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Nuendo: Video Compensation for audio plugins delay
Old 22nd January 2009
  #1
Gear Maniac
 
gundam's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Nuendo: Video Compensation for audio plugins delay

I know PT does not automatically compensate if you insert plugins on audio tracks while working with video. I searched on the Nuendo.com website but there seem to be no clear answer on this, some people reporting that it compensates but not doing so with very long delay (more than 5000 samples).

Now, I know you can't see sound faster than the video rate for the most part but I'd like to know if Nuendo has this feature.
Old 22nd January 2009
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Jesse Peterson's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Yes

Though I've never run into a delay past 5000ms. Nuendo basically does all the work for you. Whatever the max delay due to processing is, you'll experience that delay between hitting play, and hearing sound. Everything else in your sessions including video and your cursor, stays in relative sync. I think this feature can be disabled, and is on by default. The system also takes this delay into consideration when you're writing automation, it will automatically apply what you did at the moment to what you were hearing at the moment, regardless of how many plugs you have open or what kind of delay is being compensated.
Old 22nd January 2009
  #3
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by gundam ➑️
I know PT does not automatically compensate if you insert plugins on audio tracks while working with video....
It seems that you are mixing two things together: the plugin latency compensation, and the video card delay compensation setting.

Nuendo automatically compensates for plugins on audio tracks unless you switch the "constrain delay compensation" button on. This happens regardless of video being present in the project. Nuendo compensates by reading the audio early by the number of samples the plugins will be delaying it. This is why you cannot compensate for plugins on live inputs (ie. microphone feed).

For video cards running with the Quicktime engine there is a setting for reading the video early by x number of frames to compensate for the latency of the card and/or display (LCD, Plasma display or projector).
Old 22nd January 2009
  #4
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Etch-A-Sketch's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by gundam ➑️
I know PT does not automatically compensate if you insert plugins on audio tracks while working with video.
I'm 99.9999999% sure it does. I do it all the time. Maybe you are trying to use PTLE? PTLE doesn't, but PTHD does a great job of delay compensation, including plugins, bussing (a must for the way I mix films!), hardware inserts and so on.
Old 22nd January 2009 | Show parent
  #5
Gear Maniac
 
gundam's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Thanks Jesse - so you're saying that Nuendo nudges the audio tracks back by the delay introduced by the plugin(s), all in the background even though the tracks visually look in their position. This way, video would stay fixed and audio tracks nudged to sync to picture.

Thing I'm asking is, I'm gonna score some music for picture and I'm interested in this feature since I love and use UAD plugs which have quite some delay due to the card I/O, plus outboard gear. Currently using PT, which doesn't have plugin delay compensation in relation to video. This feature alone could be enough to make me switch to Nuendo.

Steven - apologies if I didn't explain myself clearly enough. I would play the video on my main screen so I would not use any additional card or firewire interface.
Old 22nd January 2009 | Show parent
  #6
Gear Maniac
 
gundam's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Etch-A-Sketch ➑️
I'm 99.9999999% sure it does. I do it all the time. Maybe you are trying to use PTLE? PTLE doesn't, but PTHD does a great job of delay compensation, including plugins, bussing (a must for the way I mix films!), hardware inserts and so on.
Yes, I would be using PTLE with DV Toolkit. I understand PTHD has delay compensation but it basically nudges the tracks with less delay FORWARD in order to line up all the tracks, no? If you have a 5000 sample plugin like some restoration one, you would have that track late to picture by 5000 samples. So, is PTHD actually nudging tracks backward to have everything in sync to video?
Old 22nd January 2009 | Show parent
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Etch-A-Sketch's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by gundam ➑️
Yes, I would be using PTLE with DV Toolkit. I understand PTHD has delay compensation but it basically nudges the tracks with less delay FORWARD in order to line up all the tracks, no? If you have a 5000 sample plugin like some restoration one, you would have that track late to picture by 5000 samples. So, is PTHD actually nudging tracks backward to have everything in sync to video?
PTHD introduces a delay on all each track to match the one track that has the highest amount of delay. It isn't moving anything earlier, only later. With PTHD you can also ADD a user specified amount of delay per track as well. There is a finite limit to how much ADC in PTHD can do and it's based on how much RAM is on the PTHD cards. I believe it's 4096 samples (I don't have PT open right now to check). So, a plugin with 5000 samples of delay would be slightly out of delay compensation range (by 4 samples... If you put a user defined 4 sample delay across all tracks (in the ADC section on the mixer window) in addition to the 4096 ADC is doing to try and match them, then everything should be in sync.

But yeah, it's kind of a moot point if you are using PTLE. PTLE only has plugin delay compensation based on buffer size, not ADC. So while it might be able to line up all the audio if your buffer is big enough, I don't think the video will get delayed to line up.
Old 23rd January 2009 | Show parent
  #8
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neilwilkes's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by gundam ➑️
Thanks Jesse - so you're saying that Nuendo nudges the audio tracks back by the delay introduced by the plugin(s), all in the background even though the tracks visually look in their position. This way, video would stay fixed and audio tracks nudged to sync to picture.

Thing I'm asking is, I'm gonna score some music for picture and I'm interested in this feature since I love and use UAD plugs which have quite some delay due to the card I/O, plus outboard gear. Currently using PT, which doesn't have plugin delay compensation in relation to video. This feature alone could be enough to make me switch to Nuendo.

Steven - apologies if I didn't explain myself clearly enough. I would play the video on my main screen so I would not use any additional card or firewire interface.
Nuendo will compensate fully for the UAD cards.
Your Audio & Video will remain in sync.
Where you might need the video compensation mentioned earlier is if you are using the Quicktime engine & outputting via the graphics card as opposed to with the internal player. Maintaining sync will not be an issue for you.
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #9
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Hmmm..


Does Logic compensate for this too when working with video?
Old 27th January 2009 | Show parent
  #10
Lives for gear
 
huub's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Hmm, try inserting 2 ik t-racks3 and see if your picture still looks sync
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