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Slate Digital VMR almost here: The Channel Strip of YOUR DREAMS
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #781
Tui
Gear Guru
 
Tui's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by api2500 ➡️
Not that Slate tend to oversell though.
I can assure you, all his claims are understated - in the extreme.

I am one of only a handful of beta-testers (of course, I'm not supposed to talk about it, due to strict NDAs). However, today I can exclusively reveal that VMR employs a revolutionary, new technology called H.Y.P.E. (Holographic Yclept Precision Extractor). This, for an example, allows certain VMR modules to sound more like Neve hardware, than Rupert Neve's own creations! But, I hear you say, how is this possible? Well, during the development phase, H.Y.P.E. not only detects the smallest nuances of the hardware and subsequently models them in software. It even calculates how Mr Neve intended it to sound, but never quite achieved it!

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Old 11th July 2014
  #782
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
To. Steven Slate:

AAX DSP???????????????????
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #783
Slate Pro Audio / Slate Digital
 
Steven Slate's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
The Neve 1073 is a very complex sounding equalizer. The filters themselves are pretty unique, but what really adds the magic tone is the sound of the transformer. It took us a long time to really perfect how the transformer dynamically reacts to incoming signal.

So here are some comparisons against the FG-N Equalizer in the VMR's upcoming Mix Bundle. Now, the hardware doesn't have any detents on the gain, so this was matched by ear. I used four frequencies, including the hi shelf, the low shelf, and two mid band points.. in each I made a pretty massive boost to really show how both the filter and the nonlinear artifacts react.

As much as I would love to just name the files, I'm forced to post them blind so that the analog snob trolls don't come out of the snob woods to proclaim a massively insanely totally fairy magic wizardly superior sound of the hardware..

Sorry it's my terrible voice but that's just what I happened to have in the workstation, here's the 24bit 96khz dry file:

www.stevenslate.com/gs/DRY.wav

Here's the boost at 3.2khz
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N32A.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N32B.wav

Here's the 1.6khz boost
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N16A.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N16B.wav

Here's the hi shelf boost
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NHIA.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NHIB.wav

Here's the low shelf boot
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NLOWA.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NLOWB.wav

You can hear in these files that the very small harmonic nuances have all been modeled and you can switch back and forth between the files with sonic seamlessness. Pretty cool when you think that one of these files cost $5,000 and the other is $37 (1/4 of the $149 intro price).

So, just a taste for now. We're making a lot of videos with more audio that will officially come out when the VMR does.

Regarding AAX DSP: This is something we will likely do, as the programming is complex but not impossible, and the HDX cards have a ton more power than the Sharc based cards.

Cheers,
Steven
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Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #784
Reviews Editor
 
Diogo C's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
Hi guys. I'm gonna post some demos of the FG-N verse a Neve 1073 today. Stay tuned.

I'm sorry to anyone who is such a paranoid schizophrenic that they think these delays are based on anything other than growing pains and honest mistakes. We announced the plugin too early, we've spent a lot of time perfecting small details, we lost one of our programmers in the past month, and these are very difficult algorithms to get perfect. We are the only company who consistently A/B's every release with the real hardware and this will be no different. So we can't just aim for "85% there!", we must do "100% there". For the VMR, we're gonna do live A/B's with a few pros as well.

Anyway, audio coming.

And for the record, even though we are completely maxed out to oblivion, we do have those mono VBC updates done and they'll be in the accounts soon.

Cheers,
Steven
Great to read that mono VBC is on the way!
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Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #785
Gear Head
 
fenixdoido's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
WOW. I couldn't hear any difference. I though I was, but A/B back and forth and blindly...
Amazing. Thanks Slate, you nailed.
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #786
Lives for gear
 
Taurean's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
The Neve 1073 is a very complex sounding equalizer. The filters themselves are pretty unique, but what really adds the magic tone is the sound of the transformer. It took us a long time to really perfect how the transformer dynamically reacts to incoming signal.

So here are some comparisons against the FG-N Equalizer in the VMR's upcoming Mix Bundle. Now, the hardware doesn't have any detents on the gain, so this was matched by ear. I used four frequencies, including the hi shelf, the low shelf, and two mid band points.. in each I made a pretty massive boost to really show how both the filter and the nonlinear artifacts react.

As much as I would love to just name the files, I'm forced to post them blind so that the analog snob trolls don't come out of the snob woods to proclaim a massively insanely totally fairy magic wizardly superior sound of the hardware..

Sorry it's my terrible voice but that's just what I happened to have in the workstation, here's the 24bit 96khz dry file:

www.stevenslate.com/gs/DRY.wav

Here's the boost at 3.2khz
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N32A.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N32B.wav

Here's the 1.6khz boost
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N16A.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N16B.wav

Here's the hi shelf boost
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NHIA.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NHIB.wav

Here's the low shelf boot
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NLOWA.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NLOWB.wav

You can hear in these files that the very small harmonic nuances have all been modeled and you can switch back and forth between the files with sonic seamlessness. Pretty cool when you think that one of these files cost $5,000 and the other is $37 (1/4 of the $149 intro price).

So, just a taste for now. We're making a lot of videos with more audio that will officially come out when the VMR does.

Regarding AAX DSP: This is something we will likely do, as the programming is complex but not impossible, and the HDX cards have a ton more power than the Sharc based cards.

Cheers,
Steven
Clearly the analog ones are better....I kid.

I created a prerequisite to group the files. First nothing comes across as "plugin" sounding more or less than the other file. So I can only group them according to a repeating characteristic and my assumption that, that characteristic links them all. For me I can only say they don't sonically sound the same (again, quality aside).

So this group to me, exhibit more forcefulness in the upper mid range. Perceptively, one could say they lack a bit of the low end the counter file possesses. Within the context of a mix, one can only determine if that's a good thing or a bad thing:

N32B
N16B
NHiB
NLowA


Thanks for posting Steven
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #787
Slate Pro Audio / Slate Digital
 
Steven Slate's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TranscendingM ➡️

N32B
N16B
NHiB
NLowA


Thanks for posting Steven
When the mighty ears of TranscendingM can't continuously identify the hardware vs software, I know I'm on to something good

The issue here with trying to judge them by "forceful upper mids" is that given the lack of gain detents, that forcefullness (and I don't hear this so this is subjective) could vary from each comparison file based on a small discrepancy of gain amount. The gain on this equalizer is very sensitive.

Having said all that, I've done some blind tests with these files and have never been able to get it perfect. I don't even think any other hardware 1073 would match as close as these do.


Cheers,
Steven
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Old 11th July 2014
  #788
Lives for gear
 
thermos's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Really fast, I'd say all of the A ones are real. But thats probably because they say A on them. I felt like I noticed more thickness in those. Either way, I'm gonna use the hell out of this plugin when it comes out.
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #789
Lives for gear
 
Taurean's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
When the mighty ears of TranscendingM can't continuously identify the hardware vs software, I know I'm on to something good

The issue here with trying to judge them by "forceful upper mids" is that given the lack of gain detents, that forcefullness (and I don't hear this so this is subjective) could vary from each comparison file based on a small discrepancy of gain amount. The gain on this equalizer is very sensitive.

Having said all that, I've done some blind tests with these files and have never been able to get it perfect. I don't even think any other hardware 1073 would match as close as these do.


Cheers,
Steven

I do hear what you're saying though, because it is such a non-linear EQ even when going from frequency band to frequency band the "surrounding" characteristics change as you said. Yea and like I said I can't say what's HW or SW here, I just hear a character and I'm using that to base my judgment in grouping them.
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #790
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
NM

Last edited by tmoneygetpaid; 11th July 2014 at 10:05 PM.. Reason: fail
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #791
Lives for gear
 
Taurean's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmoneygetpaid ➡️
flipped each one out of phase with the other and literally no signal gets through. not a single sample of difference. TL Mastermeter shows -INF peak signal. Hm
something is off there. I am not getting nulls between the files.
Old 11th July 2014
  #792
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Right you are. Reimported and there is difference.
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #793
Lives for gear
 
superwack's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmoneygetpaid ➡️
flipped each one out of phase with the other and literally no signal gets through. not a single sample of difference. TL Mastermeter shows -INF peak signal. Hm
Try re-importing them... I imported them as a "batch" in protools (using the import dialog) and got the exact same results... 100% cancellation. Re-imported and the don't cancel 100%. Odd.

Having said that, like VBC a/b tests, damned if I can tell the difference which to me equals no difference.

Bring on the VMR! (and mono VBC... and VCC AAX... and... )

EDIT: Forgot my choices - I liked "A" in every case

EDIT2: ... and FG-X!
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Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #794
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by superwack ➡️
Try re-importing them... I imported them as a "batch" in protools (using the import dialog) and got the exact same results... 100% cancellation. Re-imported and the don't cancel 100%. Odd.
Exactly what happened to me. Odd indeed.
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #795
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thermos ➡️
Really fast, I'd say all of the A ones are real. But thats probably because they say A on them. I felt like I noticed more thickness in those. Either way, I'm gonna use the hell out of this plugin when it comes out.
Prefer the A files too.
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #796
Lives for gear
 
api2500's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TranscendingM ➡️
N32B
N16B
NHiB
NLowA
Initally, I thought this too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
The issue here with trying to judge them by "forceful upper mids" is that given the lack of gain detents, that forcefullness (and I don't hear this so this is subjective) could vary from each comparison file based on a small discrepancy of gain amount. The gain on this equalizer is very sensitive.
But if this is so, this might actually be magic.

Thanks Steven! I'm ready...
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #797
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
Regarding AAX DSP: This is something we will likely do, as the programming is complex but not impossible, and the HDX cards have a ton more power than the Sharc based cards.

Cheers,
Steven
Thank you for answering that. It's not a "running out of power" issue. I want to be able to use VMR while I'm tracking. I used to use the Waves SSL channel when they had DSP versions. But I'm guessing the VMR will mop the floor with Waves SSL

For the record I'm way more excited for the SSL module than the Neve one. Am I alone here ?

Any VMR SSL shoot outs?
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #798
Lives for gear
 
api2500's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by flippy floppy ➡️
thank you for answering that. It's not a "running out of power" issue. I want to be able to use vmr while i'm tracking. I used to use the waves ssl channel when they had dsp versions. But i'm guessing the vmr will mop the floor with waves ssl

for the record i'm way more excited for the ssl module than the neve one. Am i alone here ?

Any vmr ssl shoot outs?
vmr api 2500??
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #799
Gear Addict
 
Equiv_Exchange's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
Hi guys. I'm gonna post some demos of the FG-N verse a Neve 1073 today. Stay tuned.

I'm sorry to anyone who is such a paranoid schizophrenic that they think these delays are based on anything other than growing pains and honest mistakes. We announced the plugin too early, we've spent a lot of time perfecting small details, we lost one of our programmers in the past month, and these are very difficult algorithms to get perfect. We are the only company who consistently A/B's every release with the real hardware and this will be no different. So we can't just aim for "85% there!", we must do "100% there". For the VMR, we're gonna do live A/B's with a few pros as well.

Anyway, audio coming.

And for the record, even though we are completely maxed out to oblivion, we do have those mono VBC updates done and they'll be in the accounts soon.

Cheers,
Steven
just in time. mixing my wife's album and the mono vbcs will be used all over!
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #800
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by api2500 ➡️
vmr api 2500??
You are taking to the next level. Lusting over modules that aren't even announced yet!!
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #801
Lives for gear
 
api2500's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flippy Floppy ➡️
You are taking to the next level. Lusting over modules that aren't even announced yet!!
Just lusting over their hard work and the talented work. That's that being a gs isn't it?? *fingers crossed for the mystery bundle*
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #802
Gear Addict
 
Equiv_Exchange's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
I'm sure I've distinguished between all of the pairs.

The flatter, darker sounding files are N32A, N16B, NHIA, and NLOWB (This group is the VMR)

The brighter files with more depth are: N32B, N16A,NHIB, and NLOWA. (This group is the hardware)

Almost the same as TranscendingM. Everytime I do a slate shootout I pick the better sounding ones as the hardware and end up being wrong everytime. SO this time I am picking the better sounding group as the VMR. Let's see...
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #803
Slate Pro Audio / Slate Digital
 
Steven Slate's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Equiv_Exchange ➡️
I'm sure I've distinguished between all of the pairs...
Afraid not

Cheers,
Steven
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Old 11th July 2014
  #804
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
These are very very VERY close. I would say 95%.
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Old 11th July 2014
  #805
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
neh. 98%.
Old 11th July 2014
  #806
Gear Addict
 
krevvy's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Not sure which is which as ive never used a real neve before.... but from listening carefully some sound different (slightly thinner sounding) I cant hear the difference on my KRK's but on my K702's I can hear the difference....

I cant say which is neve or VMR...but my favorite sounding samples are:
N32A
N16A
NHiA
NLowB
Old 11th July 2014 | Show parent
  #807
Deleted e1b9f94
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
We are the only company who consistently A/B's every release with the real hardware and this will be no different.
Now that some bold statement right there. And where exactly are you getting this information? Are you walking from company to company to say that you are the only one doing A/B with the hardware? Not nice from you But you have a point there...I always wonder why there are so few companies doing this. I actually know only two. Relab and Slate Digital. I also always asking myself isn't it weird that UAD does not post comparison at least for their own hardware compressors vs emulations/plugins..never ever saw A/B from UAD. A bit weird if you ask me..

Old 12th July 2014 | Show parent
  #808
Lives for gear
 
Antagonist's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
Afraid not

Cheers,
Steven
This sounds good looking forward to hearing the compressors!

How close Steven?

N32a - VMR
N32b - NEVE

N16A - VMR
N16B - NEVE

NHIA - NEVE
NHIB - VMR

NLOWA - NEVE
NLOWB - VMR
Old 12th July 2014 | Show parent
  #809
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
I understand and like the rack concept but I would like to use the plugins without the rack shell. Will this be possible ?
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Old 12th July 2014 | Show parent
  #810
Lives for gear
 
jalcide's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Slate ➡️
The Neve 1073 is a very complex sounding equalizer. The filters themselves are pretty unique, but what really adds the magic tone is the sound of the transformer. It took us a long time to really perfect how the transformer dynamically reacts to incoming signal.

So here are some comparisons against the FG-N Equalizer in the VMR's upcoming Mix Bundle. Now, the hardware doesn't have any detents on the gain, so this was matched by ear. I used four frequencies, including the hi shelf, the low shelf, and two mid band points.. in each I made a pretty massive boost to really show how both the filter and the nonlinear artifacts react.

As much as I would love to just name the files, I'm forced to post them blind so that the analog snob trolls don't come out of the snob woods to proclaim a massively insanely totally fairy magic wizardly superior sound of the hardware..

Sorry it's my terrible voice but that's just what I happened to have in the workstation, here's the 24bit 96khz dry file:

www.stevenslate.com/gs/DRY.wav

Here's the boost at 3.2khz
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N32A.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N32B.wav

Here's the 1.6khz boost
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N16A.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/N16B.wav

Here's the hi shelf boost
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NHIA.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NHIB.wav

Here's the low shelf boot
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NLOWA.wav
www.stevenslate.com/gs/NLOWB.wav

You can hear in these files that the very small harmonic nuances have all been modeled and you can switch back and forth between the files with sonic seamlessness. Pretty cool when you think that one of these files cost $5,000 and the other is $37 (1/4 of the $149 intro price).

So, just a taste for now. We're making a lot of videos with more audio that will officially come out when the VMR does.

Regarding AAX DSP: This is something we will likely do, as the programming is complex but not impossible, and the HDX cards have a ton more power than the Sharc based cards.

Cheers,
Steven
Very, very close, especially considering the hardware knob matching challenge. Congrats by any measure!

I feel I hear an "involving" lively character as a commonality between the following examples:

N32B
N16B
NHIB
NLOWA

These were also slightly my favorites without any mix context.

No idea which is hardware or software, but I'll guess these are software due to a working theory that any chef in control of the "mojo spice" would not be able to resist adding an extra dash of it (and still be within the parameters of the matching mandate).
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