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Slate Raven MTI at NAMM
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #241
Lives for gear
 
Alex Breaux's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jordanvoth ➡️
Could say the same for the 73s you're always selling.
No you can't. You know why? Because the 20 I sold were gone instantly. And because they SOUND great! I forgot to take that off my signature. Big difference between one of the greatest preamp/EQ's in history and a giant ipad.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #242
Lives for gear
 
Alex Breaux's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
I wasn't aware we were having an analogue vs. digital debate. I thought we were having a "mouse vs nice touchscreen for $3500" debate.

My point is that with all the sonics being equal, you will make better sounding records with more intuitive equipment.



Yeah. I definitely prefer the long board. That's 9' 8". I have smaller ones but it's not my thing. I'm definitely in the minority here.



I'm sure there is, but if we're going to talk about over-priced mice, I think expensive cars are perfect examples of getting you from point A to point B in a wasteful way.

If you can appreciate an expensive car, you should be able to appreciate an expensive controller.
A couple others posts were making it lean that way,

Anyways, I could not possibly work on a touch screen the size of two ipads. The mtx is the one that makes sense. But, not at the price.

IMO all it comes down to is a little bit of time possibly saved vs. a mouse. If you could clock somehow the amount of time saved with the MTX vs. a mouse and add it up at the end of the year, I would be completely astonished if the results were earthing. Not to mention the amount of time it will take to LEARN how to use Steven's giant ipad.

Now.. a clasp system... THAT is worth the money. That will make a difference in time AND make your records sound better. Fact.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #243
Gear Guru
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Breaux ➡️

Anyways, I could not possibly work on a touch screen the size of two ipads.
Why do you keep saying "2 iPads"?

I'm sitting in front of a 27" iMac right now and I'm holding an iPad 2. The 27" screen is much bigger than 2 (9.8") iPads. Closer to 4X. I think 27" is perfect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Breaux ➡️
IMO all it comes down to is a little bit of time possibly saved vs. a mouse.
But it's not just time. It's frustration saved as well. When things are hard (like riding three things at once) you tend to not do them. When things are easy, you do. So you'll mix better because it's intuitive and every change will be made quickly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Breaux ➡️
Now.. a clasp system... THAT is worth the money. That will make a difference in time AND make your records sound better. Fact.
How would that make my records sound better than simply recording them to tape and printing to separate tracks on my DAW?

What sound does the CLASP impart?
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #244
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Breaux ➡️
Small list of crap here- 64ch APC1000 with GML automation "was in Sunset Sound's main room from 1988-1999", 8ch Neve S19, 2in 24 trk, 1/4 2 trk, more vintage mics then one could ever need, three bays of mostly vintage outboard, two live rooms, hammond, rhodes, yamaha C3, about 35 different guitars, about 20 different amps, bomb proof PT rig, etc.

t
I have a Mac mini, presonus firebox, a UAD sattelite and a house in the Hollywood Hills, outside of my bit of music gear. That's all I need for the occasional little thing I'll do at home.

The studios I work at foot the bill for the gear and rooms.
I just make money there.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #245
Lives for gear
 
jordanvoth's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Breaux ➡️
No you can't. You know why? Because the 20 I sold were gone instantly. And because they SOUND great! I forgot to take that off my signature. Big difference between one of the greatest preamp/EQ's in history and a giant ipad.
At $3500, if I was still into recording, I would grab an MTI assuming it performs as advertised, THAT remains to be seen.

A less intelligent person would say to your 73's "$4K FOR A MIC PRE? WTF MAN!" but we all know on this forum that the 73 is a pro grade piece of equipment and it goes for that price for a good reason. It's not just any mic pre.

The same less intelligent person would continue referring to the Raven as a giant Ipad. Which Slate himself has come on here several times and discussed what sets this apart from, as you so eloquently describe it as, a giant ipad.

Aside from this, two things that are really getting me...

You have a full blown analog rig, which you've been going on and on about ad nauseum since you showed up here never contributing much to any discussion other than to tell people you have acquired X piece of equipment and how it is way better than anything else. If you are truly an analog only guy why are you showing up in a thread about a controller? You know how many posts of mine you'll find slagging the Endless Analog Clasp? NONE, because I don't use tape and I don't have enough time to rip what seems like a really great piece of gear for certain people. You apparently have enough time to dog a really innovative piece that you obviously have no use for. Which leads me to my second item, have you produced any music with this analog rig of yours? The studio name is Carter Drive right? Is music actually being made with your gear or do you spend all of your time on here telling people that AEA mics are the only good ribbons?
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #246
Lives for gear
 
jordanvoth's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by synergyroom ➡️
Thanks man! send me a PM and I'll say!
The S/T Left Alone record was a top 5 of mine and the last thing Hellcat put out that I enjoyed. Great job, I can hear those snare and bass tones on Three Bottles of Whine in my head now. Takes a good ear to make pokey bass sounds work like that, excellent job.

HUGE to you man.

Kudos.

Pour Habit is cool too, saw them open for No Use a few years back. I have Suiticide laying around somewhere too.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #247
Gear Guru
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jordanvoth ➡️

A less intelligent person would say to your 73's "$4K FOR A MIC PRE? WTF MAN!" but we all know on this forum that the 73 is a pro grade piece of equipment and it goes for that price for a good reason. It's not just any mic pre.
Completely disagree. I've worked with Neve mic pre-amps for most of my career. Probably 20 years by now. I still have a pair of the 1272's that Brent Averill used to sell with original Neve parts. I also have Daking, API, Chandler etc.

The Neve's do not blow away the other mic preamps I have. In fact, they fit in perfectly. And they were all about 1k per channel.

So 4k per channel is completely ridiculous and over-priced IMHO.

(This was a perfect example of something I would normally never say on GS. Just figured you might want to see things from Slate's angle.)
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #248
Lives for gear
 
jordanvoth's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
Completely disagree. I've worked with Neve mic pre-amps for most of my career. Probably 20 years by now. I still have a pair of the 1272's that Brent Averill used to sell with original Neve parts. I also have Daking, API, Chandler etc.

The Neve's do not blow away the other mic preamps I have. In fact, they fit in perfectly. And they were all about 1k per channel.

So 4k per channel is completely ridiculous and over-priced IMHO.

(This was a perfect example of something I would normally never say on GS)
I totally agree with you...

but for the sake of NOT derailing the thread let's assume the 73 is worth 4k.

With the money saved go on a nice trip.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #249
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
WTF with all the analog pissing contests & ignorant/arrogant slagging of a product no one has even tried yet?
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #250
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
That BMW is about 60K.

I drive a Kia Soul which was about 20K.

Care to explain to me what that extra 40k gets you?

Do you see how we each view things differently and have different priorities?

Not saying you shouldn't enjoy your car but I owe my living to workflow.

My car just gets me to the beach.
This isn't an insult to intelligence, but if you have to ask you've not driven one.

Workflow is just a part of the whole picture, there's little people producing at the sonic edge, when people are at that stage then I'd probably start looking at products that speed up the process exponentially. Whether or not someone prefers faders, it shouldn't stop anyone from doing good mix's with a mouse.

There's nothing wrong with being dubious about a product, your claims are just opinion. Mine are also, it's your word against mine and means nothing because circumstances are different.

Product's for me, need to be logical, cost effective and justified 100%.. If it was a complete world class AD / DA interface with preamp's and eq / compressor section then I'd be very interested and it would be worth the cost instantly. A neater Idea would be to control an analogue EQ section and compressor via the MTX or MTI digital interface (Like you do a volume control)..

Cool stuff like that could make it amazing.. A workflow device, nah! I'm happy with a desk or faders.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #251
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
This isn't an insult to intelligence, but if you have to ask you've not driven one.

Workflow is just a part of the whole picture, there's little people producing at the sonic edge, when people are at that stage then I'd probably start looking at products that speed up the process exponentially. Whether or not someone prefers faders, it shouldn't stop anyone from doing good mix's with a mouse.

There's nothing wrong with being dubious about a product, your claims are just opinion. Mine are also, it's your word against mine and means nothing because circumstances are different.

Product's for me, need to be logical, cost effective and justified 100%.. If it was a complete world class AD / DA interface with preamp's and eq / compressor section then I'd be very interested and it would be worth the cost instantly. A neater Idea would be to control an analogue EQ section and compressor via the MTX or MTI digital interface (Like you do a volume control)..

Cool stuff like that could make it amazing.. A workflow device, nah! I'm happy with a desk or faders.
Um, first you talk about mouse mixing.
Now you say you need faders.

What is it?

And what do you do when you run out of inputs and faders?
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #252
Gear Guru
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
This isn't an insult to intelligence, but if you have to ask you've not driven one.
I'm sure it drives like a dream. But you could see how many would call that a luxury? And you're defending that luxury while calling the Raven "crazy" and without "common sense" which would make you appear a tad bit hypocritical. No?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
Whether or not someone prefers faders, it shouldn't stop anyone from doing good mix's with a mouse.
Can you mix with your elbows? I'm sure I could if I had to but I wouldn't expect the same result. For those of us who prefer faders, mixing with a mouse is a PITA. I understand that everyone doesn't feel this way. In fact, I wish I didn't. Mixing with a mouse would definitely be a better way to work. It just doesn't work for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
There's nothing wrong with being dubious about a product, your claims are just opinion. Mine are also, it's your word against mine and means nothing because circumstances are different.
That was my point. That your opinion is your own and that it's not "crazy" for others to look at this as a way of improving the quality of their work. You can't have it both ways. We either have different "opinions" or one of us is crazy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
Product's for me, need to be logical, cost effective and justified 100%..
I don't see how your BMW fits into that criteria but you do. And that's just dandy. For you!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
If it was a complete world class AD / DA interface with preamp's and eq / compressor section then I'd be very interested and it would be worth the cost instantly. A neater Idea would be to control an analogue EQ section and compressor via the MTX or MTI digital interface (Like you do a volume control)..
And again. You have different preferences and priorities than other people. Great. Let's just not assume that we all feel the same way. OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
Cool stuff like that could make it amazing.. A workflow device, nah! I'm happy with a desk or faders.
And you have that option.

All the best.
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #253
Lives for gear
 
ionian's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henchman ➡️

And what do you do when you run out of inputs and faders?
That's when you detune two oscillators...

Ok, ok...kidding, but I couldn't control myself...


Regards,
Frank
Old 27th February 2013 | Show parent
  #254
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Breaux ➡️
No you can't. You know why? Because the 20 I sold were gone instantly. And because they SOUND great! I forgot to take that off my signature. Big difference between one of the greatest preamp/EQ's in history and a giant ipad.
That's some big words coming from someone who's experience is mostly in buying and selling gear.
Certainly not based in years working professionally as a recording engineer/producer.
Old 27th February 2013
  #255
Slate Pro Audio / Slate Digital
 
Steven Slate's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Hi folks, we've been doing clinics in London and have shown the RAVEN MTX and MTi to many pro audio engineers here, so you'll start to hear some real world feedback. The clinics have been really terrific and it's been wonderful meeting the faces behind the virtual handles!

New videos with new features coming soon.

Cheers,
Steven
Old 28th February 2013
  #256
Lives for gear
 
Audio Child's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Im one of those that attended Slates Raven demonstration today!
The MTI is a solid unit in my mind which i feel will implement into my workflow neatly!
The system was responsive enough for my fiddly fingers!
Was also good to get an in depth run down on all the slate plugs today too!

Thank you Steven & the Slate team!
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #257
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henchman ➡️
Um, first you talk about mouse mixing.
Now you say you need faders.

What is it?

And what do you do when you run out of inputs and faders?
Sorry, I can't take you seriously enough to give a straight answer!.
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #258
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 6ccb844 ➡️
Sorry, I can't take you seriously enough to give a straight answer!.
That's good.
The feeling is mutual.

Fact remains, you can't answer the question, as you don't have an answer that makes sense.
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #259
Lives for gear
 
T_R_S's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
I love mixing on a surface vs a trackball - way faster so much more instant feedback with meters/post/switches/fader is front of you. Instant & Fast.
The only concerns is plug-in control and mixer configuration as every single session/song is going to be different as Pro Tools (or any DAW) has a GUI that is single control at a time. Slate has his own multitouch interface. What about multitouch 3rd party PI's?
I see Slate PI's work multitouch but what about everything else non-slate?
And if they have to programmed special what happens when the PI sets upgraded? What Happens when PT/DAW/Mac OS gets a minor/major update?
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #260
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henchman ➡️
That's good.
The feeling is mutual.

Fact remains, you can't answer the question, as you don't have an answer that makes sense.
It's a simple answer, but until your willing to converse like and adult and drop the pretentious act then were not going to get very far. So I don't see the point..
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #261
Gear Guru
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio Child ➡️
Im one of those that attended Slates Raven demonstration today!
The MTI is a solid unit in my mind which i feel will implement into my workflow neatly!
The system was responsive enough for my fiddly fingers!
Was also good to get an in depth run down on all the slate plugs today too!

Thank you Steven & the Slate team!
What do you mix with now?

Does this replace real faders for you?
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #262
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 6ccb844 ➡️
It's a simple answer, but until your willing to converse like and adult and drop the pretentious act then were not going to get very far. So I don't see the point..
Pretentious?

I asked you a simple question.
What happens when you run out of faders?

Also, I stand by what I said before.
Mouse mixing is for amateurs.
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #263
Gear Guru
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henchman ➡️
Mouse mixing is for amateurs.
OK. I'll bite.

What does this mean?

Do you think it's impossible for someone (not you) to mix with a mouse as well as with faders?
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #264
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henchman ➡️
Pretentious?

I asked you a simple question.
What happens when you run out of faders?

Also, I stand by what I said before.
Mouse mixing is for amateurs.
That's a general sweeping statement, which is not necessarily true. Calling people like Pensado and amateur? !? Seriously!..

Myself, I use a 24 channel mixer (With midi sends for busses).. If I spill over I'll either buss or use a mouse.. In the world of pop / rock and metal it's usually never been a big issue.

Done some orchestral work, which made screen scrolling in conjunction with a desk horrible. But that sort of thing isn't common.. It's dependant on a person's needs.
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #265
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
OK. I'll bite.

What does this mean?

Do you think it's impossible for someone (not you) to mix with a mouse as well as with faders?
It's the same as trying to speed skate using figure skating skates.
Pure and simple.


Having done a ton of mixing in music and post, I know that there are simply things that an be achieved much faster and edgantly by riding faders and sends.

And we arent even talk about setting up a monitor mix quickly using a mouse.
Old 28th February 2013
  #266
Lives for gear
 
8 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
"Whatever your preference is ... that sucks." ... Is how I read half of everything in this thread.

Some people will buy and love this thing. Others won't. The "correct" method is whatever suits each of us best. End of story (wishful thinking).
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #267
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by T_R_S ➡️
I love mixing on a surface vs a trackball - way faster so much more instant feedback with meters/post/switches/fader is front of you. Instant & Fast.
The only concerns is plug-in control and mixer configuration as every single session/song is going to be different as Pro Tools (or any DAW) has a GUI that is single control at a time. Slate has his own multitouch interface. What about multitouch 3rd party PI's?
I see Slate PI's work multitouch but what about everything else non-slate?
And if they have to programmed special what happens when the PI sets upgraded? What Happens when PT/DAW/Mac OS gets a minor/major update?
If I remember correctly, when I saw and played with the Raven MTI at NAMM, plug-ins were NOT multi-touch. You could only move one parameter at a time on a plug-in. I think this was true of Slate plug-ins as well? Maybe Slate has fixed that issue.
Old 28th February 2013 | Show parent
  #268
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
That's a general sweeping statement, which is not necessarily true. Calling people like Pensado and amateur? !? Seriously!..

.
dave pensado | Verahouse Studios

See that thing that Pensado is sitting behind?
The one with all the knobby twiddly bits?

It's a console.
Old 28th February 2013
  #269
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I don't care how fast you think you are with a mouse.
I guarantee you I can set up an monitor mix faster by flipping the faders, and adjusting the levels, than going one knob at a time.

A lets no even pretend that using a Lise even comes close to using a professional control surface. And when you add the Icons custom fader options to that, well, there's just simply no comparison.
Old 28th February 2013
  #270
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Ok to summarise and get to the point, obviously this is my personal preference. It would be nice if it can do more, e.g.'s are control of analogue EQ section and compressors with a full AD / DA suite / pre-amps electronically controlled. Also bring down the price, I wouldn't put it past someone to do all that for half the price in the future if the idea catches on. (Probably Behringer )

I can see the benefit's, I never said it's a bad product. But still stick with my initial statement, if "Personally" yet again I had to choose between an existing desk / control surface / mouse or departing with 3.5K or 17K.. Then it makes sense for me not to spend that money.

Simple PEACE!..
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