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DMG x AFX : ODDSound MTS-ESP Microtuning System
Old 29th March 2021
  #1
Here for the gear
 
Software DMG x AFX : ODDSound MTS-ESP Microtuning System

Hi, Oli, Damon and Dave (ODDSound / DMGAudio) here. We have a new thing for you which we hope you will find exciting! :D
  • A new computer music technology, MTS-ESP, sets notes completely free. MTS-ESP challenges the dominance of western tuning, giving global cultures tools to compose in traditional local tunings whilst extending the possibilities for all.
  • MTS-ESP allows for fresh creative approaches to musical composition, enabling electronic musicians to define and change pitch at any moment even whilst notes are playing.
  • Independent developers collaborate to empower musicians to access alternative tunings.

"You now have 63,050,394,783,186,944-128 more frequencies to play with" - Richard D James

Four years ago we started discussing the current state of tuning in electronic music making with Richard James (Aphex Twin). Support and standards were patchy at best and none allowed anything but a single, fixed tuning table to be used locally per instrument. The only hardware technology that challenged it was the rarely seen MTS (MIDI Tuning Standard) Single Note Change message, but nothing could send it so it couldn’t be utilized. We realized that leveraging it would enable hardware dynamic microtuning - the ability to change the tuning of notes or chords in real time during a composition. However there was no software equivalent, so we made it. We call it MTS-ESP and it allows plug-ins to read from a single, global tuning table, updating in real-time.

Plug-ins that natively support MTS-ESP need no setup, just load them into a session with an MTS-ESP master plug-in, set the tuning and start composing. Grab the free MTS-ESP Mini plug-in to see this in action. The MTS-ESP Suite extends the possibility for dynamic tuning to other plugins and hardware devices too. Hardware devices that support MTS Bulk and Single Note SysEx messages integrate particularly well, as do those that support MPE too. The process of tuning your studio, which may have taken hours before, is now reduced to seconds and with so much more creative potential.

Several intrepid developers already support MTS-ESP and there are more to follow. When used with MTS-ESP, plug-ins listed on this page will automatically be in tune with each other; no more loading TUN or SCL files and discovering everyone has a different implementation! If there's a company you'd like to see support MTS-ESP send them an e-mail and point them to our Dev Page. Integration is simple and typically takes less than half an hour.

ODDSound & Richard James would like to thank the forward-looking companies listed below for making this one of the fastest adoptions of a music technology ever.
  • Audio Damage (Continua, Phosphor, Quanta)
  • Audiorealism (ReDominator)
  • CWITec (TX16Wx)
  • DMGAudio (EQuilibrium, PitchFunk)
  • Expert Sleepers (Silent Way)
  • HY-Plugins (HY-Poly)
  • Modartt (Pianoteq)
  • Soundyan (Interstellar Waterphone)
  • Surge (Surge)
  • TAL (TAL-Sampler)
  • U-He (Hive 2)
  • Xfer Records (Serum)

The ODDSound MTS-ESP Suite is available now at oddsound.com for £79.99 (GBP).
The ODDSound MTS Mini plugin is available now at oddsound.com for free.
Old 29th March 2021
  #2
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
This looks AMAZING. I have been searching high and low to find the right way of tuning my songs. Was enjoying the Bitwig micro tuning device, but it is limited to one octave. Most DAWs don't even deal with this (save cubase and logic) and this looks even more flexible than the current solutions.
Very exciting stuff.
Old 29th March 2021
  #3
Gear Nut
 
vsignet's Avatar
This feels like a breakthrough. Best news in a long while. I needed to read it twice, it seemed almost too good to be true.

Thanks so much for this effort! I will email various developers and try to convince them to implement this.

Old 29th March 2021
  #4
Gear Head
how does tuning with an eq work exactly ? Does it just boost the right freq en lowers the rest ?

Is anybody able to get this to work ?

I downloaded the free version and all i get is 0 devices connected. How do you connect a device ? What daws does this plugin even support ?

There might be a fault in the manual or i might be reading it wrong.

"MTS-ESP Mini is an MTS-ESP master plugin. It provides a free and simple way to start using the MTS-ESP microtuningsystem. It can load commonly used tuning

MTS-ESP Mini is an instrument plugin and must be loaded into an instrument track or synth slot in a DAW. It does nothowever produce any sound. It’s only function is to supply tuning information to the MTS-ESP system.
"
This kinda confused me im not sure if there should be another mini plugin for individual tracks ?

Im not getting a demo license either am i the only one ?
Old 29th March 2021
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Conundra's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Some EQs can accept midi input that can transpose the eqs response in real time. A bit like a key tracked filter on a synth.
Old 29th March 2021 | Show parent
  #6
Here for the gear
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakaman121 ➡️
how does tuning with an eq work exactly ? Does it just boost the right freq en lowers the rest ?

Is anybody able to get this to work ?

I downloaded the free version and all i get is 0 devices connected. How do you connect a device ? What daws does this plugin even support ?

There might be a fault in the manual or i might be reading it wrong.

"MTS-ESP Mini is an MTS-ESP master plugin. It provides a free and simple way to start using the MTS-ESP microtuningsystem. It can load commonly used tuning

MTS-ESP Mini is an instrument plugin and must be loaded into an instrument track or synth slot in a DAW. It does nothowever produce any sound. It’s only function is to supply tuning information to the MTS-ESP system.
"
This kinda confused me im not sure if there should be another mini plugin for individual tracks ?

Im not getting a demo license either am i the only one ?
Hey,

Load the latest version of a plugin from this page: https://oddsound.com/usingmtsesp.php and they'll pop right up as connected.

EQuilibrium will follow input note pitch. You can play notes to shift it up and down. Set it up with resonators, blast noise through, and it's wild.

Dave.

P.S. drop us an email about demo license and we'll figure out what's going on there.
Old 29th March 2021
  #7
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Looking forward to seeing how this might be able to work with Melodyne also...seeing as it supposedly can use .scl files?
That would be amazing
Old 29th March 2021 | Show parent
  #8
Here for the gear
 
You would be best served by using the MIDI Client and retuning Melodyne via MPE. Then you've got full dynamic microtuning for Melodyne.
Old 29th March 2021
  #10
Lives for gear
 
LASTLAVGH's Avatar
Is Hermode tuning a possibility with this tech?
Old 29th March 2021 | Show parent
  #11
Here for the gear
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LASTLAVGH ➡️
Is Hermode tuning a possibility with this tech?
We don't implement Hermode tuning, but in theory it would be possible to create a master plugin that does. The MTS-ESP library is available to do so, it's just licensing for Hermode code that would be needed.
Old 29th March 2021 | Show parent
  #12
Lives for gear
 
LASTLAVGH's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ODDSound ➡️
We don't implement Hermode tuning, but in theory it would be possible to create a master plugin that does. The MTS-ESP library is available to do so, it's just licensing for Hermode code that would be needed.
Okay interesting.
Hermode is one of those things that I really wish were implemented more widely, it really sounds amazing. Logic has it built in but it doesn't work with the majority of 3rd party VIs, unfortunately.
Old 29th March 2021 | Show parent
  #13
Here for the gear
 
It's not the only system of its kind, here's another similar one I bookmarked, given a couple of rainy days I might have a go at implementing - https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ic_microtuning
Old 29th March 2021
  #14
Gear Maniac
 
Mr Phil's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
I am embarrassed to say that I can’t figure out what this is/does.
Old 29th March 2021
  #15
Sky
Lives for gear
 
Sky's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
I can imagine that Jacob Collier will really enjoy this. He's been noted for dancing between microtunings in his performances.

I had to look up Hermode tuning that lastlavgh mentions above. The two videos in this link that compare chamber performance with Hermode and Equal Temperament are insightful imho.

While Hermode is not specifically implemented yet, MTS is exciting technology imho.

http://www.hermode.com/index_en.html

Sky
Old 29th March 2021 | Show parent
  #16
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by ODDSound ➡️
Hey,

Load the latest version of a plugin from this page: https://oddsound.com/usingmtsesp.php and they'll pop right up as connected.

EQuilibrium will follow input note pitch. You can play notes to shift it up and down. Set it up with resonators, blast noise through, and it's wild.

Dave.

P.S. drop us an email about demo license and we'll figure out what's going on there.
I recieved the license thanks.

I was wondering if rerouting midi instead of inserting the midi client plug version before a synth should work ?

Im not able to get it to work inside renoise. And the only way to send midi data on renoise as far as i am aware is rerouting it to a plugin.
Old 30th March 2021 | Show parent
  #17
Lives for gear
 
LASTLAVGH's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ODDSound ➡️
It's not the only system of its kind, here's another similar one I bookmarked, given a couple of rainy days I might have a go at implementing - https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ic_microtuning
Interesting, yeah I guess there are probably a number of ways of approximating just intonation on the fly...

I hope you manage to get something like that working! Would definitely buy the product.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sky ➡️

I had to look up Hermode tuning that lastlavgh mentions above. The two videos in this link that compare chamber performance with Hermode and Equal Temperament are insightful imho.

While Hermode is not specifically implemented yet, MTS is exciting technology imho.

http://www.hermode.com/index_en.html

Sky
Yeah - vocalists, string players, horn players, and even some guitarists all do something similar intuitively.

I mean - obviously microtuning is interesting for a variety of reasons, but I would guess one of the deeper drives is to get closer to just harmonies in one way or another. Hermode or similar is exciting because it takes advantage of the technology to combine the usefulness of ET and the sonority of just intonation.

Having said that, there are definitely some cool temperaments (fixed) that I would also like to be able to use on all instruments.

Nigel Taylor has one that is built into Logic called 'Circulating Balanced' which I really like (a modern but non-equal temperament).
Old 30th March 2021
  #18
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
I feel like I'm just barely starting to scratch the surface with what I would be able to do sound design or composition wise when I'm thinking about this ... but even at the surface level this starts to sound really exciting!

Just intonation on a chord by chord basis by automating between different tuning systems, potentially using tuning system automation to bend single notes within a scale for a bunch of instruments at once, and obviously really interesting non-traditional tonal textures.

Thanks for making this guys! I will definitely be checking this out.
Old 30th March 2021 | Show parent
  #19
Here for the gear
 
It changes the tunings of compatible Virtual Instruments (and other things) to whatever you want. Then it allows you to change the frequencies of notes during a composition, either temporarily or permanently. Any easier?
Old 30th March 2021 | Show parent
  #20
Here for the gear
 
You don't need hermode if you can fully control the frequency of notes, because you can justify chords by automation. Of course you could also use a tuning system that has just intervals for the chords you need to start with.
Old 30th March 2021
  #21
Here for the gear
Hi guys
What you achieved is amazing.
One feature that I'm the most interested in is the possibility to dynamically change scales on the fly.
I wonder if this is feasible with hardware synths (I have a prophet 12) :

1) if I understand, only softwares can embark the MTS-ESP tech right? Not hardware?
2) so your best practice for hardware is the single-note MTS SysEx message at least. Does this allow for the dynamic scale-switching feature?
3) and finally, which hardware synths supports the single-note MTS SysEx messages ? I have a hard time finding it and wonder if you had a list.

Best wishes for your success !

Romain

Last edited by RomainT; 30th March 2021 at 11:04 PM.. Reason: forgot a question
Old 30th March 2021 | Show parent
  #22
Here for the gear
 
Hey Romain,

This is all dependent upon what you want to do, the Prophet 12 seemingly will accept bulk MTS messages (see this Manual Addendum : https://yo41t1y5gos9jw8f3lptw0xo-wpe...3-Addendum.pdf), so it'll be great for retuning and occasional tuning changes but YMMV if you start to shift frequencies quickly.

1) Yes, MTS-ESP exists within a DAW session, the MTS-ESP MIDI Client can send bulk/single MTS messages and MPE, these can be used to retune some hardware. Also I've got a fair bit of mileage out of just using multi channel pitch bends on synths like the FS1R, which gives me 4 note polyphony.
2) It is preferable for a synth to have single/bulk MTS support but some perform better than others if you attempt to make radical changes with only bulk messages. The OB-6 performs reasonably well in this scenario, but given enough bulk messages timing can suffer. You have to tread carefully.
3) Novation Peak, Summit and BSII/AFXStation all do, the Moog Matriarch, Sub 37, Subsequent 37, Expert Sleepers are adding it to hardware, I think some Waldorf synths like the Kyra support both. There are more on the way, nothing sent MTS single note until the MIDI Client AFAIK so its unsurprising adoption is poor. Hopefully that will change in the future. Incidentally, any synth with MPE support will usually retune smoothly and accurately, it's just not ideal if you actually want to use MPE for a controller.
Old 31st March 2021
  #23
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I'd just like to say thank you, this is really an excellent development. Micro tuning has always been so piecemeal. Big thanks to you and Mr. James (AFX!) for releasing this to the world. Looking forward to exploring this.
Old 31st March 2021 | Show parent
  #24
Here for the gear
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakaman121 ➡️
I recieved the license thanks.

I was wondering if rerouting midi instead of inserting the midi client plug version before a synth should work ?

Im not able to get it to work inside renoise. And the only way to send midi data on renoise as far as i am aware is rerouting it to a plugin.
This totally works. There's instructions for Renoise in the MIDI Client manual (https://oddsound.com/dl/ODDSound_MTS...ent_Manual.pdf). Unfortunately MIDI routing in Renoise is limited to a single channel so you couldn't leverage MPE for polyphonic retuning through Renoise. That said you could load the MIDI Client and a synth Plug-in together inside Pluchain from MIDIMood (https://www.midimood.com/product/pluchain/) to get round this, and to get round having to do any MIDI routing in Renoise at all!
Old 31st March 2021
  #25
Lives for gear
 
no genre's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
I am completely fascinated with this idea. I will be demoing the full version soon. For now, I have downloaded the free version and intend to play with this a lot over the next few days. This opens some new roads.
Old 31st March 2021 | Show parent
  #26
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conundra ➡️
Some EQs can accept midi input that can transpose the eqs response in real time. A bit like a key tracked filter on a synth.
Which ones?
Old 31st March 2021 | Show parent
  #27
Here for the gear
 
EQuilibrium does this, now it reads MTS-ESP it can be fully dynamically microtuned too.
Old 31st March 2021 | Show parent
  #28
Lives for gear
 
baslotto's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sky ➡️
I can imagine that Jacob Collier will really enjoy this.


Sky
My thought exactly, I was going to post the same thing. I hope he gets notified soon about this.
Old 31st March 2021
  #29
Lives for gear
 
StoneyBCN's Avatar
It's very interesting to see this emerge. Some may have seen this ****fork article recently:

https://pitchfork.com/thepitch/decol...h-its-software

It's worth noting that only a sub-set of all music uses the harmonic style of 18th century european musicians. Also interesting how micro-tonality appeals to "electronic" artists like Wendy Carlos and Mr. D. James here. Perhaps "electronic" music will break itself free from past definitions... Could totally see that happening.

Definitely something I'd love to explore at some point. Kudos all involved!
Old 31st March 2021
  #30
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Colundi anyone ?
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