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De-essing without using a de esser
Old 8th September 2012
  #1
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
De-essing without using a de esser

i would like some tips on how to

1. record with less s sounds via mic technique
2. when mixing how to lessen s sounds without a de-esser.

the reason why i want not to use a de-esser is because they mess with the dynamics and original attack of the source. its a noticeable difference.
Old 8th September 2012
  #2
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Get an EQ and boost a few dB and where you hear the ess you narrow the q and drop a few dB. But an multiband comp would be ideal
Old 8th September 2012
  #3
Manufacturer contact @ GS
 
Grahamdwc's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Hi LaoTzu,
Check out this tutorial:

Techniques For Vocal De-essing

Hope it helps,
Graham
Old 8th September 2012
  #4
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
i just want to know if its just me that hears this difference in signal degredation when a de esser is used.
Old 8th September 2012
  #5
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Nobody had de-essers before the late 1960s!

First and foremost it's about microphone choice. Teach the singer to turn slightly off-mike or pass their hand in front of their mouth during esses and pops. Sometimes just singing across the face of the mike works. A quiet studio and greater distance from the mike reduces (often eliminates) the amount of compression needed significantly and the amount of esses and pops with it.
Old 8th September 2012
  #6
Gear Head
 
CappuCCino's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
The best way is to manually make cuts around all separate eS's and pull 'm down a few dB.
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #7
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by CappuCCino ➑️
The best way is to manually make cuts around all separate eS's and pull 'm down a few dB.
that sounds like a lengthy process.
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #8
Lives for gear
 
tehlord's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by CappuCCino ➑️
The best way is to manually make cuts around all separate eS's and pull 'm down a few dB.

yup

It takes about 20 minutes to go through the whole track, but is a better fix than anything else I've come across.
Old 8th September 2012
  #9
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
how do you make cuts without it popping from one cut to the next. its something cubase seems to do.
Old 8th September 2012
  #10
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
John Lennon used to "flash" his esses while he was tracking. You wave your hand quickly in front of your mouth when you are singing an s sound. Very quickly of course. And only one flash per s...

You can also try to make your esses sound more like a z.

As far as editing the goes. If the offending "S" is at the beginning or end of a word/phrase, you can just cut and draw a fade in/out over it to subdue it a bit. Or you can use automation. There's a lot of ways to tame the wayward s, but the best way is to handle it on the way in. But I don't have any problem with a de-esser, if the track needs it.
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #11
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
how do you make cuts without it popping from one cut to the next. its something cubase seems to do.
I don't make cuts, I just draw in volume automation. No clicks/pops that way.
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghosted ➑️
I don't make cuts, I just draw in volume automation. No clicks/pops that way.
much obliged that makes sense.
Old 8th September 2012
  #13
Gear Addict
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Only if the editor in Studio One was an automation editor as well . . . . this will take a while.
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #14
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunjji ➑️
Only if the editor in Studio One was an automation editor as well . . . . this will take a while.
explain what you mean i currently use cubase 6.5 im thinking of moving to studio one so please do explain
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #15
Gear Addict
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
explain what you mean i currently use cubase 6.5 im thinking of moving to studio one so please do explain
Oh, it is not a huge deal, but you can not edit automation in the edit window, you must use the arrangement window. It is a little annoying because I will usually never cut something out, just turn it down and I have to use the project page which is kind of distracting (you have other tracks and all that transport stuff, it just makes it harder to focus on editing the automation). Other than this, I am really happy with Studio One.
Old 8th September 2012 | Show parent
  #16
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunjji ➑️
Oh, it is not a huge deal, but you can not edit automation in the edit window, you must use the arrangement window. It is a little annoying because I will usually never cut something out, just turn it down and I have to use the project page which is kind of distracting (you have other tracks and all that transport stuff, it just makes it harder to focus on editing the automation). Other than this, I am really happy with Studio One.
make a feature request to them im sure this bugs a few others too
Old 9th September 2012
  #17
Gear Maniac
 
AndreBenoit's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
There's a sound on sound review of some sE mic's that mentioned using an elastic band to hold a pencil vertically against the centre of the grill. I'm trying to find a link now, I just remember the quote "don't ask me why it works but it does"....I can't for the life of me think which mic's I was after a review of when it came up!


EDIT: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug0...elecz3300a.htm found it!!

Andre
Old 9th September 2012
  #18
Here for the gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by donpakka ➑️
John Lennon used to "flash" his esses while he was tracking. You wave your hand quickly in front of your mouth when you are singing an s sound. Very quickly of course. And only one flash per s...
Beat me to it.
Old 9th September 2012 | Show parent
  #19
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson ➑️
Nobody had de-essers before the late 1960s!

First and foremost it's about microphone choice. Teach the singer to turn slightly off-mike or pass their hand in front of their mouth during esses and pops. Sometimes just singing across the face of the mike works. A quiet studio and greater distance from the mike reduces (often eliminates) the amount of compression needed significantly and the amount of esses and pops with it.
i have a nt2a rode. and an se ribbon mic
Old 9th September 2012
  #20
Lives for gear
 
play/record's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
May sound like a no-brainer, but be conscious of not over pronouncing the sounds that cause sibilance.
Back off the mike, turn away a little bit if necessary.
Compression can accentuate sibilance, especially if the release is too slow.
The high freq of the vocal's reverb will cause it also.
I find cutting the reverb at around 5 to 6k and above cleans the S up quite a bit.

Also, any sibilance in the mix will get pumped up by the final limiting.
If you are going to crush the final mix, try backing off on the vocal compressor a little.
Old 9th September 2012
  #21
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
i would like proof of this flashing technique to go on words alone isnt enough
Old 9th September 2012 | Show parent
  #22
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghosted ➑️
I just draw in volume automation. No clicks/pops that way.


I find this to be the best way. Highlight > pull down
Old 10th September 2012
  #23
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
i was told by a freind to use the de-esser on the reverb does this work?
Old 10th September 2012
  #24
Lives for gear
 
BillSimpkins's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Sing "S"s with your tongue against your bottom teeth (against the top teeth usually creates sibilance problems). This also helps with keeping air flow more continuous and may help with vocal fatigue.
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