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Why are my mixes sounding so different in the car!!
Old 13th February 2009 | Show parent
  #31
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Franco's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
^^Yessur, and I would even go a bit further and recommend more than one pair, since (from my personal experience) I've yet to find a pair that shows me everything (accurate bass response AND accurate mids AND accurate highs). I've got a pair of HD650s, AKG 240M, S and DFs and 7506s and even some HD280s; depending on what I focus on, I use all pairs to check where I don't think my monitors and room are telling me the truth! (not always, realistically, but it's good to know your cans and what areas they can help u with).

I am waiting until there are plenty of the new HD800s to check out, to see if maybe I can settle on one pair as opposed to the many that I've got for my "can" needs.

Last edited by Franco; 13th February 2009 at 12:39 AM.. Reason: HD800s?
Old 13th February 2009 | Show parent
  #32
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E-Irizarry's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicB ➑️
well thats why my suggestion is to start using some good headphones, because I wouldn't trust those monitors.

People wanna hate on headphones, but I swear by it. No I wouldnt compare it to a mix done on a ssl k series with a bunch of outboard gear, BUT I'd rather use my $300 headphones than some $300-400 monitors anyday.
Co-sign!! +1
Old 14th February 2009 | Show parent
  #33
Gear Nut
 
wubbzy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicB ➑️
I suggest the Beyerdynamic DT-770 pro headphone, i use them and I promise you, my sound LEAPED after hearing what I'm supposed to be hearing as opposed to the colored sound I've been used to for 20+ years.

Hey MicB. There are 3 different 770 models. Which one do you have? The pro-80, M-Monitoring, or the pro-250?
Old 14th February 2009 | Show parent
  #34
Lives for gear
 
C Heat's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicB ➑️

I suggest the Beyerdynamic DT-770 pro headphone
Are they comfy MicB?

I suffer 'squashed cartilage' excruciating pain from my last set cans.
Old 14th February 2009 | Show parent
  #35
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
I think theres only one 770pro its balck closed back with grey pads. I don't wear them long enough to have problems, the only isse is stay cool becuz when it gets hot in ur room that sweat will be soaked up by those phones, not the best feelin
Old 14th February 2009 | Show parent
  #36
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
I have only 3 questions that will likely diagnose any of the problems you are facing.


1) Is you room treated with broadband absorption?

2) How much did you spend on your monitoring system?

3) How long have you been mixing?



By answering these quesitons you will have found out why your mix does not translate.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #37
Gear Nut
 
wubbzy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicB ➑️
I think theres only one 770pro its balck closed back with grey pads. I don't wear them long enough to have problems, the only isse is stay cool becuz when it gets hot in ur room that sweat will be soaked up by those phones, not the best feelin

Guitar Center has 3 different versions of the 770. 2 of which are "pro". There's the pro 80 and pro 250
Dt 770 at Guitar Center. | Search Results
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #38
Gear Nut
 
Spy!'s Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by wubbzy ➑️
Guitar Center has 3 different versions of the 770. 2 of which are "pro". There's the pro 80 and pro 250
Dt 770 at Guitar Center. | Search Results
The 80 and 250 refer to the input impedance of the phones. Generally speaking, the higher the impedance the better the quality of the 'sound' that's reproduced. The 'down side' (if you choose to look at it this way) with higher impedance phones is that in order to get the best out of them you need an efficient, high power amp to drive them. In the end, headphones are just speakers (in a convenient enclosure) and all speakers work better with better amps, so if you're going to invest in 'high end/mastering' tier headphones it's best to ensure that your headphone amp is up to the task.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #39
Gear Nut
 
wubbzy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spy! ➑️
The 80 and 250 refer to the input impedance of the phones. Generally speaking, the higher the impedance the better the quality of the 'sound' that's reproduced. The 'down side' (if you choose to look at it this way) with higher impedance phones is that in order to get the best out of them you need an efficient, high power amp to drive them. In the end, headphones are just speakers (in a convenient enclosure) and all speakers work better with better amps, so if you're going to invest in 'high end/mastering' tier headphones it's best to ensure that your headphone amp is up to the task.
Thanks for the info, Spy!! So, in general, should your headphone amp's output be as close to the headphones input impedance as possible?
Here is a situation that I am currently facing... I'm right on the brink of ordering the 770 pro 250s. I am also ordering a Presonus Monitoring Station. The headphone amp on the Presonus is listed as having a maximum output of 150mW/channel @ 60 Ohm load. But being someone that doesn't know what this means, my first thought would be that the Presonus is not putting out enough for the 770s. Please school me, cause I'm quite sure I'm wrong. Thanks!
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #40
Gear Nut
 
BOO BLADES's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Im gonna tell you what was told to me by a pro engineer when i was having that problem...first you have to make sure u have proper sound selection then proper arrangement and song structure...alot of the time what ur hearing on commercial cds is very good sounds that have the majority of the frequencies in them already put together with other good sounds...the arrangement gives the sound room to breathe and be heard...once u have that covered...then u can start dealing with all that other complicated stuff that just makes me say: "if u want that pro sound pay a pro engineer." heh
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #41
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by DivineMusic ➑️
i dont suggest headphones what so ever
work on your acoustics and learn to mix. all b/c you have pro tools doesnt mean much

Having a quick listen on headphones will only help. I've been mixing for years and have a treated room and great loudspeakers - and I still like to hear how it sound through some cans. This is A GOOD TECHNIQUE, not for critical decisions, just briefly for a different perspective. Ipod headphones are always quite useful to have kicking around too
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #42
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
All Grado's are 32ohm, even the $1000 plus GS1000, so don't confuse high impedance with high quality phones. There are other factors involved.
The 80ohm dt770's are generaly the ones people talk about by the way.
Those are the most popular ones, and the ones people refer to as "bass monsters".
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #43
Lives for gear
 
Storyville's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I mix on my near fields, then check it on my nice headphones, then on my sh*tty headphones. I usually mix abit on my sh*tters, and then go back to the near fields.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #44
Lives for gear
 
E.rOk.stA's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco ➑️
^^Yessur, and I would even go a bit further and recommend more than one pair, since (from my personal experience) I've yet to find a pair that shows me everything (accurate bass response AND accurate mids AND accurate highs). I've got a pair of HD650s, AKG 240M, S and DFs and 7506s and even some HD280s; depending on what I focus on, I use all pairs to check where I don't think my monitors and room are telling me the truth! (not always, realistically, but it's good to know your cans and what areas they can help u with).

I am waiting until there are plenty of the new HD800s to check out, to see if maybe I can settle on one pair as opposed to the many that I've got for my "can" needs.
Sorry cuz, if you would just listen to mastered reference CD's, you wouldn't need all those cans. You're just dead wrong on this.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #45
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco ➑️
Listening to "professional CDs" in your monitors as a guide for your mixes?

BAD IDEA in my opinion!.
I learned years ago from multiplatinum engineers and thats how they learned and thats how I learned. Especially when ur room is not optimized and u have no $ for room treatment u need a guide reference. Even when ur room is optimized and u r just starting out u need a guide reference. So what if u match the brightness of the master- less work for mastering engineer to do and mix is exactly how u want it. every producer wants their tracks to sound like what they hear everyday or they r not happy. If u are shopping tracks it better sound like what is being heard everyday or forget it. U will learn basic balances and how not to over eq the bottom. And u will learn alot about ur current monitoring system.

First major label mix I ever did on a dmx movie soundtrack I was in a room that i never worked in before. popped in a reference cd as I was taught and I wound up mixing 2 more songs on that album after they heard the mix.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #46
Gear Nut
 
Spy!'s Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattmaN ➑️
All Grado's are 32ohm, even the $1000 plus GS1000, so don't confuse high impedance with high quality phones. There are other factors involved.
The 80ohm dt770's are generaly the ones people talk about by the way.
Those are the most popular ones, and the ones people refer to as "bass monsters".
For the sake of clarity, I did qualify my statement by saying "Generally speaking" and, although I didn't implicitly state this, I was referring to different versions of the same model.

@ wubbzy: This will, hopefully, help you to understand what I was talking about.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #47
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
damn you know what I don't know which one I got but I know it says "2 x 80 ohm" on both sides under "professional right/left" but it doesn't show it online. You'll have to go to GT and see it in person. I honestly don't know if one is better than the other, but I love mine.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #48
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
btw because you're probably used to bass heavy speakers/phones make sure you start listening to commercial tracks first in those headphones so you can get an idea where your bass/treble levels should be,

when i first got them all my stuff was really bass heavy because I thought I couldnt hear enough bass in the headphones until I put in a lil jon track and realized his bass sounded low in the phones too.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #49
Lives for gear
 
ryst's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor ➑️
Glenn Schick mastering has this kind of setup at their mastering complex:

Scion listening room:
MySpace.com - Glenn Schick Mastering View All Photos - Photo 3 of 70
Actually Glenn has moved a few blocks down to a new building. I don't think the Scion is set up yet. It is a cool spot though. There is a bunch of extra room in the basement and a really cool lounge area with a bar. I just hope they keep the bar.heh
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #50
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicB ➑️
btw because you're probably used to bass heavy speakers/phones make sure you start listening to commercial tracks first in those headphones so you can get an idea where your bass/treble levels should be,

when i first got them all my stuff was really bass heavy because I thought I couldnt hear enough bass in the headphones until I put in a lil jon track and realized his bass sounded low in the phones too.
exactly! apply the same thought process to the monitors is what I was saying.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #51
Gear Addict
 
idlabs's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I think people expect too much too quick sometimes. It's taken me years to get comfortable in front of the speakers and in the cockpit. You really have to commit yourself to the process IMO. It's just something you constantly chip away at. Really learning how to listen is a big part of it I think. Knowing what your hearing when you listen to mixes you like, is the first step in getting there yourself.

Also, as was mentioned, watching an accomplished engineer mix is probably the best thing you can do to help you learn your craft. Just seeing someone go through the process and realizing it's real people making real decisions on all those cds you listen to and admire, can be a huge confidence booster. Just some thoughts
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #52
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by idlabs ➑️
I think people expect too much too quick sometimes. It's taken me years to get comfortable in front of the speakers and in the cockpit. You really have to commit yourself to the process IMO. It's just something you constantly chip away at. Really learning how to listen is a big part of it I think. Knowing what your hearing when you listen to mixes you like, is the first step in getting there yourself.

Also, as was mentioned, watching an accomplished engineer mix is probably the best thing you can do to help you learn your craft. Just seeing someone go through the process and realizing it's real people making real decisions on all those cds you listen to and admire, can be a huge confidence booster. Just some thoughts
thats real talk, if only I could listen to everything on augsbergers I'd be straight
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #53
Gear Maniac
 
shani haider's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Dont miss it!!!

One more thing i wanna add in this thread that i dont believe in bouncing and burning in computer. The sound you are listening through your Monitors is coming from your Sound Card and the sound card has a pair of converters to play the digital sound in an analog form. When you bounce and burn your mix in the computer you actually miss that conversion process which you have been listening through the whole mix session.

Try to bounce your Mix on an external Device. I hope you`ll get the same thing.

Shani.
Old 15th February 2009 | Show parent
  #54
Gear Addict
 
usefullidiot's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Micah Tolentino ➑️
I have only 3 questions that will likely diagnose any of the problems you are facing.


1) Is you room treated with broadband absorption?

2) How much did you spend on your monitoring system?

3) How long have you been mixing?



By answering these quesitons you will have found out why your mix does not translate.
+1

In my opinion its cool to compare to ref cds but what tools do you have to match what your hearing....if your listening to a major release chances are it was recorded mixed etc on great high end gear...if you try to match the brightness of those kinds of recordings using plugins or lowend gear you are going to get a very harsh, 2 dimensional mix very fast.

Why not get the mix levels perfect, get a good bounce with plenty of headroom, find a mastering guy you trust and go listen to him master your track...he will have the high end gear and if your recordings lack highs or lows or whatever he will have the tools to remedy those issues.



Also, the general consensus on this site is that bass traps are the answer to alot of translation issues..there are DIY tips all over the net.
Old 16th February 2009 | Show parent
  #55
Lives for gear
 
e-are's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by usefullidiot ➑️
+1

In my opinion its cool to compare to ref cds but what tools do you have to match what your hearing....if your listening to a major release chances are it was recorded mixed etc on great high end gear...if you try to match the brightness of those kinds of recordings using plugins or lowend gear you are going to get a very harsh, 2 dimensional mix very fast.

Why not get the mix levels perfect, get a good bounce with plenty of headroom, find a mastering guy you trust and go listen to him master your track...he will have the high end gear and if your recordings lack highs or lows or whatever he will have the tools to remedy those issues.



Also, the general consensus on this site is that bass traps are the answer to alot of translation issues..there are DIY tips all over the net.
Exactly. I just had the same problem. My room is small so bass was all over the place. I had plenty of auralex and their so called bass traps ,more like mid traps, but it wasn't that good. Spent like $200.00 and made 4-6 1/2ft. x 2 ft traps. Right now i have 2 in my room, no eq and it sounds pretty good. Haven't analysed it yet but it sounds better than it did. I expect great results when i'm finished.
GET YOUR ROOM TREATED. I can tell already that it's the best thing i've done.
Old 17th February 2009 | Show parent
  #56
Lives for gear
 
E-Irizarry's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
MicB,

To further add, I think that you have to have 20-20 vision cans..**** the price...The price is contingent off of the brandname and possibly if itΒ΄s imported.

Other than that, 20Hz - 20 kHz cans is the way of the walk.
Old 21st February 2009 | Show parent
  #57
Here for the gear
 
🎧 10 years
Hi all - I have a similar problem. Was searching the forum prior to posting my question, then I found this thread.

My mixing room is treated with 14 broadband bass traps (nearly covered all wall surfaces), I have Dynaudio BM-5A monitors, with the matching sub, and I recently purchased and setup the KRK Ergo. I feel like the sound in my room is decent now -much tighter than before. However, I still have issues getting my bass right - it's always an uphill battle. It will sound fine through my monitors, and even in my headphones (Ultrasone proline 750s). But when I play it in my car (which has factory issue 6x9s in the trunk), I often hear the speakers buzzing when the bass notes hit, as if they're being overloaded. I turn the bass down, I filter more low end, and/or clamp down with my Waves C4 multiband, but still can't control the buzzing/resonance. This applies to many different tracks with different bass sounds. None of the commercial CDs I use for reference buzz/resonate in my car - they all sound clean, so it is clearly something I'm missing/doing wrong. Any suggestions?
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