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NAMM: Kawai VPC1 Virtual Piano Controller
Old 9th February 2013
  #181
Manufacturer contact @ GS
 
Grahamdwc's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I just want to publicly thank James for his continued presence here!

Cheers,
Graham
Old 9th February 2013 | Show parent
  #182
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hi Georg,

Thank you for your considerate post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by laughingbear ➡️
For a long time now I wish that "we" could have a direct impact in the design of such a high end controller, in other words before production kicks in and the product is delivered to the distributors.

I do believe this would have been a mutally beneficial exercise, increasing sales and customer satisfaction at the same time.
Yes, I wholeheartedly agree. I personally would love to see manufactures such as Kawai be more open about the creation process, and seek feedback from potential users. However, this is simply not possible, for a number of reasons. I know that in the past Kawai has shown 'in development' models to dealers and professional musicians at trade shows such as NAMM and Musikmesse. However, these are usually prototypes that are already pretty far into the development process, and tucked away in a special room.

Quote:
Originally Posted by laughingbear ➡️
The space around my main input keyboard is precious, very precious, as I do not wish to have a totally cluttered space, but at the same time need my most important control devices in reach at all times.
May I ask what kind of control devices you're referring to?

Quote:
Originally Posted by laughingbear ➡️
If you let us know the precise curvage and distances, perhaps there is a cheap way to have a top designed made of high end mouse mat material, antislip etc. Perhaps three or four, which then would cover the entire top if required.
I think that's a pretty good idea. I have an illustration of the side profile showing sizes/angles etc. However, I'm afraid this kind of material is confidential, and not something that I'm prepared to post on a public forum. I hope you can understand.

Thanks again for your considerate post.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 9th February 2013 | Show parent
  #183
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hi laddie.music2,

Quote:
Originally Posted by laddie.music2 ➡️
That curved top is a deal breaker for me,
I use it to put my typing keyboard on for DAW and mouse as well...
Remember that only the front part is slightly curved. A keyboard and mouse should sit on the flat area without any problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by laddie.music2 ➡️
It's amazing that majority of people have a problem with this, you watch... this product fails...
you know political polls?.... this reminds me how politicians ignore the polls... lose the race, never heard from again.
If the VPC1 had appeared at NAMM as a work-in-progress prototype, 6 months or so before production, I might be inclined to agree with you. However, as noted above, the board is already complete and in the process of being shipped to dealers, ahead of the start of sales later this month. As for your analogy with politicians, the fact that you are able to read this reply suggests that you're not being ignored.

Quote:
Originally Posted by laddie.music2 ➡️
I want to remind KAWAI that yes this is a piano controller, WITHOUT SOUNDS... it is intended to trigger a laptop or desktop, people who tend to do that like to put their keyboards / laptops / mouses on top as they are normally in front of their computer. And... sometimes they like to also use their 'main controller of choice' to use a variety of libraries...
May I therefore remind you that you still can do all of these things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by laddie.music2 ➡️
NO OFFENSE KAWAI, we are the customer, WE ARE AND ALWAYS WILL BE CORRECT
No offence taken. The customer is often right, I agree. However, unfortunately the customer is also not always aware of the details.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 9th February 2013 | Show parent
  #184
Lives for gear
 
teamsterjim's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawai James ➡️
However, I am curious though, purely on a personal level (i.e. nothing to do with Kawai) - how much would you expect to pay for a bespoke pitchbend/modulation wheel accessory?
Cheers,
James x
I use Exp Pedals and Foot Switches, but then again I perform live and have to use both hands.
Changing articulations in Kontakt is a simple FSW for me. Aftertouch replaces PBend and adds Vibrato/Modulation, and ExpPed is for ganging Drawbars, so I won't miss the add ons.
I'd much rather see a Ribbon Controller or Joystick than the 50 year old Teething Rings we refer to as ModWh and PBend.....

Jeez, people whine about wooden keys and great action, they get it, then they whine about no wheels.......you can't get no respect.....
Old 9th February 2013 | Show parent
  #185
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grahamdwc ➡️
I just want to publicly thank James for his continued presence here!
Thanks Graham!

Certainly a very vocal community here...

Anyway, back to the football...

Cheers,
James
x
Old 9th February 2013 | Show parent
  #186
Lives for gear
 
mirrorboy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawai James ➡️
No, I'm afraid not.

In the six or so years that I have worked for Kawai, I am not aware of a product that has seen such a considerable hardware revision after a board had been launched. Adding pitchbend and modulation wheels would require the left cheekblock to be remodelled, and possibly even widened...then the board wouldn't be symmetrical, so you'd need to widen the right cheekblock also...then new top covers would need to be machined etc. It would be an expensive undertaking.



I apologise if I somehow gave you the impression that we were actively seeking feedback with a view to changing the product before launch. The fact of the matter is that the VPC1 units shown at the Kawai and Synthogy booths at NAMM were production models, not early prototypes - the board is complete, and ready to ship.

Your feedback is welcome and greatly appreciated, however as noted above, the VPC1 - in its current generation, at least - is not going to change.



It's not a strategy. Just a guy who works for a company, answering questions in his free time about a product he's closely involved with.

Cheers,
James
x
It's all good James.

I'd like to apologize, as well. I actually did think you guys were looking for feedback.

Had I known otherwise, I probably wouldn't have posted at all.

Thanks for the honesty & sincerity.

Cheers,

Scott
Old 10th February 2013
  #187
Lives for gear
 
dbjp's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Mirrorboy, our posts are very important for future releases! Just with less aggression.
Let's keep telling James what we think so that, as he says, he'll pass on the info to the r&d department!

James, you coming to Tokyo to show the VPC1 off at an event or something?
Old 10th February 2013 | Show parent
  #188
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbjp ➡️
James, you coming to Tokyo to show the VPC1 off at an event or something?
I'd love to! Do you know of any keyboard exhibitions coming up?

I've attended the 'gakki fair' (at Yokohama Pacifico) a few times, but Kawai's presence there is typically focussed on acoustic pianos or home-oriented digital pianos.

Unfortunately, despite models such as the MP6/MP10 proving popular overseas, these stage-oriented instruments are not marketed aggressively domestically. I expect that the VPC1 will be even more of a harder-sell for traditionally minded acoustic piano sales staff ('where's the sound?' etc.), which is a shame because I believe the virtual instrument market is very strong in Japan.

If Kawai was to show the VPC1 at a Tokyo synth/keyboard exhibition, I expect it would be demo'd by the R&D guys or domestic sales, rather than a non-Japanese employee such as myself.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 10th February 2013 | Show parent
  #189
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
my posts are directed at Kawai not James...

tis why I say "kawai' not james,

just sayin, i've seen these beautiful products come and go,

good news that a keyboard mouse might work, from the looks of that picture with jordan rudess and the ipad i'm not so sure, look forward to seeing it in person.

i vaguely remember another similar product coming and going by kawai about 10 years ago, proper hammer action, inbuilt piano sounds, wooden keys...

Chris Martin from coldplay used to use it, anyways, I think it had a mod wheel, would be ironic if my memory serves as it wasn't designed to be a controller, it was a digital portable stage piano.
Old 10th February 2013 | Show parent
  #190
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by laddie.music2 ➡️
i vaguely remember another similar product coming and going by kawai about 10 years ago, proper hammer action, inbuilt piano sounds, wooden keys...

Chris Martin from coldplay used to use it, anyways, I think it had a mod wheel, would be ironic if my memory serves as it wasn't designed to be a controller, it was a digital portable stage piano.
Probably an MP9000:

Coldplay’s Kawai Cutdown |

This was the original MP stage piano, which was later replaced by the MP9500, then MP8, MP8II, and now MP10. The MP10 shares many similarities with the VPC1.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 11th February 2013
  #191
Sky
Lives for gear
 
Sky's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawai James ➡️
I'd love to! Do you know of any keyboard exhibitions coming up?

I've attended the 'gakki fair' (at Yokohama Pacifico) a few times, but Kawai's presence there is typically focussed on acoustic pianos or home-oriented digital pianos.

Unfortunately, despite models such as the MP6/MP10 proving popular overseas, these stage-oriented instruments are not marketed aggressively domestically. I expect that the VPC1 will be even more of a harder-sell for traditionally minded acoustic piano sales staff ('where's the sound?' etc.), which is a shame because I believe the virtual instrument market is very strong in Japan.

If Kawai was to show the VPC1 at a Tokyo synth/keyboard exhibition, I expect it would be demo'd by the R&D guys or domestic sales, rather than a non-Japanese employee such as myself.

Cheers,
James
x
MP6/MP10 were on my short list when I bought my RD700NX. What took Kawai out of the running was no demos or stock available in a major city when I was shopping. It sounds like a tough marketing sell for a product like this that sits somewhere in between the specialty piano stores and big box music stores.
Old 11th February 2013
  #192
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Sky, the MP6/MP10 are available in some big-box stores, however they are unfortunately much harder to find than equivalent boards from Roland or Yamaha.

There are a number of reasons for this policy, however based in Japan, I'm not really in the best position to understand the details fully, and even then, I doubt it's something that can be discussed on a public forum.

What I will say, however, is despite their limited visibility in high street chain stores, the MP10/MP6 are very popular boards among the online retailers.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 13th February 2013 | Show parent
  #193
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Mac Compatibility?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital Fury ➡️
I see at the download section of Kawai VPC - A virtual piano controller from a real piano company. that no software for Mac OS X is provided.

When will this be available?

Edit: I'm talking about the VPC editor, it's Windows-only on your site.
James,

First, I'm excited for this product and hope it's a success - at least enough to prove this sort of controller is viable and worthy of an update and/or competition.

I haven't seen a reply to the above post yet. I'm very curious myself about Mac compatibility. And with all the rants, I'm surprised this hasn't been a big topic. More than anything else, a software controller has to WORK with my computer and software.

So, are there plans to make a VPC editor for the Mac OS? And is the lack of a Mac OS driver on the downloads page evidence that USB over MIDI won't work on Mac OS or that it's not needed?


I also see a lot of comments about form over function and I agree. A flat top would have been much better, but it's not a deal breaker for me. On the lack of other controls, I'd rather have a second keyboard with springy keys, aftertouch, mod and pitch, expression, etc, for organ, synth, EP, etc. Playing realistic piano action is only realistic for piano IMHO. But, it would be a lot easier to think about where I'd put that second keyboard if the VPC had a flat top...
Old 13th February 2013
  #194
Lives for gear
 
dbjp's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I would imagine USB over midi will work 100% on macs. That's a given.
As for the editor, it would be nice to have, and they should hopefully be developing it, but at the same time, is it that big a deal for a controller like the VPC1?
Old 13th February 2013 | Show parent
  #195
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Question: Does the VPC Editor support Mac OS?
Answer: No, the VPC Editor does not currently support Mac OS.

So wanna play this piano but OSX support is a must for me. I hope the editor will soon be available (IOS support as well). Downloadable in Mac App store would be nice extra.

[off topic]More companies should release their applications thru the App Stores because it is much easier for everyone involved. One click and users know if all their application are up to date, One click and users download all the apps on new and multiple systems without the need for backups, One account in stead of multiple, No more serial nonsense etc etc. The list continues. Even marketing wise its better for companies to release there applications like this.[/off topic]

Suggestions for mod wheels on a piano. Hell no! I rather see a flat surface and options to different colours that step away from the common classical look. I would pay extra for a busted vintage looking paint job. hehheh
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #196
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hi josephmoore,

Quote:
Originally Posted by josephmoore ➡️
First, I'm excited for this product and hope it's a success - at least enough to prove this sort of controller is viable and worthy of an update and/or competition.
Thank you for your positive comments!

Quote:
Originally Posted by josephmoore ➡️
I haven't seen a reply to the above post yet. I'm very curious myself about Mac compatibility. And with all the rants, I'm surprised this hasn't been a big topic. More than anything else, a software controller has to WORK with my computer and software.
I've tried to cover this point in the 'Q&A' section of the website:

Quote:
Originally Posted by VPC website
Q: Does the VPC Editor support Mac OS?
A: No, the VPC Editor does not currently support Mac OS.

Q: I'm a Mac user – does this mean that I cannot use the VPC1?
A: No, the VPC1 will still perform beautifully as a virtual piano controller with your Mac using standard MIDI or USB connectivity – just like the MP10, MP6, and other Kawai digital pianos. Moreover, you can still take advantage of the pre-loaded 'Approved Touch Curves' by selecting the desired memory from the VPC1 itself. However, it will not be possible to make changes to internal touch curves, velocity offsets, or adjust the VPC1's advanced MIDI settings.
I hope this is clear.


Quote:
Originally Posted by josephmoore ➡️
So, are there plans to make a VPC editor for the Mac OS?
We acknowledge that Mac users would appreciate a version of the VPC Editor software for OS X, and certainly hope to realise this goal in the near future. However, currently the VPC Editor software is Windows only.

Quote:
Originally Posted by josephmoore ➡️
And is the lack of a Mac OS driver on the downloads page evidence that USB over MIDI won't work on Mac OS or that it's not needed?
Both standard MIDI and USB-MIDI will work correctly on a Mac. In the latter case, OS X will use the USB-MIDI driver included with the operating system. Actually, the same is true for Windows, however the Kawai USB-MIDI driver is required in order for the VPC1 to communicate with the VPC Editor software.

Quote:
Originally Posted by josephmoore ➡️
I also see a lot of comments about form over function and I agree. A flat top would have been much better, but it's not a deal breaker for me. On the lack of other controls, I'd rather have a second keyboard with springy keys, aftertouch, mod and pitch, expression, etc, for organ, synth, EP, etc. Playing realistic piano action is only realistic for piano IMHO. But, it would be a lot easier to think about where I'd put that second keyboard if the VPC had a flat top...
I appreciate your point, however I maintain that most - if not all - secondary controller boards will happily sit on top of the VPC1 - despite the slight curve at the front.

Thank you once again for your comments.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #197
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hi dbjp,

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbjp ➡️
I would imagine USB over midi will work 100% on macs. That's a given.
Yes, that's correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbjp ➡️
As for the editor, it would be nice to have, and they should hopefully be developing it, but at the same time, is it that big a deal for a controller like the VPC1?
The VPC Editor can be useful for tweaking the internal touch curves (although this shouldn't really be necessary), or creating touch curves for new software. It also allows individual key velocity offsets to be defined, and custom MIDI channel/routing. It's certainly not required in order to enjoy the VPC1 as a high quality control, however I can obviously understand why certain users will find it useful.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #198
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jswitch ➡️
Question: Does the VPC Editor support Mac OS?
Answer: No, the VPC Editor does not currently support Mac OS.

So wanna play this piano but OSX support is a must for me.
Just to clarify once again, the VPC1 can still be used as a controller under Mac OS, even without the VPC Editor software.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jswitch ➡️
I hope the editor will soon be available (IOS support as well). Downloadable in Mac App store would be nice extra.
Well, let's try and get OS X compatibility sealed first...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jswitch ➡️
Suggestions for mod wheels on a piano. Hell no! I rather see a flat surface and options to different colours that step away from the common classical look. I would pay extra for a busted vintage looking paint job. hehheh
Custom paint jobs, a la Vintage Vibe, would be very sweet.
A 'Nord red' version would also hit the spot.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 14th February 2013
  #199
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
I do admit it looks too curved for anything flat to sit on there properly. If I wanted to put my interface on there, it would rock back and forth and be unstable. It should be completely flat.

The designer obviously thought about things being able to sit on the piano, but made the mistake of making it curved, not to mention it's a controller, but there is no mod or pitch wheel.

Just saying.

Other than that, it's pretty perfect.
Old 14th February 2013
  #200
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Destaana, just out of interest, may I ask what kind of interface you are using? Does it have rubber pads/cushions on the underside?

If not, something like these will do the job of keeping your interface stable, preventing it from slipping around, while protecting the VPC1's top surface from scratching.



As for the lack of pitchbend/modulation wheel, the VPC1 is primarily intended as a piano controller. If you require a pitchbend/modulation wheel for synth-style playing, it's recommended that you combine the VPC1 with a small secondary keyboard with semi-weighted/non-weighted keys that are more geared towards those playing techniques.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 14th February 2013
  #201
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hello James

I use a Profire 610. I'm assuming if I wanted to sit it on the curved bit, even with rubber pads, it would still rock because of the my interface is completely flat.

I am a little let down about the mod/pitch wheel absence, but I'd get a small midi controller to sit on the top, though I would have to asign the knobs manually.

I am thinking of getting this. I currently have an M-Audio 88es and I quite sick of it. It always skips a lot of velocity layers and I have to bash the crap out of it to get the highest velocities, as well as play the lightest possible to get the low velocities. I would like something more piano like to sit below my monitor.

I'm from Australia and I asked Kawai if they woudl be distributing it here, but unfortunately there is not enough demand for the product as I expected because the market and competition is much bigger over in the US and UK. I'm guessing ordering it from the US is the only option and I do hope they are shipping the VPC1 here because I tried to buy an MP6 from the US, but they do not ship to AUS.

Thanks!
Old 14th February 2013
  #202
Lives for gear
 
nickelironsteel's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Answer: No, the VPC Editor does not currently support Mac OS.

just lost a customer.
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #203
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawai James ➡️
If not, something like these will do the job of keeping your interface stable, preventing it from slipping around, while protecting the VPC1's top surface from scratching.



Cheers,
James
x
I really appreciate James' participation here, but this defense about the curved top is getting offensive to me - major turnoff. Every photo shows the top to be quite curved - my god, the main product shot shows a small laptop teetering on the sloped top! Those thin rubber pads are not going to steady my 15" MacBook Pro - there would still be some metal on metal - as if I'd stick rubber feet on my laptop! Stop trying to convince us this top is designed to set other hardware on top. Sure a controller with tall rubber feet could sit there, but couldn't the slope make it slide forward under some vigorous playing?
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #204
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hi Destaana, thanks for your reply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Destaana ➡️
I use a Profire 610. I'm assuming if I wanted to sit it on the curved bit, even with rubber pads, it would still rock because of the my interface is completely flat.
The Profire 610 appears to have rubber feet - at least it does in the image below:


I believe those feet would keep the interface stable on top of the VPC1.

The shot below shows a Novation Nocturn sitting on top of the VPC1. The rubber/foam pads on the bottom were pretty slim, however the Nocturn didn't rock.



Regarding distribution in Australia, my colleagues in Sydney received a query via their facebook page asking this point. I believe the official line is that they have no immediate plans, but that they're keeping an on the situation. There was a good deal of interest in the VPC1 at NAMM, so I'm hopeful that it won't be too long before the decision is made to bring this board to Australia. Similarly, the situation here in Japan is also 'evolving' as they say...so fingers crossed I'll finally get a chance to use my 5% employee discount. Woot!

Cheers,
James
x
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #205
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by abernathy ➡️
I really appreciate James' participation here, but this defense about the curved top is getting offensive to me - major turnoff.
abernathy, well, it's obviously not my intention to offend anyone. I'm just trying to offer some easy, inexpensive solutions to what some individuals have pre-judged (without actually seeing the board in person...) to be a major 'deal breaker' issue.

Is the top surface completely flat? No.
Is there a slight curve at the front? Yes.

Again, I come back to this point that many consumers purchased the MP10 purely for use with virtual pianos because they knew it had the most realistic keyboard action in a slab-type board. The MP10 top surface has plenty of knobs, buttons, and faders which many of those folks never use, yet even with this control panel, they still find space for a QWERTY keyboard and a mouse...nobody complains.

Now the VPC1 comes on the scene. Better action than the MP10, improved connectivity, developed purely for virtual pianos, completely clutter-free top surface, more compact, $650 cheaper, and drop-dead gorgeous design. The result? Folks get hung-up about a slight curvature at the front.

Honestly, I challenge anyone here to see and play the VPC1 in person - feel how great the keyboard action is with their own hands, then turn around and say "Yeah, okay, it's the best action I've ever played, and I've been looking for a dedicated piano controller for Ivory for the past three years...but nah, I'm not gonna buy it because my audio interface may not sit completely flat."

Quote:
Originally Posted by abernathy ➡️
Those thin rubber pads are not going to steady my 15" MacBook Pro - there would still be some metal on metal - as if I'd stick rubber feet on my laptop!
If you're not happy about putting your MBP on top, then don't. Use a proper laptop stand, or leave it on your desk.

Cheers,
James
x
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #206
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Every desktop unit should have rubber feet. If it doesn't is not build properly.
I've had units that were not fully flat and didn't had rubber feet. It sucks.

Metal on metal will scratch but metal on wood and wood on wood as well. So complaining that you're laptop or the piano will scratch is a little stupid don't you think?
So the conclusion: Yes the VPC could have a flat surface but you would still need rubber feet not to damage it.

Again thank you James for participating on the forum.
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #207
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jswitch ➡️
Again thank you James for participating on the forum.
No worries.

Thank you for speaking sense.
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #208
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Hey James

I see how it would sit now, thanks.

The picture looks very sexy!

Is there a release date, or has that not been announced yet?
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #209
Lives for gear
 
dbjp's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawai James ➡️
I'd love to! Do you know of any keyboard exhibitions coming up?

Cheers,
James
x
Sorry, the only one I ever go to is InterBee in Chiba. Don't know if there's any such thing in Tokyo. Maybe small-ish events inside music stores?
Old 14th February 2013 | Show parent
  #210
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destaana ➡️
Is there a release date, or has that not been announced yet?
End of this month in the US, early next month in Europe. Australia, again, no immediate plans but I'm hopeful that this will change by Musikmesse in April. Availability in all other counties will depend on the distributor in that country.

Cheers,
James
x
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