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Windows 10 thread... post your expectations here
Old 27th December 2014
  #1
Windows 10 thread... post your expectations here

as windows 10 is around the corner, post your expectations and experiences here.

Windows 10: 12 things you need to know | PCWorld
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Old 27th December 2014
  #2
Lives for gear
 
blackcom's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Sounds pretty sweet, i plan to upgrade early.
Old 27th December 2014
  #3
Gear Nut
 
kneelie's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
If you have a spare pc, find out for yourself.
Download Windows Technical Preview ISO - Microsoft Windows

I've been running it and it gets rid of most of the annoyances of windows 8. Biggest annoyances so far are I don't like the ribbon, the dialogue box for pasting into folders to merge contents is better in windows 7, the hover zone on window borders seems reduced.
Old 29th December 2014
  #4
Lives for gear
 
shponglefan's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Windows 10 will likely continue in the tradition of being the Microsoft OS that the prior OS should have been.
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Old 29th December 2014
  #5
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
I'm most excited for this feature.

Windows 10 Includes a Linux-Style Package Manager Named “OneGet”
Old 30th December 2014
  #6
Gear Maniac
 
mik303's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
What excites me most is a very small feature which I saw in youtube; No borders on the edges of windows.
@ 1:30 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVDl3b1DqE0
Take that Reaper! No more of those ugly borders ruining my beautiful plugins.

Most likely I will not be amongst the early adopters. I prefer to wait for a while just to see if there is going to be any incompatibility problems with the hardware and software that I have.
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Old 30th December 2014
  #7
Lives for gear
 
billcarroll's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I think they'll finally fix everything. Hehe. I kid, I kid.
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Old 30th December 2014
  #8
Lives for gear
 
satissounds's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Planning on getting a new PC when Windows 10 is released. Still on XP at the moment and I'm not interested in 8 as I have that on my laptop and don't like it at all.
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Old 30th December 2014 | Show parent
  #9
Gear Nut
 
kneelie's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by mik303 ➑️
What excites me most is a very small feature which I saw in youtube; No borders on the edges of windows.
As of now, the hover zone for resizing windows is also reduced which is kind of annoying.
Old 30th December 2014 | Show parent
  #10
Gear Maniac
 
mik303's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kneelie ➑️
As of now, the hover zone for resizing windows is also reduced which is kind of annoying.
Hopefully they fix it before the final release.
Old 1st January 2015
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Cursed Lemon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Literally don't care about anything except driver support.
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Old 2nd January 2015
  #12
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Been running the tech preview on an i5 laptop with 8 gb of ram and a 500gb SSD for about a week.
One minor oddity when I initially installed the most recent drivers for my RM Babyface, but that was just a single screen that said "Aargh! Does not compute!" and then disappeared, so I am putting that down to tech pre-itis.

The gui is very basic at present, since we are at the "does it work" stage rather than the "is it pretty" stage.

But I have to say I got the hang of it way quicker than I did either win7 or win 8 or win 8.1

Latest version of AVG installed and scanned with no issues, as did latest build of VSC and Advanced system care. And of course Reaper & my Native Intruments stuff just worked.
So far, cautious optimism.
Oh, and unless you want to, no need to even see Metro.
Old 2nd January 2015
  #13
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Build 9879 is pretty solid - for a pre-beta that's good - I think.
Old 2nd January 2015
  #14
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Maybe Redmond will let windows users transfer huge files as fast as OSX in Windows 10? Win 8.1 was stable as OSX and I think its a great platform to make music. However, transferring several gigs of data is still like watching a peanut butter avalanche. YMMV of course
Old 2nd January 2015
  #15
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
So still no word as to whether or not this will be a free upgrade for Windows 8.1 users? I'm on 7 now, and was going to put together a new DAW build soon. Not sure if I should go with 7 or 8.1
Old 3rd January 2015
  #16
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I expect it to have the most cutting edge invention of all:

A start bar.
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Old 3rd January 2015 | Show parent
  #17
Lives for gear
 
shponglefan's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool Tool ➑️
So still no word as to whether or not this will be a free upgrade for Windows 8.1 users?
I wouldn't expect it to be. I don't think Microsoft ever offered a new OS as a free update...
Old 3rd January 2015 | Show parent
  #18
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by shponglefan ➑️
I wouldn't expect it to be. I don't think Microsoft ever offered a new OS as a free update...
Yeah I have my doubts. I just recall word floating around it was going to be offered for free to W8 users after the flack that OS caught.
Old 3rd January 2015 | Show parent
  #19
Registered User
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool Tool ➑️
Yeah I have my doubts. I just recall word floating around it was going to be offered for free to W8 users after the flack that OS caught.
If that didn't happen after ME or Vista then you can forget about it now.
Old 5th January 2015
  #20
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
MS doesn't have to give their OS away at all. Nothing was wrong with Win8, nothing is now, once people stop crying about the start screen. If it's a paid update it's paid. Win10 is already looking great based on the preview, which I've already tested with cubase 7.5 and firewire devices.
Old 6th January 2015 | Show parent
  #21
Lives for gear
 
Psychlist1972's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
My job at Microsoft, in this space, is primarily two things:
1. Help developers write for Windows, and help them accelerate their development.
2. Make sure the pro audio and creative music experience on Windows 10 is top notch. (By getting your feedback into the team, and by helping them shape features and updates.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed Lemon ➑️
Literally don't care about anything except driver support.
Especially on the audio side, we're working more closely than ever to make sure that's true. As always, there will be some lag between OS release and driver updates, but we're working to minimize that whenever we can.

Also, we've fixed some audio-related bugs, tightened up MIDI timing, and fixed a few bugs there as well. None of that is in the public preview right now, though. We're also looking at other things we can do to make the Windows 10 experience better for musicians. Even things that might not make it into 10 itself are being closely tracked on our backlogs. In fact, I have a meeting in an hour to help prioritize those.

We've even gotten some very good timing data and other feedback from some folks here. You might be surprised how much GS feedback has made it into justifications internally.

Along those lines, if anyone talks to a pro-audio vendor/manufacturer that makes stuff for Windows (apps, drivers, etc.) or who wants to build on our platform, and they aren't yet in touch with us, feel free to give them my email address: pete dot brown at microsoft dot com. I'll also be at NAMM reaching out to a lot of the ones I haven't been able to get to via phone/email.

As to the question about whether or not to go with 7 now or 8.1, I've found 8.1 to be great for my DAW use. On my desktop, I boot directly to the desktop, keep my most-used apps directly on the task bar, and synchronize all my projects (dev, music, etc.) via OneDrive. If the start menu is a deal killer, there are some good and inexpensive third-party replacements for that. But do research your applications to be sure they have Windows 8/8.1 drivers and/or work under 8 or 8.1.

Pete
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Old 6th January 2015
  #22
Lives for gear
 
Psychlist1972's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Oh, and to be clear: I wouldn't use Windows 10 today on a production machine unless you like living on the edge. It's preview code (pre-beta). It gets almost daily (reboot required) updates, and doesn't yet have any of our updated audio or MIDI code.

I use it on my Surface Pro 3. Most of the time those updates are good, but sometimes they are not so hot. Some DAWs work, some do not.
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Old 6th January 2015 | Show parent
  #23
Lives for gear
 
Cursed Lemon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 ➑️
Helpful stuff
Well, that was a response I wasn't necessarily expecting!

When you say "worked on audio bugs and tightened up MIDI timing", what exactly do you mean? I'm not sure how that kind of stuff relates to Windows itself.
Old 6th January 2015 | Show parent
  #24
Lives for gear
 
Psychlist1972's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed Lemon ➑️
Well, that was a response I wasn't necessarily expecting!

When you say "worked on audio bugs and tightened up MIDI timing", what exactly do you mean? I'm not sure how that kind of stuff relates to Windows itself.
I can't go into any specifics until we release Windows 10, but we found some inefficiencies in how we sent some MIDI messages out through the driver. There's a lot more around that, but I'll summarize that way. It was code we hadn't looked at in quite a while.

We also learned a fair bit about how people are using the new preview MIDI API Jason and I announced at Build in April. The one we're building into Windows 10 is based on that, but more integrated both with universal apps and the desktop.

Example use (for developers):
Interfacing the Novation Launchpad S with a Windows Store app - Pete Brown's 10rem.net

Pete
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Old 6th January 2015 | Show parent
  #25
Lives for gear
 
Cursed Lemon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 ➑️
I can't go into any specifics until we release Windows 10, but we found some inefficiencies in how we sent some MIDI messages out through the driver. There's a lot more around that, but I'll summarize that way. It was code we hadn't looked at in quite a while.

We also learned a fair bit about how people are using the new preview MIDI API Jason and I announced at Build in April. The one we're building into Windows 10 is based on that, but more integrated both with universal apps and the desktop.

Example use (for developers):
Interfacing the Novation Launchpad S with a Windows Store app - Pete Brown's 10rem.net

Pete
I'm presuming that this effort is mainly geared towards individuals who will be using a mobile Windows device of some kind for part or all of their music production?
Old 6th January 2015 | Show parent
  #26
Lives for gear
 
Psychlist1972's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed Lemon ➑️
I'm presuming that this effort is mainly geared towards individuals who will be using a mobile Windows device of some kind for part or all of their music production?
Not just that. For example, we said at Build that we intend to make the new MIDI API available to classic Win32 apps on Windows 10. Then those apps can take advantage of the R&D we do there, and new features we add going forward. We couldn't really do that in the old Win32 MIDI APIs.

Note also that universal apps can run on desktops in a window, on phones, on tablets, on 80" PPI screens, Xbox One, tiny IoT devices, and more. That doesn't mean 100% of the APIs are available across all devices, but we aim to make it as close to 100% as possible. With 10 we finally get to the point where developers can truly build an app, and maximize where their customers can use it.

To be sure, we know desktop DAWs and plugins are still the bread and butter of the industry. We have that firmly in mind as we're doing development. We can do OS-level stuff like MIDI, and audio driver optimization, but things like ASIO and VST standards/implementations are largely out of our control (although we do talk to companies like Steinberg to make them aware of our plans and to get their feedback).

Pete
Old 6th January 2015 | Show parent
  #27
Lives for gear
 
Cursed Lemon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 ➑️
Not just that. For example, we said at Build that we intend to make the new MIDI API available to classic Win32 apps on Windows 10. Then those apps can take advantage of the R&D we do there, and new features we add going forward. We couldn't really do that in the old Win32 MIDI APIs.

Note also that universal apps can run on desktops in a window, on phones, on tablets, on 80" PPI screens, Xbox One, tiny IoT devices, and more. That doesn't mean 100% of the APIs are available across all devices, but we aim to make it as close to 100% as possible. With 10 we finally get to the point where developers can truly build an app, and maximize where their customers can use it.

To be sure, we know desktop DAWs and plugins are still the bread and butter of the industry. We have that firmly in mind as we're doing development. We can do OS-level stuff like MIDI, and audio driver optimization, but things like ASIO and VST standards/implementations are largely out of our control (although we do talk to companies like Steinberg to make them aware of our plans and to get their feedback).

Pete
It's very interesting that you're taking the initiative to make recording music possible at essentially the soundcard level, which has most certainly never been possible before. Truth be told, there is a market there. I don't know what kind of control Microsoft has over the hardware that Windows is distributed with (e.g. factory-assembled computers bought off the shelf) and whether or not you can enforce certain standards, but I can tell you that a soundcard input with the right electronic configuration for a guitar input, plus the related efforts you are speaking of (which would have to tackle the current issues of noise/latency/etc.) would probably reach quite a few prospective musicians out there.
Old 7th January 2015 | Show parent
  #28
Gear Nut
 
kneelie's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 ➑️
Oh, and to be clear: I wouldn't use Windows 10 today on a production machine unless you like living on the edge. It's preview code (pre-beta). It gets almost daily (reboot required) updates, and doesn't yet have any of our updated audio or MIDI code.
This depends on what update ring you are in
Canary
Operating System Group
Microsoft
Windows Insiders - Fast
Windows Insiders - Slow

We’re rolling out our first new build to the Windows Insider Program

I am on the slow track and my last widows update was 12/18. My build is at 9879. There have been updates for windows defender and office 2003 since then.


I appreciate your commitment to improve the audio performance of the Windows operating system
Old 7th January 2015 | Show parent
  #29
Lives for gear
 
Psychlist1972's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kneelie ➑️
This depends on what update ring you are in
Canary
Operating System Group
Microsoft
Windows Insiders - Fast
Windows Insiders - Slow

We’re rolling out our first new build to the Windows Insider Program

I am on the slow track and my last widows update was 12/18. My build is at 9879. There have been updates for windows defender and office 2003 since then.
Maybe it's a Surface Pro 3 thing. That machine (personal one) is on the "slow" update setting. I have to reboot due to updates (not new complete builds) almost every day.

Quote:
I appreciate your commitment to improve the audio performance of the Windows operating system
Thanks. I want us to get this right.

Pete
Old 7th January 2015 | Show parent
  #30
Lives for gear
 
DAW PLUS's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 ➑️
My job at Microsoft, in this space, is primarily two things:
1. Help developers write for Windows, and help them accelerate their development.
2. Make sure the pro audio and creative music experience on Windows 10 is top notch. (By getting your feedback into the team, and by helping them shape features and updates.)



Especially on the audio side, we're working more closely than ever to make sure that's true. As always, there will be some lag between OS release and driver updates, but we're working to minimize that whenever we can.

Also, we've fixed some audio-related bugs, tightened up MIDI timing, and fixed a few bugs there as well. None of that is in the public preview right now, though. We're also looking at other things we can do to make the Windows 10 experience better for musicians. Even things that might not make it into 10 itself are being closely tracked on our backlogs. In fact, I have a meeting in an hour to help prioritize those.

We've even gotten some very good timing data and other feedback from some folks here. You might be surprised how much GS feedback has made it into justifications internally.

Along those lines, if anyone talks to a pro-audio vendor/manufacturer that makes stuff for Windows (apps, drivers, etc.) or who wants to build on our platform, and they aren't yet in touch with us, feel free to give them my email address: pete dot brown at microsoft dot com. I'll also be at NAMM reaching out to a lot of the ones I haven't been able to get to via phone/email.

As to the question about whether or not to go with 7 now or 8.1, I've found 8.1 to be great for my DAW use. On my desktop, I boot directly to the desktop, keep my most-used apps directly on the task bar, and synchronize all my projects (dev, music, etc.) via OneDrive. If the start menu is a deal killer, there are some good and inexpensive third-party replacements for that. But do research your applications to be sure they have Windows 8/8.1 drivers and/or work under 8 or 8.1.

Pete
I'm really looking forward to this, Pete. Win7 and Win8.1 are great for audio, but there is room for improvement. I'll also send you the configuration suggestions I mentioned previously.
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