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Rode TF-5... thumbs up!
Old 7th February 2021
  #1
Here for the gear
 
Rode TF-5... thumbs up!

I've learned a lot from Gearslutz over the years, and I finally wanted to contribute my humble experience. I decided to take a chance on Rode's collaboration with Tony Faulkner and bought the TF-5.

Bottom line: I like these mics... a lot.

I'm a professional classical saxophonist and oboist in the US Army Bands, and my gear choices are mainly in the interest of recording myself and my kids. I almost never have the luxury of good acoustic spaces to record in, so I do what I can to minimize the effect of my living room. I also cannot modify it much since it is base housing. Hence, the need for a good pair of cardiod condensers. My ribbons (R88 and R84, which I love) catch too much of the room sometimes.

Years ago, in 2002, I was an intern at Audio Effects, a gear rental shop in LA. On the days I was there, not much was going on, so I grabbed gear off the shelves and got to play. One day, I brought in my sax, and set up the following chain: B&K 4003 (yes the pre-DPA), Millennia HV-3D, Prism Dream AD/DA, Genelec. It's too long ago to remember the specifics of the sound, but I do remember my emotional response. It was the first time I had heard my sax played back as I heard it in my head; it was amazing. I could never afford that gear for myself. Upon receiving my TF-5s, I did some test tracks on my oboe, and my son's cello, but what cinched it for me was when I recorded my sax. I had a very similar emotional response as I had all those years ago with the legendary gear. I kept the TF-5s, and I have made some recordings that I am very proud of. Most surprising is how well they have worked with my daughter singing Broadway-style songs. They take eq, compression, and effects very well in addition to sounding great on their own. I'm not posting those for copyright reasons, and she is still shy about who hears her.

Here are some quick demo tracks I made to show off the mics as best I can. The sax and oboe are TF-5s in XY about 3 feet in front of the instruments. You'll hear key noise, but for as detailed as these mics are, I don't feel like they are over-exagerating the extraneous noises as some condensers I have worked with do. The cello recording is a Clef Cannon composed and performed by my son. He overdubbed the parts. Unfortunately, I only have open-back AKG 701 headphones, so you'll hear some of the metronome (I know what my next purchase needs to be). Each side was recorded mono and then panned left-right. Sorry, but I had to convert the cannon into an mp3 to stay within file size limits for GS. All recordings have some Altiverb Mozart Hall at about 29% mix.

I hope this is of some use to you. Best wishes!
Attached Files

Oboe Demo.wav (14.45 MB, 1482 views)

Sax Demo.wav (13.35 MB, 1485 views)

Elliot Clef Cannon mp3.mp3 (6.80 MB, 1434 views)

Old 9th February 2021
  #2
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Nice recordings. Your son is a good cellist! The TF-5s are pleasing to listen to, not hyped, and even a bit silky.

Thanks for posting!
Old 10th February 2021 | Show parent
  #3
Here for the gear
 
Thanks! BTW, I apologize for the double-post. When I originally posted this, it didn’t show up right away, so I thought something went wrong and ended up posting something very similar at the end of another TF5 thread.
Old 10th February 2021 | Show parent
  #4
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
No worries here. Let me explain. Posts by new members are moderated and need to be approved before they can be seen. This is done to help prevent possible spam posts and such.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyoboe ➡️
Thanks! BTW, I apologize for the double-post. When I originally posted this, it didn’t show up right away, so I thought something went wrong and ended up posting something very similar at the end of another TF5 thread.
Old 10th February 2021 | Show parent
  #5
Here for the gear
 
Makes sense. Thanks!
Old 18th February 2021
  #6
Here for the gear
 
Here is another living-room recording with the TF5s. This is a cello and saxophone fugue written recently by my 16-year old son. He is playing cello, and I am on sax. This is not pure stereo because I was getting too many nasty room resonances. I recorded us facing each other about 6 or 7 feet apart. The cello mic is pointed at the cello right about where the finger board ends with a slightly downward angle. It is as close to the cello as I could get without interfering with the bow, so about 2 feet away. The sax was in a classic close-miked position, above the bell, pointed at the left hand. I am really pleased with the results. I did not expect such a smooth, balanced sound with the mics so close. Each player was in the null of the others' mic, and the rejection was good while off-axis coloration is indeed minimal as Rode advertises. Altiverb and Slate VTM are present. I know this makes it harder to judge the character of the mics alone, but I really like both of those processors. I turn off the noise and wow and flutter in VTM, and use the 30ips, 1/2inch 2 track setting. Stays clean, but I like it.

https://youtu.be/srLnaFtwVxY
Old 18th February 2021
  #7
Gear Nut
Hello Grey and son,

FWIW and i'm no authority...please take this with a grain of salt ...

After listening to your links :

There's seems to be some "room modes" around 180 hz to 1.2khz , the oboe piece has the 1.2khz honk .....sax piece sounds like those room tones >380Hz the cello also has those nasty low mids, however, the saxellugue :-) was an improvement for the saxophone actually liked the sound of that sax very smooth....but still struggling with the cello's low mids. It could be position in the room /reflections back into the cello??you don't seem to hear that, i wonder if its because of your monitoring? and, I wouldn't cloud it all with VTM plugins just yet The top end of the recordings sound nice but anything below 1.4 Khz takes away from the enjoyment......I don't think it's the mics....


I'd be interested in what others think too....

Thank you for posting.....

Ray
Old 18th February 2021 | Show parent
  #8
Here for the gear
 
Thanks for the comments. You’re right that the accuracy of my monitoring is limited. Same room limitations that limit the recordings. It’s interesting that you felt the sax was alright as the mic was very close and minimized the room to the greatest degree. With the cello there was still some room interaction, but since it was closer than I normally record him, I also thought it sounded better than "normal." Actually, Altiverb tends to highlight any response problems that I’ve captured; I hear more problems once it’s in the chain... don’t know if that’s odd. It has actually helped me to refine things in recent months. I’m eager to get these mics into a good space; might be a while, though.

I appreciate the feedback. All the best!
Old 19th February 2021
  #9
Lives for gear
 
David Rick's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
In a situation like this, I think it's usually a mistake to try grafting a completely different space onto a recording that already has obvious small room artifacts. I sometimes record cello in my living room with mics at similar distance to what you've used here. I find that it's easier to work with the room sound rather than trying to cover it with something else. I do generally use a GIK acoustic screen to suppress the first reflection from the wall behind me. For mics, I'll sometimes use a M/S rig and adjust the side mic level in post much like one would use a reverb send. In other cases, I've done stereo with an asymmetric pair such as a Schoeps MK41 aimed at the end of the fingerboard and a Beyer M160 augmenting the low strings.

David L. Rick
Seventh String Recording
Old 19th February 2021
  #10
Here for the gear
 
Thank you both, David and Ray, for the feedback. Here is an excerpt from the cello mic without any processing other than dither, normalization, and sample-rate conversion from 96Khz to 48Khz. I did that mainly to get the file size down under the 16mb GS limit. I'm curious if you hear the same issues as you did when VTM and Altiverb were on the track? If nothing else, now you can hear how the TF5 handles the off-axis saxophone, which is in the null of the pattern.
Attached Files

Saxellugue No 1 in C minor Op 209 Cello Mic excerpt.wav (11.22 MB, 825 views)

Old 19th February 2021
  #11
Lives for gear
 
David Rick's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
The Sax leakage sounds good. The resonance I hear is the cello wolf tone which, on your son's instrument seems to happen at E instead of the usual F. The mic placement here is very close to the instrument and hides nothing, though your son's technique is very good indeed. There's no "room compression" to even things out with the mic this close; you might need some hardware compression or careful fader riding as a substitute. I do hear some exaggeration of the bottom strings because of proximity effect and I would actually be tempted to back off another foot or so, but perhaps use gobos to reduce the leakage.
Old 19th February 2021
  #12
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Hi David,

Not quite sure which E you referred to. The only E he played was 10th above the low C string in this clip which had no wolf tone to my ears.


Da-Hong
Old 20th February 2021
  #13
Lives for gear
 
David Rick's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I might have gotten the note wrong, Da-Hong. I had to walk to the other end of the house to check the pitch.
Old 1 week ago
  #14
Here for the gear
Rode in Tony Faulkner Array

Hi
I just purchased the TF5 and in my multimic system it won the contest against Schoeps Mk21 mk 4 and mk22.
It is actually main main mic ORTF in A modified Tony Faulkner Array ORTF AB.
I use them with Shure KSM 141 ok my main tree.
With 2 KSM outtriger,16 Line Audio spots some Schoeps spots as well.
Winds tree is AKG XLS and Some brass spots Rode NT2a . I have in the link a recording from Basel Casino.
I am mostly recording for live streaming live mix orchestra with a lot of channels like here two days ago CMB with Bomsori Kim who just got a Deutsche Grammophon exclusive contract.
So I don't know for how long the link will work.
Anyway TF5 was the sound I was looking for a cardiod version of 4006a... definitely a HOT mic and great for orchestras main Array nothing better in ORTF and I did work a lot with cmc6 mk4...of course for classical music.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HpCb2QWosmI&feature=share
Here the link and you have some nice godfather Rota music as well in this Video
Enjoy
Yours
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #15
Gear Guru
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
musiksaal stadtcasino basel

funny as i get to record/mix/broadcast in this hall as well and i'm mostly using schoeps (for both main and close mics)...

...which imo is further evidence that a) preferences vary and that b) gear doesn't matter, at least not as much as some folks are willing to believe.

anyway, may i ask you what gear you used to mix, where in the house you had your mix position (or was it in an outside truck?) and how long it took you to establish the mix? also, did you use any broadcast processor or did you feed the mix directly into whatever gear was used for getting things onto the net?



p.s. it's called the 'stadtcasino' btw
https://www.stadtcasino-basel.ch/de/
as in recent years, there has also been a much newer casino (which is what the name suggests)...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filsaf ➡️
Hi
I just purchased the TF5 and in my multimic system it won the contest against Schoeps Mk21 mk 4 and mk22.
It is actually main main mic ORTF in A modified Tony Faulkner Array ORTF AB.
I use them with Shure KSM 141 ok my main tree.
With 2 KSM outtriger,16 Line Audio spots some Schoeps spots as well.
Winds tree is AKG XLS and Some brass spots Rode NT2a . I have in the link a recording from Basel Casino.
I am mostly recording for live streaming live mix orchestra with a lot of channels like here two days ago CMB with Bomsori Kim who just got a Deutsche Grammophon exclusive contract.
So I don't know for how long the link will work.
Anyway TF5 was the sound I was looking for a cardiod version of 4006a... definitely a HOT mic and great for orchestras main Array nothing better in ORTF and I did work a lot with cmc6 mk4...of course for classical music.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HpCb2QWosmI&feature=share
Here the link and you have some nice godfather Rota music as well in this Video
Enjoy
Yours

Last edited by deedeeyeah; 1 week ago at 02:28 PM..
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #16
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➡️
funny as i get to record/mix/broadcast in this hall as well and i'm mostly using schoeps (for both main and close mics)...

...which imo is further evidence that a) preferences vary and that b) gear doesn't matter, at least not as much as some folks are willing to believe.

anyway, may i ask you what gear you used to mix, where in the house you had your mix position (or was it in an outside truck?) and how long it took you to establish the mix? also, did you use any broadcast processor or did you feed the mix directly into whatever gear was used for getting things onto the net?



p.s. it's called the 'stadtcasino' btw
https://www.stadtcasino-basel.ch/de/
as in recent years, there has also been a much newer casino (which is what the name suggests)...
Sure
Because I have 7 to 10 am to build myself and a helping hand everything and patch it as well.
I am using QSC Touchmix 30 pro which is perfect for live streaming etc 48k anyway enough 32 bit float native is as well good. I have a lot of preset for my mics and for the different position I am using it for inside of it even the room I am working in like basel.
Got a special preset for it and my mics position etc
So a digital mixer is IMHO the best for this kind of very stressful situation Presets and sound conception and préparation is the key to a good recording.
And like I said I mix live and need to make hardcore decision in the moment when for some reason channels are not working etc.Little time to think and reaction schould be immediate.
And a friendly user digitalmix is a key to success.
Time is of essential good I don't have.
About Schoeps last recording I made there we had 14 Schoeps out of 22 mics and I did not notice it was much better. And to say the truth I am more confortable with the sound of KSM 141 omni than Mk2s...I did a lot of test with a lot of mics.
I studied in Karlsruhe Muho and they have a ton of Schoeps and I know the factory as well in Durlach.
But IMHO I don't think you need an all Schoeps setup to make it sounds great,CM3 line audio for spots woodwinds are great as well,OM1 for piano in some case.
I chose KSM 141 over 2s in my setup because of the sound why pay something 3 times more when you have a similar result with Shure...
Schoeps got great mics don't understand me wrong I like them a lot as well but I prefer to chose for special sound something else.
Rode TF5 vs MK21, Rode for me is much more a hot mic and much more details TF5 got a wide cardioid pattern in the low and got hyper cardioid in the high...with schoeps mk4 and Mk21 the polar stay constant...
So Rode has more life in it,but like I said it is for me and my ears... everyone is right with micing because it is a private reflexion and I don't want to impose my vue opinion at all and I respect everyone mindset
But I think people schould be open-minded with new company like Rode and co and just try things out who knows maybe it will fit and for a fraction of the price.
Voila have a nice weekend end
Fil
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #17
Gear Guru
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Filsaf ➡️
Sure
Because I have 7 to 10 am to build myself and a helping hand everything and patch it as well.
I am using QSC Touchmix 30 pro which is perfect for live streaming etc 48k anyway enough 32 bit float native is as well good. I have a lot of preset for my mics and for the different position I am using it for inside of it even the room I am working in like basel.
Got a special preset for it and my mics position etc
So a digital mixer is IMHO the best for this kind of very stressful situation Presets and sound conception and préparation is the key to a good recording.
And like I said I mix live and need to make hardcore decision in the moment when for some reason channels are not working etc.Little time to think and reaction schould be immediate.
And a friendly user digitalmix is a key to success.
Time is of essential good I don't have.
About Schoeps last recording I made there we had 14 Schoeps out of 22 mics and I did not notice it was much better. And to say the truth I am more confortable with the sound of KSM 141 omni than Mk2s...I did a lot of test with a lot of mics.
I studied in Karlsruhe Muho and they have a ton of Schoeps and I know the factory as well in Durlach.
But IMHO I don't think you need an all Schoeps setup to make it sounds great,CM3 line audio for spots woodwinds are great as well,OM1 for piano in some case.
I chose KSM 141 over 2s in my setup because of the sound why pay something 3 times more when you have a similar result with Shure...
Schoeps got great mics don't understand me wrong I like them a lot as well but I prefer to chose for special sound something else.
Rode TF5 vs MK21, Rode for me is much more a hot mic and much more details TF5 got a wide cardioid pattern in the low and got hyper cardioid in the high...with schoeps mk4 and Mk21 the polar stay constant...
So Rode has more life in it,but like I said it is for me and my ears... everyone is right with micing because it is a private reflexion and I don't want to impose my vue opinion at all and I respect everyone mindset
But I think people schould be open-minded with new company like Rode and co and just try things out who knows maybe it will fit and for a fraction of the price.
Voila have a nice weekend end
Fil
merci bien! i do use a digital desk in those situations as well - wait: in any situation:-) - albeit my desk is way larger than the touchmix and i'm not using any presets as my desk allows for very fast adjustments across multiple channels/buses (by means of temporary ganging of any parameter)...

regarding schoeps vs other mics, i find them better suitable for ridiculously high channel counts (which i'm sometimes using...) but i'm with you that these days, there are excellent and very affordable means - not only in terms of mics - which allow to achieve very decent results!

i'm hardly using omnis for mains though (definitely not in the stadtcasino!) but rather use m/s (mk4v/mk8) and a pair of mk21's or sometimes mk41's (!) for outriggers (and occasionally adding a blm3 for lfe) - the former combination has become my favourite main mic setup if not using double-m/s or soundfield (or then ortf in more simple setups/on smaller ensembles).

oh, and where did you mix? in one of the back rooms, down on the main floor or up on the balcony? - and does all reverb stem from the pickup of mics or is there some revereb from the thouchmix?

anyway, hit me up next time you're at the stadcasino and need a hand (or few mics)!

Last edited by deedeeyeah; 1 week ago at 03:19 PM.. Reason: info added
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #18
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➡️
merci bien! i do use a digital desk in those situations as well - wait: in any situation:-) - albeit my desk is way larger than the touchmix and i'm not using any presets as my desk allows for very fast adjustments across multiple channels/buses (by means of temporary ganging of any parameter)...

regarding schoeps vs other mics, i find them better suitable for ridiculously high channel counts (which i'm sometimes using...) but i'm with you that these days, there are excellent and very affordable means - not only in terms of mics - which allow to achieve very decent results!

i'm hardly using omnis for mains though (definitely not in the stadtcasino!) but rather use m/s (mk4v/mk8) and a pair of mk21's or sometimes mk41's (!) for outriggers (and occasionally adding a blm3 for lfe) - the former combination has become my favourite main mic setup if not using double-m/s or soundfield (or then ortf in more simple setups/on smaller ensembles).

oh, and where did you mix? in one of the back rooms, down on the main floor or up on the balcony? - and does all reverb stem from the pickup of mics or is there some revereb from the thouchmix?

anyway, hit me up next time you're at the stadcasino and need a hand (or few mics)!
FoH in the room need total Control for Livestream livemix.
And yes m/s is a good option as well outtriger Mk21 as well.
ORTF and Big AB 1.5 m - 1m80. But like I said it is working out for me with TF5 and Shure well,other mics I am not sure about channels I had 27 yesterday still manageable for live with grouping etc and good preparation.
But anyway the most important are the hearing and what you do with it, I am normally a string player,I played on Guarneri,Galliano violin from foundation in my study time over a decade ago ,but at the end a new violin suited me better and I gived the violin back.
Mics headphones are just tools the people behind it is more important and what they do with it.
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