Solid State Logic unveils the UF8 Advanced Studio DAW Controller - Page 2 - Gearspace.com
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Solid State Logic unveils the UF8 Advanced Studio DAW Controller
Old 4th February 2021
  #31
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🎧 15 years
For those using Logic, check the video at 23:40, and see how through Logic's six User PROGRAMMABLE Modes, it's possible to use the LEARN function so that you can freely assign the VPOTS (pan) to control any parameter of a plugin, thus creating a custom hardware controller for say SSL's ch strip plugin.
Old 4th February 2021
  #32
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🎧 5 years
At 999, for a mere 8 channel controller, this is overpriced, seriously. But hey, gotta pay for that SSL name.

How anyone finds this reasonably priced is beyond me.
Old 4th February 2021
  #33
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andreschoettler's Avatar
SOLO, CUT, SEL, left close to the Fader ??
That means, sometimes you accidentally moving a fader while trying to reach the buttons.

This exactly happens in the official SSL presentation video:
Starting a 08:50
https://youtu.be/D1PKMbOWJTA?t=530

Anyway good controller !!
Old 4th February 2021
  #34
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sakamoto's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
"mouse scroll emulation" Why knob is on wrong side of controller?

Considering that most people are right-handed is strange design decision. Every time you hover the mouse over a parameter, you have to release your hand from mouse to change this parameter using the knob. Especially if you move the mouse across the screen quickly this can be tiring. I use NOB CONTROL and fits perfectly into workflow. Left hand on controller right hand on mouse. Simple and effective.

Overall I still think UF8 it's a cool controller.
Great job SSL
Old 4th February 2021
  #35
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Avantmidi's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Very Happy with my custom Nucleus 1! That looks more premium than this more consumer like unit..
This new 8 channel is good for some. cascaded it looks silly with all those double features per unit
Attached Thumbnails
Solid State Logic unveils the UF8 Advanced Studio DAW Controller-analog-mix-rig.jpg  
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #36
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jindrich ➡️
If you ran a business, you'd realize for such a setup you'd have to release THREE products rather than one (L, C, R) where 90% of people would just buy the 8ch version and you'll end up with an stock of the LEFT and CENTER, which means valuable resources destined to unprofitable products.
If you'd release just a 24ch version, very few would be able to afford it and many people would ask for the 8ch, etc, only 10% of customers would buy the 24ch, while some other would ask for a 32ch version, others for a 16ch, etc.

Any Project Manager knows this stuff.

On the other hand, some those redundant buttons can be assigned to other functions, etc.
Actually, this would be achievable if you were to follow ROLI's modular concept.

In this case a UF8 would consist of three parts; two side bars and a centerpiece, all connected via a custom connector. To extend a fader set simply unplug appropriate sides and connect both center pieces together.

The software has simply to reflect this concept and distinguish USB daisy chains and expansions connected on the sides. Expanded centerpieces could then be recognized as one single unit, e.g., representing 16 or 24 faders, and USB chains would follow current implemented design.

Would be awesome.
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #37
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by crille_mannen ➡️
Why can't they just release say a 8ch (or even single channel) of an SSL strip. Eq, compressor, fader without the FX routing. Sure Softube has one but it would be so cool to have say 4-8ch of the original layout.

Is there really a market for another faderpack? I'm sure it's a fine product but so boring and uninspiring
Something to work with Brainworx SSL channel strips (and their other consoles). Ecosystem like Softube’s Console 1 perhaps?
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #38
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BobMaloogalooga's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreschoettler ➡️
SOLO, CUT, SEL, left close to the Fader ??
That means, sometimes you accidentally moving a fader while trying to reach the buttons.

This exactly happens in the official SSL presentation video:
Starting a 08:50
https://youtu.be/D1PKMbOWJTA?t=530
Haha had to watch twice, very true
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #39
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aves ➡️
one shall not underestimate the power of the control knob. I am a very happy user of "the nob". and even always liked that feature in audience interfaces. To have this all in one place is nice. though its a bit weird to have to pay that for all the extensions. would have been nice to have an extender instead of having to buy the same thing 4 times with stuff you only need once.
Otherwise it doesn't say behringer or avid and would be nicer to look at standing the whole day in front of my face. .
No transport though.
But I like it.
Thinking about pulling the trigger on "the nob" for use with Logic. Does the mouse hover feature really work?

Kind of an extravagant purchase but it's just so beautiful!
Old 4th February 2021
  #40
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djwaxxy's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
it looks nice but cant believe they havent included a dedicated transport..price wise its what i was expecting your paying for the ssl badge and quality but having no transport controls is a massive error..
Old 4th February 2021
  #41
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doughnuts's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
on the video the voiceover guy says you can map 43 shortcuts to the device. If you buy additional UF8's does that expand the number of shortcuts? if you had 2 UF8s would that give you 86 keyboard shortcuts?
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #42
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A SiX with a built-in interface is all I want.
Old 4th February 2021
  #43
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🎧 10 years
Thank you SSL for providing us with more affordable gear than in the past. But why don't you ask us what WE the customers would like to see before you develop and release something by trial an error?

No flattened edge on the front side? Really?

No dedicated EQ and compressor section similar to digital mixers or console 1?

Switches, so close to the faders, that you accidentally push them? Really?

Quote Chris Lord Alge: everybody is too safe these days.

Next time take some risks and try something new that others DON'T do!
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #44
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🎧 10 years
That would have driven up manufacturing prices considerably and as we see in this thread people are already complaining that it costs too much, and I personally doubt that many people are prepared to spend a couple of thousand dollars for 16 or 24 faders. The larger market is the bedroom producer.

I suspect this is a very good build quality (unlike most of the controllers I've touched) and it's probably priced well for what you get and what it costs to manufacture. But I haven't touched it so I'm just trusting to SSL's traditional standard of quality.
Old 4th February 2021
  #45
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Lupez's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Is Nucleus discontinued?

Quote:
Originally Posted by andreschoettler ➡️
SOLO, CUT, SEL, left close to the Fader ??
That means, sometimes you accidentally moving a fader while trying to reach the buttons.

This exactly happens in the official SSL presentation video:
Starting a 08:50
https://youtu.be/D1PKMbOWJTA?t=530
First thing I noticed too. Being a long time Nucleus user this new controller feels cramped. But hey, for the price it's very good. I hope SSL comes out in the near future with a bigger version for the more advanced user, something equivalent to the S3, with transport. Those big STOP PLAY REC buttons on the Nucleus feel incomparable to me.
AND a dedicated master section for Sigma, please.
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #46
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toitoy's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jindrich ➡️
If you ran a business, you'd realize for such a setup you'd have to release THREE products rather than one (L, C, R) where 90% of people would just buy the 8ch version and you'll end up with an stock of the LEFT and CENTER, which means valuable resources destined to unprofitable products.
If you'd release just a 24ch version, very few would be able to afford it and many people would ask for the 8ch, etc, only 10% of customers would buy the 24ch, while some other would ask for a 32ch version, others for a 16ch, etc.

Any Project Manager knows this stuff.

On the other hand, some those redundant buttons can be assigned to other functions, etc.
There was no need to write so much words about obvious things, don't underestimate other people intelligence.

The point of the image was to show how super thoughtful this DAW controller could be if SSL made the button sides parts optional, I'm sure it would sell better and all 8/24/32ch customers would be much happier because they save table space and don't pay for parts they don't need. Look how much people understood and liked that picture.
Old 4th February 2021
  #47
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trock's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I think its cool SSL did this, its been a long time since we had a new control surface

I have had the full suite of eucon controllers and also down to the Behringer line, also back in the day the MCU stuff

anyway, I really think in the end you should have 2 products, one that DOES have a full setup of Transport controls and programmable buttons, the scroll wheel etc. and then these, or a scaled back Fader Pack

I also like a master fader on one. the euphonic or avid ones were great with a controller unit and then a fader pack unit, the Behringer ones as well, where it had the controller one and fader pack ones

but its a nice looking unit and I am sure well built. for me though, I wouldn't want to spend the same amount on lining up units for the 24 faders I have now plus a master, I would pay extra for a master controller one, and then less to add 8 faders as I needed

Last edited by trock; 4th February 2021 at 08:35 PM..
Old 4th February 2021
  #48
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27 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Is it hardware MCU emulation or software MCU emulation? It seems to be a lot of software needed so it can be either.
Old 4th February 2021
  #49
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🎧 5 years
Intrigued! But:
+1 on control knob not being on left so you can mouse and control at same time - doesn't make much sense to me. I'd end up putting a track pad on the left side which is a little goofy.

Why not 10 faders?

Is there a mode where you can control 'x position' send level on all 8 faders, similar to softube C1F?

Realistically the auto plugin parameter mapping won't get used because some plugins have 50+ params (i.e. most modern eqs). Maybe manual mapping of common plugs. If only the big knob was on the left...
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #50
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stealthbalance's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
What has happened to SSL ?
Nucleus 1 showed much promise for mixing.
This one is just so wrong ... even visually it’s pathetic ...sad.
Old 4th February 2021
  #51
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Is it that expensive?

I remember spending around £700 on the Euphonix MC Mix 12 years ago.

Factor in inflation and hopefully this is much better build quality and you might not be far off?
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #52
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charlieclouser's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] ➡️
I have Stop/Play/Cycle permanently on the 3 Quick Control keys in the top left.
Never find myself with the need for a rewind or Fast Forward buttons.
Jim - This looks like a great product that maximizes the MCU protocol for use with Logic. Nicely done! I appreciate the ability to use the User Keys function to determine a custom set of V-Pot assignments for certain plugins.

BUT.... It seems that this requires a bit of manual fiddling (which is okay) but also requires the user to determine (and remember) which User Key slot is set up for which plugin. For users with a zillion plugins, some of which are used only occasionally this could tax one's memory.

SO.... I wonder if it would be possible to implement a feature I've been hounding any maker of MCU controllers since forever: "Show / Hide Plug-In Parameter". Many plugins have so many parameters that when they spill across the 8 V-pots, you've got to bank/scroll back and forth to access the ones you want, like when filter cutoff is on page 2, pot 3, but filter envelope depth is on page 4, pot 7. Similarly, when using an EQ plugin you might want to just ignore some of the parameters to view / edit a condensed set of parameters quickly.

If we had a Show / Hide Plug-In Parameter function, it could be accessed when viewing parameters spilled across the V-Pots by holding a modifier key and pressing the V-Pot for the parameter you wish to hide. That parameter would disappear and all parameters to the right would move to the left by one slot, and Hide mode would be enable for that plugin. That way you could pull up a plug-in and quickly Hide the parameters you don't want to see.

Ideally the settings for Show / Hide would be active for all instances of that plug-in, and remembered across loading different DAW projects and computer restarts, and even more ideally, the list of Hidden parameters would be remembered so that one can switch between the long and short lists of displayed parameters without having the Show / Hide list erased each time you return to Show All mode.

It would probably require the use of two modifier keys - one to toggle Show / Hide Parameters mode for the currently selected plugin; and another to toggle the Show / Hide status of a parameter by pressing its V-Pot. So, to un-hide a parameter one would press key #1 to exit Hide mode, navigate to the desired parameter using the arrow keys, hold key #2 and press the V-Pot for that parameter.

ANOTHER feature that many users would appreciate - Simple MIDI CC Mode aka "Dumb Mode". This would be a mode, perhaps accessed by using one of the three DAW profile slots as opposed to a sub-mode within a DAW profile, that would switch the UF8 into a "dumb" MIDI controller that just generates MIDI Continuous Controllers from the faders and v-pots, with no two-way communication and simple user-definable labels for each control. The assignment of MIDI CC assignments, high/low range limits, and labels would be done within the SSL 360 app. Then the user could swap between full MCU operation and "dumb mode" quickly using a front-panel key combination, since one is rarely trying to use both modes at once. Switch to Dumb Mode to perform software instruments and record MIDI CC performance controls into the current MIDI track, then switch back to MCU mode to return to full automated mixing control. It might be necessary to use a different virtual MIDI port when in Dumb Mode so that the DAW doesn't see the incoming MIDI CC data as MCU data. As it stands, many users (myself included) have an MCU controller sitting next to an 8-fader dumb controller box (like a Peavy PC-1600 or JL Cooper FaderMaster Pro), but the two are never used simultaneously. Being able to switch the UF8 from MCU to Dumb Mode on the fly would save desk space.. and money!

For me you already have a winner with this product, but adding these two features would really take the MCU protocol to the next level.

Last edited by charlieclouser; 4th February 2021 at 07:28 PM..
Old 4th February 2021
  #53
Deleted f17722d
Guest
Price seems reasonable if the faders are quiet and better quality than the Behringer and Mackie equivalent. I love the bang for buck and ergonomics of the Behringher X-Touch units but the faders are noisy garbage and the protocol implementation results in nasty chattering constantly. Nucleus is well worth the money for a used unit for the high end faders alone.

I concur with the complaints about where solo, mute buttons are placed on this new unit, and lack of a proper large transport section is inadvisable. They've taken too many pages from the Avid S3 design playbook here, pages that should have been torn out and burned in my view.

Also, I'm surprised to see SSL pushing Logic Pro integration so heavily in the promo video, because no doubt to SSL's continuing frustration, Logic insists on the fader range of mixer channel faders arbitrarily maxing out at +6dB above unity, while the physical SSL fader here goes to +12dB. The result of this will be the same as on my SSL Nucleus in Logic: I have half an inch of "do nothing" fader space at the top of the range because Logic's fader hit its ceiling at +6. Do they have a "Logic" mode for this new device altering the Fader scale, or is a user preference setting for fader range in Logic on the horizon that SSL knows about and we do not? One can hope.

Finally, for the love of god SSL, give us a channelstrip control section to run your SSL Native channelstrip. This should have been on Nucleus V2 - it's high time for a Nucleus that ditches the monitor section, the preamps, and the interface (which most in the market for a good quality, fairly expensive control surface already possess in bespoke units), and instead builds in a Softube Console 1 style controller. If Nucleus V1 or V2 had looked like that it would have been an absolute hit, and you'd have sold far more of your $329 USD channelstrip plugins to boot. It's simply not a viable workflow to be paging through plugin parameters when you could be simply reaching for a dedicated knob - this is one thing Softube Console 1 gets right.

Last edited by Deleted f17722d; 4th February 2021 at 07:33 PM..
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #54
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Progmatic-Studios's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I don’t see a lot of differences between this new SSL controller and the Icon QCon Pro G2 (except for the displays)
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #55
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Does it work with Sigma ?
Old 4th February 2021
  #56
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🎧 15 years
Cool!
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #57
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Its over 6" wider than an Avid S1

4 of these are over 2 feet wider than Avid S1's
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #58
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mu:zines's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlieclouser ➡️
SO.... I wonder if it would be possible to implement a feature I've been hounding any maker of MCU controllers since forever: "Show / Hide Plug-In Parameter".

If we had a Show / Hide Plug-In Parameter function, it could be accessed when viewing parameters spilled across the V-Pots by holding a modifier key and pressing the V-Pot for the parameter you wish to hide. That parameter would disappear and all parameters to the right would move to the left by one slot, and Hide mode would be enable for that plugin. That way you could pull up a plug-in and quickly Hide the parameters you don't want to see.
As far as we know, this controller is using the MCU protocol. Unfortunately, a controller can't easily do what you want, based on the MCU protocol.

As I think you know already, the proper way to handle this on a plugin-by-plugin basis is to use Logic's CSParameterOrder files to re-order the parameters you want. I do this to bring up a consistent layout of synth parameters for all my synth plugins (eg osc controls in the top row of 8, filter controls in the second row, amp/filter envelope on the fourth row etc). I generally use 32 controls for plugins. You can reorder and hide parameters at will in these files, and Logic will respect this and make the parameters available to the control surface accordingly.

However, this can't be done dynamically. You can't get a controller just to "ignore" a few parameters and shuffle the next ones down - it just doesn't work like that. MCU controllers are quite dumb - they just send MIDI commands to Logic, and receive display, metering and button status updates. Logic maintains the state, and Logic presents the plugin parameters available for editing. While it would be *technically possible* to parse the display updates and hide certain parameters dynamically (ie pretend they are not there), you can't easily "shuffle" the parameters down, or make Vpot6 control a parameter that would be controlled by a parameter which is currently in the next page of 8 parameters - the control surface does not get a list of all the parameters, it just gets a display of the current 8, that's it.

Now, while there is a way to improve a bit on that behaviour (I don't want to get too technical, because I am implementing some of these things in my own intelligent solutions using the MCU protocol), so it can be fudged a bit in two specific ways, neither of which are optimal - it's still not really practical to do this how you want to do it (dynamically, on the controller), due to the limitations and design of the MCU protocol.

At least editing the CSParameterOrder is quick with a decent text editor, and only needs to be done once for any plugin you want to change the order, and from that point it's a set and forget thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlieclouser ➡️
ANOTHER feature that many users would appreciate - Simple MIDI CC Mode aka "Dumb Mode".
You can basically implement this on any MCU device already, given appropriate buttons to use. Just use one of the User modes, and you can map the controls to anything you want, or transform the incoming MIDI from the controls using other means.

Edit: Just been watching the video. It is basically a physically modern MCU, and works in more or less the same identical way to the original - plus the layer modes (essentially virtual controllers working on different ports).
Old 4th February 2021 | Show parent
  #59
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charlieclouser's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by mu:zines ➡️
As far as we know, this controller is using the MCU protocol. Unfortunately, a controller can't easily do what you want, based on the MCU protocol.
Aw man, that sucks. I thought there would be a way to have the UF8 tell itself, "make V-Pot #6 impersonate V-Pot #22 " or something, and use the app and the unit's memory to configure, store, and recall those Show / Hide lists.

The problem lies more with the plug-in developers, who create too-comprehensive lists of parameters that are reported to the control surface, but often don't arrange their order in the list in a sensible way. That's why we see things like the entire mod matrix spilling across a dozen pages, or filter cutoff on page 3 while filter envelopes are on page 9 or whatever. Who's going to edit mod matrix assignments from a V-Pot? Nobody, that's who. I guess I'll just have to grit my teeth and dive into the CSParameterOrder files. Ooof.

My desire for a Show / Hide Parameters feature is admittedly an attempt to repair the damage done by plugin developers who are inattentive or in a hurry, but a boy can dream.

I'd hope that the second feature I requested, aka "Dumb Mode", could be easily accomplished though, as one of the Behringer X-Touch models does this I think. I think that Trevor Morris somehow managed to get an app (Bidule maybe?) to intercept what's coming out of his Avid S3 and re-purpose 8 of its 16 faders to operate as dumb CC controls. So if that's possible with a EuCon controller it should be a doddle with a "real MIDI" controller like the UF8. That one's not a deal-breaker by any means, but would be a huge convenience for those who like a minimalist desk surface, or would rather not pay $900 for a dumb box like the JL Cooper FaderMaster Pro.
Old 4th February 2021
  #60
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SWAN808's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
a nice looking dust collector
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