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USB3.0 Interfaces
Old 12th September 2012 | Show parent
  #31
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit ➑️
My deal personally is,Iv'e nearly bought an RME HDSPe PCIe card,and so then I need to buy a "Multiface" to plug into it,but the Multi,has NO XLR ins,or Pre's!


RK
Please check your products, just to make sure that you get the right thing.
Old 12th September 2012 | Show parent
  #32
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit ➑️
... I wish I could understand why more manufacturer's don't use "ethernet" like the Focusrite "RedNet"?
RK
Just because it is ethernet, doesn't make it good or fast. Why question what works, why not just use what works? I've been on the RME bandwagon since the original pre-HDSP 9652. They have never let me down, my studio made a ton of money using their products, and I've never had to worry about any of the products that I bought.
Old 12th September 2012
  #33
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
i get alot of latency from using usb 2.0 altho i do have a laptop so i think thats why.
Old 12th September 2012 | Show parent
  #34
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
i get alot of latency from using usb 2.0 altho i do have a laptop so i think thats why.
using what interface?
Old 12th September 2012 | Show parent
  #35
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DAW PLUS's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
explain how this works? you need two audio interfaces to work one? or you get the pcie audio interface and run something like an octepre through it? via adat?

also i think the advantage of lightpeak/thunderbolt is that it does streaming/data transfer/ image display in both directions at 10gbps aswell as the option to daisy chain different devices with one or two cables.

hence why i think they don use hdmi. as far as i know hdmi is only used to display images. can it also be used for data transfer?

ethernet seems to be a viable option because of the implementation of being able to go up for 100mbits a sec or more.

whats the clear issue with ethernet and why isnt there alot of interfaces with this connectivity?
Let us not drift off here:
If you have PCIe slots in your system, it is better to use a PCIe audio card instead of a PCIe Thunderbolt/Lightpeak card and add a Thunderbolt/Lightpeak interface to that.
Thunderbolt/Lightpeak for now is mainly interesting for laptops and iMac type systems without expansion space.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] ➑️
Please check your products, just to make sure that you get the right thing.
That's exactly WHAT,I was fishing for by mentioning the "almost bought" part,as I find it confusing,that RME don't offer an interface to plug into the HDSPe,that has MIDI,but more importantly XLR ins,as part of a mic pre setup,so it goes- HDSPe-Multiface[with XLR ins!].

I mean the whole point of this thread is IMO,about how/when are we going to see interfaces that are better than USB 2.0,by using USB3.0?,and as I understand,USB 3.0 will offer no "real world" advantages to USB 2.0,so the answer is "just get a PCIe interface",and THAT is where I come in,as I find there are very few PCIe interfaces that include an "all in one" solution[conversion/MIDI/Pre's-XLRx2]so,an RME HDSPe looks good,but "what is the most cost efficient way to make use of the HDSPe if you only need 2 XLR ins"?
RK
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #37
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit ➑️
That's exactly WHAT,I was fishing for by mentioning the "almost bought" part,as I find it confusing,that RME don't offer an interface to plug into the HDSPe,that has MIDI,but more importantly XLR ins,as part of a mic pre setup,so it goes- HDSPe-Multiface[with XLR ins!].

I mean the whole point of this thread is IMO,about how/when are we going to see interfaces that are better than USB 2.0,by using USB3.0?,and as I understand,USB 3.0 will offer no "real world" advantages to USB 2.0,so the answer is "just get a PCIe interface",and THAT is where I come in,as I find there are very few PCIe interfaces that include an "all in one" solution[conversion/MIDI/Pre's-XLRx2]so,an RME HDSPe looks good,but "what is the most cost efficient way to make use of the HDSPe if you only need 2 XLR ins"?
RK
isnt it as i said? get a pcie card and a focusrite octepre?
Old 13th September 2012
  #38
Gear Addict
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Thunderbolt may not be added to an existing motherboard because it needs to be built in to the motherboard. Thunderbolt and Lightpeak are pretty much the same and will probably merge. There are no USB 3.0 interfaces yet, but RME will probably be the first to make one.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #39
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rksguit's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
isnt it as i said? get a pcie card and a focusrite octepre?
Well the Focusrite won't plug into an RME HDSPe,so you have to get an RME "Multiface" and then the Focusrite Octo,will plug into the Multiface.

What I'm asking is there must be a cheaper way of using a HDSPe card than having to ALSO buy,the Multiface,and THEN a Pre,like the Focusrite?

In Australia we are talking $2000 + for those 3 products,there must be a cheaper way to hook up an RME HDSPe?
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #40
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit ➑️
Well the Focusrite won't plug into an RME HDSPe,so you have to get an RME "Multiface" and then the Focusrite Octo,will plug into the Multiface.

What I'm asking is there must be a cheaper way of using a HDSPe card than having to ALSO buy,the Multiface,and THEN a Pre,like the Focusrite?

In Australia we are talking $2000 + for those 3 products,there must be a cheaper way to hook up an RME HDSPe?
under Β£1000 would be nice thats about 1400 aud
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #41
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit ➑️
That's exactly WHAT,I was fishing for by mentioning the "almost bought" part,as I find it confusing,that RME don't offer an interface to plug into the HDSPe,that has MIDI,but more importantly XLR ins,as part of a mic pre setup,so it goes- HDSPe-Multiface[with XLR ins!].

I mean the whole point of this thread is IMO,about how/when are we going to see interfaces that are better than USB 2.0,by using USB3.0?,and as I understand,USB 3.0 will offer no "real world" advantages to USB 2.0,so the answer is "just get a PCIe interface",and THAT is where I come in,as I find there are very few PCIe interfaces that include an "all in one" solution[conversion/MIDI/Pre's-XLRx2]so,an RME HDSPe looks good,but "what is the most cost efficient way to make use of the HDSPe if you only need 2 XLR ins"?
RK
I'm not up on the latest new products, but the Babyface is a new one that offers expandability and a lot of great features. The FF400 has what I think you want, too. Neither are PCI or PCIe.

I understand that some people want everything in one box. I am the opposite. I want all my pieces/parts separate so that I can upgrade single pieces without having to replace everything. So my rig has the RME HDSPe AES card as the hub. No converters, no pres, totally just an AES/MIDI interface. This is not the cheapest way to go, but it facilitates upgrading. My upgrades have taken me from budget converters and pres to Mytek converters, and John Hardy, Great River, Midas, ATI, DataMix, and many other pres. (The studio had 36 pres of all varieties, my home rig has only 8.) This was my choice. It took time to afford the upgrades, but I was not in a hurry.

If I were starting out and wanted a PCI solution with only 8 channels, I'd buy an RME AIO card and a Behringer ADA8000. If I wanted more channels in my future, I'd be looking at the RayDAT and a couple of ADA8000s. Updating converters and pres would be a future project, as the money came available. I would not be trying to buy into a Multiface, which is very old technology that still is viable but has to be nearing the end of it's lifespan.

oh, and I'd stop whining about USB this and Thunderjunk that, if I really wanted to get busy making music like thousands of others are doing quite successfully with solutions that exist today.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #42
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] ➑️
I'm not up on the latest new products, but the Babyface is a new one that offers expandability and a lot of great features. The FF400 has what I think you want, too. Neither are PCI or PCIe.

I understand that some people want everything in one box. I am the opposite. I want all my pieces/parts separate so that I can upgrade single pieces without having to replace everything. So my rig has the RME HDSPe AES card as the hub. No converters, no pres, totally just an AES/MIDI interface. This is not the cheapest way to go, but it facilitates upgrading. My upgrades have taken me from budget converters and pres to Mytek converters, and John Hardy, Great River, Midas, ATI, DataMix, and many other pres. (The studio had 36 pres of all varieties, my home rig has only 8.) This was my choice. It took time to afford the upgrades, but I was not in a hurry.

If I were starting out and wanted a PCI solution with only 8 channels, I'd buy an RME AIO card and a Behringer ADA8000. If I wanted more channels in my future, I'd be looking at the RayDAT and a couple of ADA8000s. Updating converters and pres would be a future project, as the money came available. I would not be trying to buy into a Multiface, which is very old technology that still is viable but has to be nearing the end of it's lifespan.

oh, and I'd stop whining about USB this and Thunderjunk that, if I really wanted to get busy making music like thousands of others are doing quite successfully with solutions that exist today.
could you recommend something better than the beringher because i looked at the specs and it will only do 44.1khz and the rme goes up to 192 khz.
also how do you connect the two? via spdif?
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #43
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
could you recommend something better than the beringher because i looked at the specs and it will only do 44.1khz and the rme goes up to 192 khz.
also how do you connect the two? via spdif?
ADAT can only do 8 inputs at 44.1 (), so that is kind of your limit. I suggest getting something like an Aurora 8 with USB 2.0. USB can easily support 8 ins and outs (trust me, I do it every day). If you need to expand, get another Aurora 8 and/or a PCIe interface like the RME AES32. If you can't afford that, then just get a USB interface, they work great.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #44
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rksguit ➑️
Well the Focusrite won't plug into an RME HDSPe,so you have to get an RME "Multiface" and then the Focusrite Octo,will plug into the Multiface.

What I'm asking is there must be a cheaper way of using a HDSPe card than having to ALSO buy,the Multiface,and THEN a Pre,like the Focusrite?

In Australia we are talking $2000 + for those 3 products,there must be a cheaper way to hook up an RME HDSPe?
RME HDSPe AIO card ($999) + Octopre ($549). Prices from turramurra music.

ADAT will do 8 channels at 44.1 OR has the potential to do 4 channels at 96khz. You need to check that the interface and micpre can both do 4 channels at 96khz ( I believe that is called SMUX mode).

There is no doubt that USB and firewire interfaces are popular right now, PCIe seems to have dropped by the wayside when it comes to the lower end of the market (although still popular with the high end).

Thunderbolt (and the Windows version thereof) will probably become more popular in the future and may overtake USB and firewire at some point (1,2 maybe 3 years, who knows) when it comes to audio interfaces. USB 3 could be completely bypassed.
Old 13th September 2012
  #45
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
USB 3 is more than fast enough to do most things audio. I would not buy a new interface until the next generation come out over the next year. It's all poised to change big-time with lots of current stuff becoming obsolete.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #46
Gear Addict
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson ➑️
USB 3 is more than fast enough to do most things audio. I would not buy a new interface until the next generation come out over the next year. It's all poised to change big-time with lots of current stuff becoming obsolete.
Nothing will become obsolete. USB 3 is backwards compatible, Thunderbolt has an adapter for FW, and desktops will always have at least one PCIe slot.
Old 13th September 2012
  #47
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
id like to keep 192 khz the only one that does that is the rme octa mic 2
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #48
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rksguit's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson ➑️
I would not buy a new interface until the next generation come out over the next year. It's all poised to change big-time with lots of current stuff becoming obsolete.
This statement is "highly intriguing",as if anyone is in the know,about what's going to happen in the near future,it would be YOU Bob! THANKS!
RK
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #49
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
could you recommend something better than the beringher because i looked at the specs and it will only do 44.1khz and the rme goes up to 192 khz.
also how do you connect the two? via spdif?
I recommended the Behringer (which will also do 48k) because most people seem to be working at 44.1 or 48k and a $250 product that brings as many features to the table, though entry level quality, is usually looked upon as a good thing. You want to work at 192, you are going to end up paying a lot more money for a multichannel setup. The Babyface will SMUX the ADAT lines wherein I suggested the Behringer ADA8000... 8 lines at 44.1/48 become 4 lines at 88.2/96k, etc. But you'll need converters to handle these rates.

So how many channels of 192 input and output do you need?
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #50
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Bob and I do not often disagree, but one has to consider what your needs are and how willing you are to let a manufacturer freeze you in place while you wait for them to bring a viable product to market. Notice I said VIABLE. Because in my experience, should a manufacturer actually release the product on time... a very rare occurrence... version 1.0 is not the version that you want to own.

The future will always bring better products, so you can always wait for a better product... on that basis you never have to buy anything. But you also never get anything done. If you have NO rig now and you need to get work done, you need to buy the tools and get work done now. It will be as viable tomorrow as it is today, so if it fits your needs today it will fit them tomorrow, no matter what the newest whizz-bang thing is released. If you've got working tools, maybe it would be prudent to wait.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #51
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rksguit's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] ➑️
Bob and I do not often disagree, but one has to consider what your needs are and how willing you are to let a manufacturer freeze you in place while you wait for them to bring a viable product to market. Notice I said VIABLE. Because in my experience, should a manufacturer actually release the product on time... a very rare occurrence... version 1.0 is not the version that you want to own.

The future will always bring better products, so you can always wait for a better product... on that basis you never have to buy anything. But you also never get anything done. If you have NO rig now and you need to get work done, you need to buy the tools and get work done now. It will be as viable tomorrow as it is today, so if it fits your needs today it will fit them tomorrow, no matter what the newest whizz-bang thing is released. If you've got working tools, maybe it would be prudent to wait.
All very true,and I do need something better NOW!

The Babyface is STILL the winner here,as it also has ADAT,for expansion with said ADA8000,and no other[that I can think of,apart from UC UCX UFX] USB interfaces have Actual ADAT,SPDIF yes,but not ADAT.
RK EDIT: This is what will tide me over until Bob Ohlsson's "prediction" of a "soon to be-New World Order of Audio Interfaces http://http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/FCA610.aspx ha ha,can't be too careful now,blowing wads of cash,if something NEW is around the corner!,and I'm pretty sure I don't need to record harmonics up to 90KHz[192KHz]for the dogs,and rodents of this world!
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #52
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DAW PLUS's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson ➑️
USB 3 is more than fast enough to do most things audio. I would not buy a new interface until the next generation come out over the next year. It's all poised to change big-time with lots of current stuff becoming obsolete.
It is. But you said that in 2009 already and so far USB3 is ignored by all audio manufacturers.
The bandwidth is not required. USB2 is preferred above USB3 by cross-platform manufacturers as long as Apple does not implement USB3.
Unless there is a latency advantage possible with USB3, I don't see many interfaces coming with this connection - maybe some interfaces with more than 48 I/O.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #53
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
192...... Eine Kleiner BatMusik.....
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #54
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] ➑️
I recommended the Behringer (which will also do 48k) because most people seem to be working at 44.1 or 48k and a $250 product that brings as many features to the table, though entry level quality, is usually looked upon as a good thing. You want to work at 192, you are going to end up paying a lot more money for a multichannel setup. The Babyface will SMUX the ADAT lines wherein I suggested the Behringer ADA8000... 8 lines at 44.1/48 become 4 lines at 88.2/96k, etc. But you'll need converters to handle these rates.

So how many channels of 192 input and output do you need?
well i dont need them as of yet i just want the option of having them so i dont need to upgrade when i do need them it saves money.

ideally id like to have all 8 or all of my mic pres to be able to do 192 if i was getting a 192 card it would be crap if it did less
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #55
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzu ➑️
well i dont need them as of yet i just want the option of having them so i dont need to upgrade when i do need them it saves money.

ideally id like to have all 8 or all of my mic pres to be able to do 192 if i was getting a 192 card it would be crap if it did less
Have you carefully considered this need for 192? Do you know anyone using 192, do you have a delivery system for 192, do you have clients clamoring for 192? I'm not trying to discourage you, just make you examine your needs verses your expenditures. My rig? I settled on 96, 8 years ago or more. i am pretty much the only 96k client that I have. Everyone else wants at the most 48k. So I've got an RME AES (instead of ADAT, because AES will handle full bandwidth on all channels without requiring any sort of SMUX/reduction of channel numbers) setup that I appreciate, but only a handful of others have ever needed. Plus, the latest/greatest converter movement is toward 384, so 192 is now officially 'old hat'.

Anyway, if you want multichannel 192 you probably don't want an ADAT solution, you probably want something like either AES or MADI, and I would be looking at RME as the card, with Mytek or Lynx as converters. But given the discussions you've been presenting, I think you're not looking at what you need for the work that you have, you seem to just be looking to try to make something very high end on a shoestring budget for reasons of which I am unclear. Perhaps if you described the work that you do, we could aim you towards a better solution than what has been recommended so far, something that will be of use to you for the foreseeable future that will not break the bank building a rig with unused capabilities.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #56
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] ➑️
Have you carefully considered this need for 192? Do you know anyone using 192, do you have a delivery system for 192, do you have clients clamoring for 192? I'm not trying to discourage you, just make you examine your needs verses your expenditures. My rig? I settled on 96, 8 years ago or more. i am pretty much the only 96k client that I have. Everyone else wants at the most 48k. So I've got an RME AES (instead of ADAT, because AES will handle full bandwidth on all channels without requiring any sort of SMUX/reduction of channel numbers) setup that I appreciate, but only a handful of others have ever needed. Plus, the latest/greatest converter movement is toward 384, so 192 is now officially 'old hat'.

Anyway, if you want multichannel 192 you probably don't want an ADAT solution, you probably want something like either AES or MADI, and I would be looking at RME as the card, with Mytek or Lynx as converters. But given the discussions you've been presenting, I think you're not looking at what you need for the work that you have, you seem to just be looking to try to make something very high end on a shoestring budget for reasons of which I am unclear. Perhaps if you described the work that you do, we could aim you towards a better solution than what has been recommended so far, something that will be of use to you for the foreseeable future that will not break the bank building a rig with unused capabilities.
my current situation is that i have a foucsrite 18i6 with 2 mic pres and 8 ins. i need more mic pres for more tonal options on redording guitar cabinets and possibly drums at a later date. i want something that doesnt have the latency issues i have now the (clicks and pops) im running a laptop that doesnt have firewire. the only other solution is getting another computer which i currently dont have the money for yet. so im looking for alternatives to usb because so far its not giving a good performance.
Old 13th September 2012 | Show parent
  #57
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
There should be a very significant latency improvement with USB3 and Thunderbolt over USB 2 and firewire..

Version 1.0 of hardware is usually pretty good while the version 1.0 drivers potentially need an almost immediate update. No manufacturer is going to release the hardware before there are motherboards that include this technology. Audio manufacturers simply can't afford a hardware recall.

Several years ago I was told by one that their USB 2 development was scrapped because they expected to see USB3 soon. Obviously it is only now beginning to roll out but there is no reason to think it won't be on every new computer within the next year. That's why my advice has been for people to hold off if you can because lower latency is always worthwhile.
Old 17th September 2012 | Show parent
  #58
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rksguit's Avatar
I just got a reply from "Behringer" that said these NEW FW/USB Interfaces,won't be released,until "maybe Early NEXT YEAR!!
Old 17th September 2012
  #59
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
They said "maybe next year" because USB3 built into computers will probably remain vapor ware until then.
Old 17th September 2012 | Show parent
  #60
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blim's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson ➑️
They said "maybe next year" because USB3 built into computers will probably remain vapor ware until then.
I'm not sure I understand. There are plenty of PCs out there that have "built-in" (i.e., on the motherboard) USB 3.0.
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