling out cables, taping these cables to the floor etc.. However, it will only work when the recorder has a decent timing, because some of the cheaper models have a horrible timing that will drift in a linear (or even non-linear) way pretty soon.

Of course it all depends on how good the recording must be. I did use some wireless video mics lately for a short musical introduction to an interview. It was a solo piece for clarinet and the musician liked it a lot. Adding some M7 reverb helped a lot, but when listening with scrutiny the recording couldn't hide the use of inferior microphones...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #33
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surflounge's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
is this correct for the Sony PCM D100 (and if so, then what external microphones could be used?)
Mic Input (Stereo Mini Jack): Input impedance: 22 k ohm, Rated input level: 2.5 mV; Minimum input level: 0.7 mV"
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #34
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kludgeaudio's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by surflounge ➑️
is this correct for the Sony PCM D100 (and if so, then what external microphones could be used?)
Mic Input (Stereo Mini Jack): Input impedance: 22 k ohm, Rated input level: 2.5 mV; Minimum input level: 0.7 mV"
Use an external preamp and any XLR-output microphones you like. Output of the preamp goes into a mini plug that goes into the line input of the Sony, thereby bypassing the mike preamps in the Sony as well as the mikes.

Oktava 012 and Audio Technica AT4053 are good not-cheap-but-not-expensive starter mikes. For a little bit more there is the Josephson C42 which I think is a real sleeper. Folks on this site seem to be fans of the Line Audio mikes but I have not tried them. Good microphones are expensive but they hold their value over time.
--scott
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #35
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surflounge's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kludgeaudio ➑️
Use an external preamp and any XLR-output microphones you like. Output of the preamp goes into a mini plug that goes into the line input of the Sony, thereby bypassing the mike preamps in the Sony as well as the mikes.

Oktava 012 and Audio Technica AT4053 are good not-cheap-but-not-expensive starter mikes. For a little bit more there is the Josephson C42 which I think is a real sleeper. Folks on this site seem to be fans of the Line Audio mikes but I have not tried them. Good microphones are expensive but they hold their value over time.
--scott
thank you for good help
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #36
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joelpatterson's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Now-- whether I am the hero or fool or innocent bystander of my own story-- and I must like to keep that tension going-- here is the "proof of life" of my scenario. Should be testing it out in the cruel world later this month. Stay tuned!
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Super micro minimalism, on steroids-img_0927.jpg  
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #37
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
pls keep us inormed how much/if you experience any drift between the two recorders...
Old 1 week ago
  #38
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jwh1192's Avatar
 
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🎧 15 years
yes .. Head and Tail Slates .. please !!!
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #39
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nobtwiddler's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Here's a shot of my two Zoom F8's locked together for a 16 track rock band, very small venue, 30 people give or take.
Sorry for the bad pic, it was very, very, dark in there!
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Super micro minimalism, on steroids-dsc07911.jpg  
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #40
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jimjazzdad's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobtwiddler ➑️
Here's a shot of my two Zoom F8's locked together for a 16 track rock band, very small venue, 30 people give or take.
Sorry for the bad pic, it was very, very, dark in there!
See you, and raise you 2 x 788 and a Sonodore preamp!

It is truly amazing what can be accomplished with a small, battery-powered set-up...this was for a 12-piece 'world music' band, including electric guitars, drums, tablas, flute and tar.
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Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #41
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nobtwiddler's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad ➑️
See you, and raise you 2 x 788 and a Sonodore preamp!

It is truly amazing what can be accomplished with a small, battery-powered set-up...this was for a 12-piece 'world music' band, including electric guitars, drums, tablas, flute and tar.
Beautiful!
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #42
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2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Well, well, well... fans of this thread, feast yourselves on the glorious results of my mis-spent evening... a six piece combo in an old railway station converted to a brew pub. One D100 was pretty much you'd say a drum overhead, the other one was right smack out front. (It turns out that over an hour of 96/24, which is the time limit that these machines encode before starting another file, the drift between the two is one frame. As in, one 30/th of a second: one frame.)
Attached Thumbnails
Super micro minimalism, on steroids-planet-kniffen-argyle-brewing.jpg  
Attached Files

D100 duet test.mp3 (3.97 MB, 347 views)


Last edited by joelpatterson; 1 week ago at 05:56 AM..
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #43
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🎧 10 years
There's a nice sense of connection between audience and the band, my guess is there's some 'responsible parent' limiting holding the dynamics usefully in check ? Add an audience-perspective video stream, and my brain will happily and forgivingly integrate all ....
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #44
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2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➑️
... some 'responsible parent' limiting holding the dynamics usefully in check ? ...
It's hard to be responsible when you're as [word choice up for grabs] as I am!

Actually, the setting of the levels was bungled almost beyond redemption-- I mean, don't tell anybody, but-- I sure thought both recorders had their pads notched down 20 db's, I really did. The one in the front did. When we ran the soundcheck, I got peaks nicely topping out at -6, or -4, maybe popping the red over briefly occasionally. And the level dial wanted to be right around "5." So when I hoisted the back one up, methinks "right over the kit? A little lower. Gimme a "'4.'" So I did.

You obvimously can't see the screen with its vital info, level readout for one thing, for the one in the air. It was misfortunately padded at zero. So its wav files were brickwalled, with a few little gougey exceptions. (I thought of a promo blurb the other day: It's all exceptional. With a few exceptions.) So that's a testament and answered prayer with the onboard limiting, that switches to a parallel signal -12 down to replace any overs, of which there was plenty. Which saved me a step! Lucky me.
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #45
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
i mixed and recorded 4 shows in a somewhat similar venue a few weeks ago and although clearly the former (live mixing) defined the choice of gear, i wouldn't have wanted to use just two handheld recorders for the latter (recording)...

...so i keep wondering what was your primary motivation to use super minimalistic gear (with some rather obvious/severe limitations)?

[genuine interest; for once, i'm not advocating my first strike capacity doctrine]
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #46
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2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➑️
.... genuine interest...
I truly wonder that same thing myself, it all seems like a preposterous (and post-posterous!) series of "what if this" and "why not that"'s, based on this vast theoretical faith leap.

On the other side of the saddle, I rolled in last night with this complete "milk crate on wheels" rig. I didn't have to plug anything in anywhere. Set up was easy McPeasey Breezy. As was breakdown. (Emphasis added As was breakdown!

Turning out, as the bandleader e-mailed me this morning, "crystal clear." In a woofy room with a raucous audience. One thing also dawned on me. No slight need to even wonder or wish about mono compatibility, these are inherently mono machines, even with the mics pivoted wide.

So, in conclusion, I have to speculate I just stumbled into something so simple dimple I never would have believed it... maybe don't, even now....
Attached Thumbnails
Super micro minimalism, on steroids-d100-rolling-cart.jpg  
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #47
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson ➑️
I truly wonder that same thing myself, it all seems like a preposterous (and post-posterous!) series of "what if this" and "why not that"'s, based on this vast theoretical faith leap.

On the other side of the saddle, I rolled in last night with this complete "milk crate on wheels" rig. I didn't have to plug anything in anywhere. Set up was easy McPeasey Breezy. As was breakdown. (Emphasis added As was breakdown!

Turning out, as the bandleader e-mailed me this morning, "crystal clear." In a woofy room with a raucous audience. One thing also dawned on me. No slight need to even wonder or wish about mono compatibility, these are inherently mono machines, even with the mics pivoted wide.

So, in conclusion, I have to speculate I just stumbled into something so simple dimple I never would have believed it... maybe don't, even now....
hm... - may i ask in what kinda market you're operating? or was this a (first) attempt out of sheer fun and the unintentional, or perhaps better: a naive (in the best sense) desire to gain knowledge, beyond financial considerations?


p.s. yep, with mics close together (at least on the apparatus), results tend to become mono-ish (which doesn't necessarily need to be a bad thing).

p.p.s. drift is minimal - i had less luck with half a dozen of tascam dr-5's a few years ago...
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #48
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2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➑️
... in what kinda market ....
Law of the jungle, entirely. "Serious" concert recording nets me 4 Ben Franklin's a pop, 3 if you're a long-term customer. This engagement, given all the "what's" and "why's" alluded to above, was 2.
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #49
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson ➑️
Law of the jungle, entirely.
i see... - the density of unknown predators in my primeval forest seems to be so high that i prefer to move expedition-style or use guerrilla tactics - the latter however not without the reassurance of a powerful helicopter fleet!

thx for sharing your experience - looking forward to your further use of truly mobile gear and (if possible) comparisons of results stemming from a more-than-minimal approach...
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #50
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joelpatterson's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
I just had one o' them realistic realizations-- back in 1973, there was this four channel (quad!) tape deck at Radio Shack. Hovered on the periphery of my gear lust... turned into one o' them lost love stories, a road not taken... but then you end up on that road anyway, inevitably, because you are destiny's child!

So... what I just set up... is, at long last, a quad system! If I could take $1700 of today's dollars, and whisk them back to 1973, and stand there at the door as my younger self loitered around... I would!
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Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #51
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
My own minimalist rig consists of:

Zoom F8 w/ talentcell battery
Various Schoeps/Neumann/AKG pencil condensers
Compact Matthews lightstands for 18” up to 8’
Sabra Som bars
Thin Canare quad cables
GX85 and LX100 cameras with lightweight tripods

Great for audition tapes or small recitals.
Fits in a carryon size pelican and small backpack.

Also a big fan of these little 4ch XLR/RJ45 snake solutions, though the necessary TSP cable does take up a good bit of space on its own.
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #52
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➑️
Also a big fan of these little 4ch XLR/RJ45 snake solutions, though the necessary TSP cable does take up a good bit of space on its own.
Don't forget the breakout boxes ! Is RJ45 cable as rf resistant as star quad ?
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #53
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by studer58 ➑️
Don't forget the breakout boxes ! Is RJ45 cable as rf resistant as star quad ?
I don’t believe they spec as well, but I haven’t had any issues in the years I’ve been using them in DMV, NYC, etc.

Nowadays I try to avoid using them for the most important channels in a setup, I try to keep those analog runs as short and simple as possible.
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #54
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hbphotoav's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson ➑️
I just had one o' them realistic realizations-- back in 1973, there was this four channel (quad!) tape deck at Radio Shack. Hovered on the periphery of my gear lust... turned into one o' them lost love stories, a road not taken... but then you end up on that road anyway, inevitably, because you are destiny's child!

So... what I just set up... is, at long last, a quad system! If I could take $1700 of today's dollars, and whisk them back to 1973, and stand there at the door as my younger self loitered around... I would!
I just had my A3340 TEAC 4-channel "SimulSynch" out of the case for its annual "let's pull a little tape to keep things loose" date. Still running like a champ... and (fortunately) I still like most of the stuff I recorded between purchase in 1975 and sometime in the late '90s, when I began to do direct board mix archive recordings on a TDK CD-R "Music" recorder). Until 18 months ago, it's been tracking live events (heh) through a Midas M32R (or a Mackie Onyx1220FW), with the appropriate digi-cable and a MacBook Pro with Logic and a external SSD. It's all good.

Cheers! And, onward in your quest!

HB
Old 4 days ago | Show parent
  #55
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Although I wouldn't hold my breath for it to happen, it would be interesting if there was a camera that would shoot video that sync'd up to the D100s with only one dropped frame over an hour plus recording.
Old 4 days ago | Show parent
  #56
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks ➑️
Although I wouldn't hold my breath for it to happen, it would be interesting if there was a camera that would shoot video that sync'd up to the D100s with only one dropped frame over an hour plus recording.
i occasionally used a zoom handheld video recorder to avoid drift in low-key/small-gear situations...
Old 4 days ago | Show parent
  #57
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joelpatterson's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2manyrocks ➑️
Although I wouldn't hold my breath for it to happen, it would be interesting if there was a camera that would shoot video that sync'd up to the D100s with only one dropped frame over an hour plus recording.
Exactly one dropped frame, and I would be in heaven!

Funny you should mention it, but since this gig promised to be so effortless, I brought in my humble but trusty DJI Pocket 2 camera and set it up against the wall to capture an "archival" (there's a word that's gone through some changes) video for future generations, as well as the present one. Kind of a monotony, the same shot for an hour and a half, but perhaps Commander Kniffen will want to make some part of it public at some juncture.
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